[up late]

up late
Also used to think that we may be still missing something in those measurements. And then I read this https://m.reddit.com/r/headphones/comments/2les0b/reading_impulse_response_how_to_get_the_most_out/. It's all in those freaking lil wiggles . A more concise & precide guide on how to read that stuff would be very useful though.

i regard headphone measurements as indicative and avoid getting caught up with the technical minutiae. that stuff can do your head in.

 

[raband]

  lol I like your comparison, but at least cars you know when to expect their refresh or a redesign.  The HD800S just comes out of nowhere... It's like you think why they didn't do this a few years ago.  That "peak" was known for a long time.

 
 
The main thing that's causing confusion (other than the cable) is that it's a refresh, rather than a new model.
 
If they did it as per the 600-650 as a new model then there'd be a fair bit less mud, would be a lot clearer.
 
The fact that it's a minor update makes me hopeful that the price is actually going to surprise us.
 
They won't have needed to re-tool
 
They won't have needed to redesign - truth be told, it's probably just a labour of love from a couple of the engineers that knew the HD800 could/should have been better than it was and worked on it in their spare time after spending time with it and after listening to the communities. They ended up making the HD800 they loved and took it to management.
 
Management said yep - sales are slowing, we'll turn 2 of the 3 production lines over to your mod, keep selling the original on the other line. We still need to keep selling the original for another 3 years because of contractual agreements
 
Lawyers kicked up and said "We can't sell a new/same product in competition to the one we signed off on"
 
Marketing said "Lets differentiate it - lets add a cable"
 
Lawyers said "Yep - It's now a different product - doesn't cross product lines"
 
Sven signed off on it.

 

[prot]

Every time there's a new/updated model there's a % of people who bought at the wrong time.

Usually noticeable with cars - as soon as you buy one the mid model update is announced and the one you just bought gets heavily discounted.

The inclusion of the balanced cable is a bit confusing though - it's like they're bringing out the MKII Mustang with a trailer.

Pisses off those that just bought a Mustang.

Confuses those that wanted to buy a Mustang but hadn't thought of getting a trailer.

Doesn't help those who want a Mustang, but already have a trailer.

Might make a few who wanted a Mustang realise that they'd also like having a trailer.

Leaves the majority wondering how much the price tag is going to be.

That's why the best time to buy a HP is after mk2 is released . It's however quite hard to ignore the new shinny model .. and in the case of hd800, waiting 6+ years is just unrealistic.
Works quite well though if you like hifimans. Cars also get updated almost every year, that should be easy.

 

[rawrster]

  HD800 MSRP price just increased not long ago.  So lowering their price only goes back to their non inflated original price  It's probably part of their setup to slowly adjust the price for their HD800S...  anyhow, seems like they just screwed their HD800 customers by releasing HD800S.  Especially the new HD800 owners...

 
I bought a HD800 recently and don't feel slighted one bit. Most people do not buy the HD800 at MSRP. I could easily get a new HD800 at $1100 or so with warranty from a dealer or under 1k used in very good condition and the HD800 is one of the rare headphones where USA is more expensive than Europe. I'm not sure what the prices in other areas are like. There also isn't much on how much of an improvement over the HD800 this new headphone will be if any. Jude did mention in another thread that while it may be an improvement it may not be for others so it's a wait and see for me. Not everyone wants the newest model. 

 

[knowhatimean]

Flutes and pianos sound like the HD800 if you're on stage with them.

Flutes and pianos sound like the HD650 if you're in a mid-venue seat.

Both are "correct" headphones.  Just depends upon where you want to sit!

z

Yrah ,I know this is a few pages old , but I missed it !

I can't speak for the HD650 , but for the HD800 that "On Stage" perspective I can't really agree that it get even that correctly depending on how dynamically dense the Orchestation of the piece is. .

The HD800 voicing plays havoc with musical transients due to it's frequency contouring to make sure you're constantly hearing the "big picture". Headphone "Voicing" is taking upon itself to "Re-Orchestrate" what a Composer thought worked dynamic best for his composition.

While headphone voicing may be something that works well for some genres of music , it has the potential to trivialize some of the sound elements important to others ! While Senn isn't the only headphone maker who voices their cans for the benefit of the "Greater Masses" you would hope they would occasionally recognize that
they already have a new version of the HD800 by simply offering a driver only version of the HD800

They could call it the HD800ea (enhanced acoustics) version

 

[shabta]

Sennheiser Headphones, even the mid-fi ones last 15-20 years. We have seen all kinds of production issues with some of the newer headphone companies on headphones that cost over a grand! To make headphones that sound so good and last so long they do years of R&D. They have to source materials that they know they can support for many, many years. It is a sadly old fashioned philosophy.
 
It is interesting that so many people are slamming the honesty of Sennheiser when they say it is only a small improvement. It is already one of the best sounding cans on the planet, in some dimensions, the best.... Honesty should be celebrated not dismissed. Most of the differences that people rave about with DACs are not so big, in some cases quite small. yet if you read the forums people go on and on as if there are huge differences.

 

[jfoxvol]

  Sennheiser Headphones, even the mid-fi ones last 15-20 years. We have seen all kinds of production issues with some of the newer headphone companies on headphones that cost over a grand! To make headphones that sound so good and last so long they do years of R&D. They have to source materials that they know they can support for many, many years. It is a sadly old fashioned philosophy.
 
It is interesting that so many people are slamming the honesty of Sennheiser when they say it is only a small improvement. It is already one of the best sounding cans on the planet, in some dimensions, the best.... Honesty should be celebrated not dismissed. Most of the differences that people rave about with DACs are not so big, in some cases quite small. yet if you read the forums people go on and on as if there are huge differences.

Well said

 

[BobFiggins]

   
I bought a HD800 recently and don't feel slighted one bit. Most people do not buy the HD800 at MSRP. I could easily get a new HD800 at $1100 or so with warranty from a dealer or under 1k used in very good condition and the HD800 is one of the rare headphones where USA is more expensive than Europe. I'm not sure what the prices in other areas are like. There also isn't much on how much of an improvement over the HD800 this new headphone will be if any. Jude did mention in another thread that while it may be an improvement it may not be for others so it's a wait and see for me. Not everyone wants the newest model. 

 
Got mine from Meier Audio for $1160 brand new with warranty. Dealing with Jan was a great experience! The only difficult part was waiting for two weeks while it shipped overseas!

 

[Dadracer]

Sennheiser Headphones, even the mid-fi ones last 15-20 years. We have seen all kinds of production issues with some of the newer headphone companies on headphones that cost over a grand! To make headphones that sound so good and last so long they do years of R&D. They have to source materials that they know they can support for many, many years. It is a sadly old fashioned philosophy.

It is interesting that so many people are slamming the honesty of Sennheiser when they say it is only a small improvement. It is already one of the best sounding cans on the planet, in some dimensions, the best.... Honesty should be celebrated not dismissed. Most of the differences that people rave about with DACs are not so big, in some cases quite small. yet if you read the forums people go on and on as if there are huge differences.

+1

 

[raband]

   
Got mine from Meier Audio for $1160 brand new with warranty. Dealing with Jan was a great experience! The only difficult part was waiting for two weeks while it shipped overseas!

 
 
Can buy one in Australia now - brand new for $975 US dollars ($1350 AU sale advertised)
 
That's what's got me confused - our dollar has tanked, Senns were always RRP - never on sale, never discounted.
 
When we were at parity that would have been under $800 US dollars if bought now.
 
Same with the HDVD and HDVA's - we have them at prices the same as the US, but in $AU instead of $US

 

[TMRaven]

When Axel says the HD800S is only a little bit better, he's actually saying the 800S is '2000 dollars better' than the previous flagship.

 

[raband]

I think it's their way of fixing their flagship, without admitting there was a problem to begin with.
 
Am not tipping a price rise - same price, but with a cable. Existing one drops in price - to just above what it would cost if you bought it with a cable separately.

 

[TsukiNick]

I find the name of the headphone pretty annoying.  I'll have to say I have a Sennheiser HD800, instead of the sometimes used I own a pair of HD800s.  Even doing a google search for HD800S is a little elusive.

Yeah did anyone actually buy their HD800 at MSRP?  Hell I bought mine with an employee discount for ~$1000 USD (Not a huge discount by any means compared to what you can get them for from a lot of sellers but still good)

 

[SONYES]

While it is true that impacted earwax can really affect your hearing, I think it is wrong to say that a good cleaning every few months would help you hear better, that's a misconception that many people have. Our ears are designed to be self cleaning, and as such for the vast majority of people there is simply no need for routine ear cleaning, the wax production is more likely than not at a very Low level. Some people have a wax problem with copious amounts of wax production and this results in them needing regular suction sessions with the ENT Doctor, but please, for the others, don't start worrying about earwax, if it's there, you'll hear it enough that it's not simply a matter of music sounding not as good, but rather, having difficulty hearing in general. Cheers!

 



It is true that clean the wax in a while.
but .Of course a certain layer should be her but not specifically thick which directly impacts the hearing. I clean every few months depending on what I feel
- if my hearing is different and not acceptable in my stereo range different light frequencies - hear the right channel louder the left or the other way - and do not hear well the high or low. then going to a specialist and performs suction of excess material. - A few years ago I suffered severely unbalanced plays mostly on my left, but I solved the problem and since I enjoy better sound - the result of it i sold DENON 7000. And today I am so happy with the old and new HD800 My accordance Music


My age is close to 55 .
and every year I perform hearing tests.
And to date relative to my age, I hear and . I have a better hearing than the 20-30-year-old hearing test

 

[donthuang]

  When Axel says the HD800S is only a little bit better, he's actually saying the 800S is '2000 dollars better' than the previous flagship.

 
I don't think what's senns done in HD800s more than beyer done in T1 gen2.
 
But you know, the King always have more favor.