Should Pluto Be A Planet?
Aug 25, 2009 at 6:58 AM Thread Starter Post #1 of 22

roadtonowhere08

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Link: What's a planet? Debate over Pluto rages on - CNN.com

Text: For one of the farthest, coldest places in the solar system, Pluto sure stirs a lot of hot emotions right here on Earth.

It was three years ago Monday that the International Astronomical Union demoted Pluto from a planet to a dwarf planet, a decision that made jaws drop around the world.

An outcry followed, textbooks had to be rewritten, long-held beliefs were shattered, and many people felt our cosmic neighborhood just didn't seem the same with eight -- instead of nine --planets in the solar system.

Today, debate still rages over how to classify the little celestial body, along with others orbiting the sun, but the IAU stands by its definition.

"I think that most of the astronomical community has come to terms with the fact that we now know that the solar system has a continuous distribution of objects from very large down to very small," said Lars Lindberg Christensen, a spokesman for the IAU.

"We now know that what we call the different objects has to necessarily change with time."

Don't tell that to Plutophiles still seething about the decision. Some are even taking action.

Earlier this year, the Illinois Senate adopted a resolution declaring that Pluto was "unfairly downgraded" and restoring "full planetary status" to the celestial body as it "passes overhead through Illinois' night skies."

It also designated March 13, 2009, as "Pluto Day" in honor of the date that its discovery was announced in 1930. (In case you are wondering why the state is so passionate about Pluto: Clyde Tombaugh, who discovered the planet-now-dwarf-planet, was born in Illinois.)

Meanwhile, New Mexico's House of Representatives proclaimed February 18, 2009, as "Pluto is a Planet in New Mexico Day" and praised Tombaugh, who worked in the state for decades and died there in 1997.

Passionate about Pluto

Don't live in those states and want to make your voice heard? You can order "Plutophile" bumper stickers to proclaim your firm support for Pluto, print out a Pluto Fan Club card -- which allows you to declare, "In my heart, Pluto will always be a planet" -- or sign an online petition.

Christensen said 90 percent of the critical e-mails and letters the IAU received after its decision in 2006 came from North America.

Astrophysicist Neil deGrasse Tyson, director of New York City's Hayden Planetarium and author of "The Pluto Files," believes there are two reasons why Americans are so engaged in the issue.

"Disney's dog Pluto was sketched the same year the cosmic object was discovered. And Pluto was discovered by an American. So here you have a recipe for Americans falling in love with a planet that really is just a tiny ice ball," Tyson told Time magazine.

Still, astronomers are divided about the best way to classify Pluto. See photos of other planets and find out what makes them stand out »

At the heart of the matter lies the question: What makes a planet in the solar system?

According to the IAU's definition, it must orbit the sun, it must be big enough for gravity to crush it into a nearly round shape, and it must clear the neighborhood around its orbit. In other words, it must be dominant enough to clear away objects in its orbital space, according to NASA.

This last point is what proved to be Pluto's demise as a planet: There are other competing objects in its orbit.

Crowded solar system?

Some scientists say that part of the definition doesn't make sense.

"It's kind of like, I'm going to tell you what your car is on the basis of how the traffic around you is behaving," said Mark Sykes, director of the Planetary Science Institute.

The more logical way to classify planets is the geophysical definition, which simply states that planets are round objects that orbit the sun, Sykes argues. The objects must still be big enough so that gravity crushes them into a ball.

"The problem with the geophysical definition is we might have a couple of dozen planets in the solar system as more are discovered in the distant reaches," Sykes said.

He believes the International Astronomical Union's definition won't stick around after NASA spacecraft reach Pluto and Ceres, a Texas-size asteroid in an orbit between Mars and Jupiter that is now also classified as a dwarf planet.

"I think [the IAU's definition] is going to collapse by 2015 when the Dawn mission gets to Ceres and the New Horizons mission gets to Pluto because we're not going to see irregular-shaped, impact crater-filled, boring surfaces. We're going to see dynamic worlds," Sykes said.

The IAU's decision also came under fire because only 4 percent of its scientists participated in the vote that reclassified Pluto. But Christensen said the IAU was following its statutes and bylaws and has passed other resolutions in a similar way.

The subject of Pluto didn't come up at the IAU's general assembly earlier this month in Rio de Janeiro, Brazil, Christensen added.

Sykes countered that astronomers wanted to discuss the issue, just as they have at other recent major meetings, but the IAU didn't allow there to be any sessions on planet classification.

"I think the IAU did a terrible disservice to science, because it gives the public the impression that science is done by votes," Sykes said. "And that's not the way science is done at all."






I think that by reclassifying Pluto as a planet will really open up a can of worms regarding what else should be considered one. In my opinion, Pluto should have never been one. It was too hastily classified as one.

I do love the legislation introduced showing support for the poor rock. Apparently Illinois and New Mexico must have had a really slow day when it was enacted...
 
Aug 25, 2009 at 7:23 AM Post #2 of 22
Yes. It doesnt look like an asteroid to me, and the concept of the "mini-planet that isnt a planet" is just bullcrap. The concept of a planet being "special" is absurd. To our knowledge most of them are just rocks with no life forms, much like pluto. Wheres the differential?
This has to be one of the biggest jokes in astronomy.

Size doesn't matter, its how you orbit
 
Aug 25, 2009 at 7:33 AM Post #3 of 22
Quote:

Originally Posted by MrOutside /img/forum/go_quote.gif
Yes. It doesnt look like an asteroid to me, and the concept of the "mini-planet that isnt a planet" is just bullcrap.


No, it's not an asteroid. It's a little ball of ice and dirt, among many such objects floating around in our solar system. Should we call them all planets, as long as they're roughly spherical, or "don't look like asteroids"? If Pluto didn't happen to have already been called a planet in the past, nobody would be pointing at it and saying, "gee, that particular, very unremarkable chunk of ice out there should really be designated a planet, because I like the number nine, and we could use another planet." Which is to say, there's nothing special about it. Why should it be called a planet?

No, Pluto should not be called a planet. Earth should also not be considered flat, since it isn't... no matter what people may have thought in the past.
 
Aug 25, 2009 at 7:39 AM Post #4 of 22
Quote:

Originally Posted by applaudio /img/forum/go_quote.gif
No, it's not an asteroid. It's a little ball of ice and dirt, among many such objects floating around in our solar system. Should we call them all planets, as long as they're roughly spherical, or "don't look like asteroids"? If Pluto didn't happen to have already been called a planet in the past, nobody would be pointing at it and saying, "gee, that particular, very unremarkable chunk of ice out there should really be designated a planet, because I like the number nine, and we could use another planet." Which is to say, there's nothing special about it. Why should it be called a planet?

No, Pluto should not be called a planet. Earth should also not be considered flat, since it isn't... no matter what people may have thought in the past.



Well I guess we should discredit all of the gas giants, because theyre just unremarkable chunks of gas.
And earth too, because its just a ball of water and rock and metal.
Mars too, its ice and dirt.
A celestial body following discrete orbit about a sun is good enough to be a planet. Many of those other objects do not orbit as distinctly as pluto. Dont be hatin'.
 
Aug 25, 2009 at 7:49 AM Post #5 of 22
Quote:

Originally Posted by MrOutside /img/forum/go_quote.gif
Well I guess we should discredit all of the gas giants, because theyre just unremarkable chunks of gas.
And earth too, because its just a ball of water and rock and metal.
Mars too, its ice and dirt.
A celestial body following discrete orbit about a sun is good enough to be a planet. Many of those other objects do not orbit as distinctly as pluto. Dont be hatin'.



Pluto has a tilted orbit, unlike the others. It also trades places with Neptune for furthest distance from the sun. Those are not planetary traits. We'll be done with the hatin' when you are done with the nostalgia
wink.gif
You are just going to have to accept the fact that Pluto is a sad excuse for gravitational accretion
evil_smiley.gif
 
Aug 25, 2009 at 7:50 AM Post #6 of 22
Who cares if it trades places with neptune as the furthest planet? Shape of the orbit doesnt matter, if its orbiting a sun in a discrete pattern then its a planet IMO. Would you discredit a celestial body orbiting a planet as a moon because its "just a chunk of ice and dirt"? Bye bye Io.
Pluto ftw.
The look on the faces of those astrologers (they are unqualified to be astronomers!) when our reptilian overlords fly down and blast us for dissing their rock!
 
Aug 25, 2009 at 7:59 AM Post #7 of 22
Quote:

Originally Posted by MrOutside /img/forum/go_quote.gif
Who cares if it trades places with neptune as the furthest planet? Shape of the orbit doesnt matter, if its orbiting a sun in a discrete pattern then its a planet IMO. Would you discredit a celestial body orbiting a planet as a moon because its "just a chunk of ice and dirt"? Bye bye Io.
Pluto ftw.
The look on the faces of those astrologers (they are unqualified to be astronomers!) when our reptilian overlords fly down and blast us for dissing their rock!



..."Ladies and gentlemen, I'd like to introduce our tenth planet: Halley's Comet"...

Chunk of ice and dirt - check
Orbits the sun at a discrete pattern (regardless of orbit shape) - check
Trades places with many planets for distance from sun - check


Did I miss any criteria?
 
Aug 25, 2009 at 8:02 AM Post #8 of 22
Nope.
I'll stop supporting pluto when you get over your nostalgia about Halley's Comet.
wink.gif

Youre stretching it a bit, though. Comets are distinctly different from pluto which is not so different from a planet.
 
Aug 25, 2009 at 8:14 AM Post #11 of 22
Quote:

Originally Posted by MrOutside /img/forum/go_quote.gif
Nope.
I'll stop supporting pluto when you get over your nostalgia about Halley's Comet.
wink.gif

Youre stretching it a bit, though. Comets are distinctly different from pluto which is not so different from a planet.



This is not a sports game where you root for the home team. Do you have any real evidence to support your claim that Pluto is a real planet and not something else? You keep harping about orbits and whatnot, but my reference to Halley's Comet shot right through that argument. Give me something rational...
 
Aug 25, 2009 at 11:50 AM Post #12 of 22
Yes - only because I dislike astronomy so much I wouldn't mind seeing all the astrophysicists bundled with the extra work of naming and studying all the other new hundreds of planets just past pluto.
 
Aug 25, 2009 at 1:50 PM Post #13 of 22
Pluto - it is what it is.
 
Aug 25, 2009 at 4:18 PM Post #15 of 22
Lets wait until the first actual landing on Pluto takes place and then decide. At least it has a real name. That's much better than most orbiting icy rocks in the solar system that are forced to be known by a crummy alpha-numeric like IR 36, or some such nomenclature that distinguishes icy rocks orbiting Sol.
 

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