[magiccabbage]

   
 
Ever tried calling a spade a spade? Maybe Senny simply don't deserve the credit they get... and the HD800 is obviously overpriced. If it's not neutral, which currently it isn't, then to me it isn't worth a kick up the ass and i wouldn't give them $50 for it. They're playin ya. Ever heard of that?

 Not trying to step on any toes or disrespect the big boys, just explaining my mentality on the issue. Meaning, currently as the HD800 stands, if i was a billionaire and slept in a bed made of $100 notes notes it wouldn't make a twinkling of difference to me, i still wouldn't bother buying them. Give me neutral or go home, quite simple really...

your saying the HD800s aren't neutral? And what headphones do you use? 

 

[prot]

Ever tried calling a spade a spade? Maybe Senny simply don't deserve the credit they get... and the HD800 is obviously overpriced. If it's not neutral, which currently it isn't, then to me it isn't worth a kick up the ass and i wouldn't give them $50 for it. They're playin ya. Ever heard of that?h34r:  Not trying to step on any toes or disrespect the big boys, just explaining my mentality on the issue. Meaning, currently as the HD800 stands, if i was a billionaire and slept in a bed made of $100 notes notes it wouldn't make a twinkling of difference to me, i still wouldn't bother buying them. Give me neutral or go home, quite simple really...

100% with you. Actually wont even take the ootb version as a gift because they put needles in my ears after ~20 mins. Quite literally
The anax mod helps and with a smooth amp and some EQ they are actually quite wonderful. Wont pay $1000+ though for something that I have to mod from the very start.

And for magiccabbage, no the hd800 are not neutral. The subbass is kinda missing and the highs have at least one huge spike. This doesnt have anything to do with my ears & highs sensitivity, just look at any FR graph. The latest hd650 are a lot closer to neutral. And my neutral reference is 009. He560 is also quite close to neutral for me. I would say the ethers & dharmas too but I only had short listening sessions with those.

 

[sikki-six]

I guess the 800's are too bright to be called neutral. 600's are probably the most popular open headphone for professionals, for a good reason. Not perfect, but close enough to neutral for trained ears.

 

[TMRaven]

Funny how the dark-loving Bob Katz found the modded HD800 to be pretty nice at big sound, while shunning off the likes of Ether, HE-1000 and SR-009 as being bright and for deaf people.

 

[magiccabbage]

100% with you. Actually wont even take the ootb version as a gift because they put needles in my ears after 10-20 mins. Quite literally

The anax mod helps and with a smooth amp and some EQ they are actually quite wonderful. Wont pay $1000+ though for something that I have to mod from the very start.

And for @magiccabbage, no the hd800 are not neutral. The subbass is kinda missing and the highs have at least one huge spike. This doesnt have anything to do with my ears & highs sensitivity, just look at any FR graph. The latest hd650 are a lot closer to neutral. And my neutral reference is 009. He560 is also quite close to neutral for me. I would say the ethers & dharmas too but I only had short listening sessions with those.

Don't agree there at all - the HD650 and HE 560 being more neutral... crazy talk. Cant say the same for 009 because i never heard it. 
 
The HD650 is so far from being neutral when compared to HD800. They are just a dark sounding headphone - really dark
 
When you say that your neutral reference is 009 do you own a pair? 

 

[jfoxvol]

650s aren't so much dark as the 800 is like an ice pick in the forehead bright.  I almost bought a set but I find no endgame in the ability to hear flies ****ing in the corner of the studio where the performance was recorded.
 
If they tame them a tad...perhaps.  Who knows.

 

[shabta]

I guess the 800's are too bright to be called neutral. 600's are probably the most popular open headphone for professionals, for a good reason. Not perfect, but close enough to neutral for trained ears.

These days a lot of the classical audiophile stuff in Europe is done with HD800s... 

 

[kapanak]

Dark and bright is completely subjective and depends on your previous experience with Hi-Fi, types of music you listen to and how your pair of ears is designed.

 

[sikki-six]

650 is much less neutral than 600, that mid-bass is just much too pronounced. This makes them too warm to hear the treble details as well as the 600's. Nothing wrong with loving that warmth for pleasure, though.

 

[jfoxvol]

  Dark and bright is completely subjective and depends on your previous experience with Hi-Fi, types of music you listen to and how your pair of ears is designed.

That was kind of what my jest was implying.  I own a pair of T1s that suffers from similar treble issues.  I can't use it for many recordings.  For some, it is simply magical.  I bought it on sale and use it on occasion.  For me, an HD800 would be similar.  When it works, it works great.  When it doesn't, whoa Nelly.

 

[sikki-six]

These days a lot of the classical audiophile stuff in Europe is done with HD800s... 

Yeah, that might be. I'm more familiar with rock/pop/metal producers.

 

[skeptic]

650 is much less neutral than 600, that mid-bass is just much too pronounced. This makes them too warm to hear the treble details as well as the 600's. Nothing wrong with loving that warmness for pleasure, though.

 
Conversely though, hd600's have a hump at 3k within the range of fundamental frequencies of many acoustic instruments.  I don't know about you, but I love having a violin suddenly get way louder than it should according the the source media as it goes up a high run.  /sarcasm  I'll take a mid-bass hump over that any day.  

 

[derbigpr]

  These days a lot of the classical audiophile stuff in Europe is done with HD800s... 

 
A lot of the best recording labels use HD800's as mixing headphones.

For example: http://www.soundliaison.com/studio-showcase-series/38-thousand-shades-of-blue
 
These guys make some of the best sounding stuff out there, and it's a good enough headphones for them.
 
Oh, and while we're at it, automatically ignoring headphones just because they're not "neutral" is extremely ignorant. Without going deeply into it, there's no such thing as a perfectly neutral headphone on the market, because we're still far off from finding a perfectly neutral target curve. On top of that, perfectly neutral doesn't mean the best sounding, especially not on headphones. Some prefer a brighter sound, some prefer a darker sound, etc. That's up to personal preference, but what isn't up to personal preference is the technical ability of a headphone and it's resolution, and the ability to play and separate the smallest details in the recording, and in that regard nobody can deny how good the HD800 is.

 

[shabta]

Yeah, that might be. I'm more familiar with rock/pop/metal producers.

It is true that if I was mixing the highly compressed music the way most modern rock/pop/metal is done these days I would probably wouldn't use HD800s. But that  wouldn't be because the HD6xx are more accurate...

 

[rayfalkner]

The HD650 is so far from being neutral when compared to HD800. They are just a dark sounding headphone - really dark

 
Older HD650 does get that darker sound quality hence the veil.
The more current production (silver screen drivers) fixes that and makes it only tilted slightly toward darker presentation (how slight will be very subjective but definitely not 'really dark'). Warm signature is the appropriate word to describe it but whatever suits your fancy.