[EFN]

Thanks guys. I was afraid that the long writeup will bore you down LOL!

imademymark & qusp:
It was a concious decision not to use "higher-end" headphones like the HD600 or AKG K701 during the review. I could have easily borrowed them from local Head-Fiers if I want to. Using less stellar sounding KSC-75 makes it less difficult to gauge the amp performance - then if indeed the KSC-75 ended up sounding hi-fi, then it must be the amp and source and not the innate refinement already built into the headphones.

On the other hand, the ER-4S is notoriously heavy to drive and the uber resolving capabilities will help a lot in digging out every single dirt if they exist in the amp+source

Lastly, for portable class amplifiers, I am not convinced yet that they can really drive high end headphones to their 100% capabilities like what a fully dedicated home amp can do. So sizing is crucial to get the best results. Let the portables drive portables and let the big amps drive the bigger cans.

 

[Remitrom]

Hmm. Sounds like there is a weak link . Your system is only as good as the weakest link will allow. Lisa Lovers dont scrimp.

 

[tstarn06]

Quote:

Originally Posted by rabor /img/forum/go_quote.gif Yup.. ..it got me to the point of trying to order one NOW.., but since Head-Direct has no stock & Babelfish/WorldLingo can't translate the important parts of headphile.co.kr - like register, I was wondering if anyone knows where else I could get meself one of these little babies. & Ofcoarse, nice read, great test..!

Long story short, but when I had to get my MB replaced (thanks Fang), he wrote me an email indicating that there is a sole builder of the MB in China, and the dude had to work longer hours at his real job, something along those lines. So as a result, Fang is having a hard time keeping them in stock, as the guy just can't build as many as he used to. Too bad, really. I may have mangled that info a but, but it's the gist of what Fang told me.

 

[EFN]

Quote:

Originally Posted by tstarn06 /img/forum/go_quote.gif Long story short, but when I had to get my MB replaced (thanks Fang), he wrote me an email indicating that there is a sole builder of the MB in China, and the dude had to work longer hours at his real job, something along those lines. So as a result, Fang is having a hard time keeping them in stock, as the guy just can't build as many as he used to. Too bad, really. I may have mangled that info a but, but it's the gist of what Fang told me.

Yes it's a pity that the MB builder have to juggle daytime work and build amps after in the night. I am thinking of contacting Fang to get the MB builder contact details. I think he deserve to know how good his amps are and with further feedbacks, I believe he can implement further changes which could potentially improve things for the better.

Right now I'd be happy if I can just know his name.

 

[ed lynch]

Thanks EFN great review, if that mb builder went into this full time he could probably give up the day job and concentrate on his talent full time, probably making even better amps, and also make a decent salary at the same time, ed.

 

[rabor]

Received this an hour ago:

Dear Rabor,

We will have minibox-e+ in 2 to 3 weeks.

Best,
Head-Direct Corporation

I guess there will be a waiting list aswell..

 

[lyricalmoments]

Quote:

Originally Posted by rabor /img/forum/go_quote.gif Received this an hour ago: Dear Rabor, We will have minibox-e+ in 2 to 3 weeks. Best, Head-Direct Corporation I guess there will be a waiting list aswell..

I would love to hear one to try it out

 

[qusp]

Quote:

Originally Posted by EFN /img/forum/go_quote.gif .........snip I could have easily borrowed them from local Head-Fiers if I want to. Using less stellar sounding KSC-75 makes it less difficult to gauge the amp performance - then if indeed the KSC-75 ended up sounding hi-fi, then it must be the amp and source and not the innate refinement already built into the headphones./snip

ummm that only half makes sense. i realize you could get better headphones if you wanted to. thats why I found it a little confusing. neither of the cans you used are capable of decent soundstage (a strength of the lisa III (maybe MB E as well I dunno) bass slam and bass texture are also missing to a degree.

Quote:

On the other hand, the ER-4S is notoriously heavy to drive and the uber resolving capabilities will help a lot in digging out every single dirt if they exist in the amp+source

I realize that, but they also do that at the expense of other missing elements like those mentioned above

Quote:

Lastly, for portable class amplifiers, I am not convinced yet that they can really drive high end headphones to their 100% capabilities like what a fully dedicated home amp can do. So sizing is crucial to get the best results. Let the portables drive portables and let the big amps drive the bigger cans.

hmmm that really doesnt mean much, as you would be using the same headphones with both amps; so even if the amp doesnt drive them to 100% potential like home amps (I agree they dont and neither should they be expected to and also many home amps dont either) but how close they get to achieving that yardstick is a good indication of the amps power; as well as all the other things I have mentioned above. especially when the lisa is noted as being a portable amp that gets as close as possible to getting '100%' performance (whatever that is) out of harder to drive headphones. to me; to not test this is to ignore a major drawcard of the amp/s also going out shopping for op-amps for the test, while is not a foul ball because that is a capability of the MB E is a touch of favoritism. hehe you can tell i'm a lisa owner LOL. just seems to me like you set the playing field a bit for your baby

as brad said a combination is only as strong as its weakest link and possibly the reason they perform so similarly with the cans you used is because you have reached the upper limits of those cans... with both amps. anyhow man i'll leave it there, because it is still a good review, it really is, just not really designed to show off the real strengths/weakness of the amps given their potential to perform in more than these arenas

 

[wuwhere]

Excellent comparison.

 

[paulybatz]

Well being a methodologist, there are several questions we have to raise. First it is a great start. However, we have to consider the experiment being conducted. Did you have a large enough sample of reviewers. I too agree about the phones, we can look at the graphs all day long but it does come down to volume levels and the ability of the amp to drive the phones too.

For example to get the same volume out of my D3 it has to be turned up to noon, Lisa is at 9 o'clock. For IEMs and low level phones the difference may be unrecognizeable but for full size phones I think there would be a notable difference for sure.

 

[EFN]

qusp & paulybatz:
I understand your concerns. But lets see this from another angle. BOTH amps were tested using the same cans and regardles what the tested headphones can and cannot do (limitations/weaknesses) will also be applied to the other amp yes? This is all about what the amps can do with what limitation that is in place.

The point is, with what is available from a random choice of headphones, the MiniBox-E+ and Lisa III will either drive them to the limit applicable to that headphones or hit the limit innate to the amps itself.

I know this will be hard to swallow for Lisa III hardcore loyalists that a unassuming cheap looking amp like the MiniBox-E+ can stand neck to neck to her in sonic capabilities. I personally do hope that the Lisa III can prove her superiority but it cannot be discarded that there's a possibility another amp from another make can scale up the ladder to perform as good as her - or even better.

The blind tests were a good method because we were able to judge without having our emotion and biasedness intercede with the facts. For the record, Tester2 and Tester4 are both PPL fans and owned a variant of PPAs in one way or another. Tester4 is a hardcore Car Hi-Fi junkie (you guys should see his car setup) and extremely well versed with high end sound. The blind tests allowed them to pass judgement without prejudice. In fact the reason that Tester4 asked for the 5th session is because he was surprised that his first session he preffered the sound of MiniBox-E+ when we revealed it to him.

As I meantioned earlier, I consider myself very lucky to have both amps in hand and let the amps speak for themselves.

 

[Kees]

What the test says is that for KSC75 the LisaIII is overkill. The Minibox E+ does equally well.

 

[mrarroyo]

EFN I loved the review, mostly because I love to see an inexpensive and small amp like the MiniBox-E+ do so well. I am so glad you took a chance w/ it because frankly it is a killer amp.

Best of luck.

 

[musicmaker]

EFN, thanks for taking the time to do this review. It was an enjoyable read.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kees /img/forum/go_quote.gif What the test says is that for KSC75 the LisaIII is overkill. The Minibox E+ does equally well.

Well said Kees.

I would like to try a miniBox-E+ someday with the recabled HFI-780 and Sennheisers someday

 

[imademymark]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kees /img/forum/go_quote.gif What the test says is that for KSC75 the LisaIII is overkill. The Minibox E+ does equally well.

yes that's exactly the point we're making i think.

if you search the forums you will find a picture of someone trying the B52s with the ibuds at jaben (mostly in jest of course). i was there and tried it too! it sounded, for abit like the yuins in terms of extension and tuning but for the most part, slightly weird.