[Sajid Amit]

Love the sound of my 800S via my Manley Audio Labs 300B Neo-Classic pre. Pricey but an incredible, powerful and viscerally organic preamp that can be paired with very high-end components both upstream and downstream. I can't see any scenario when I'll ever want to upgrade. 300B valves really are magical.

This one’s a looker.

 

[dadracer2]

Love the sound of my 800S via my Manley Audio Labs 300B Neo-Classic pre. Pricey but an incredible, powerful and viscerally organic preamp that can be paired with very high-end components both upstream and downstream. I can't see any scenario when I'll ever want to upgrade. 300B valves really are magical.

I think that was the recommended amp of David Mahler who did the massive flagship headphone comparison all those years back.

 

[Gazza]

I think that was the recommended amp of David Mahler who did the massive flagship headphone comparison all those years back.

I do vaguely recall that. I'm thinking of doing a full upgrade of all of the tubes (I have Sophia Electric 300Bs at the moment but they're quite old) but finding which is best is a headache. I'm definitely going for the new Western Electric 300Bs but trying to work out which 6SL7(GT) valves to match that are of commensurate quality (plus OD3 & 5AR4 for the regulator and rectifier respectively) is bewildering.

 

[111MilesToGo]

Thanks to all comrades providing input for me, starting from my post two pages back (https://www.head-fi.org/threads/sen...ost-for-summary.795365/page-473#post-16852786).

My take is: (1) Tube amps are serious pieces of equipment and serious investments, but (2) very worthwhile to own. (3) There is no uniform ”tube character“ beyond the very superficial first impression, and the differences provide for good to magnificent synergies. (4) One should be aware that tubes can be temperamental, which might involve further maintenance costs. (5) Supply chain issues both due to the pandemic and the war impact all life, tube amps being no exception, but actually hit badly due to Russia as tube manufacturing country. Actually, one feels a bit ashamed thinking of such ”problems“ in a time where all hell has opened to mankind.

Personally, I think I will go for the recommended tube amp auditioning venture; will be fun if it will be possible due to pandemic rules. You have provided me with good insight such that I can approach dealers with some necessary background. Maybe I might get myself a tube amp when a good reason for a big treatment comes along.

On the other hand, I have another project route to venture along: Recently, I got a good overhaul of my 30 year old Linn LP12 turntable including a new pickup. Turns out an investment into a new phono preamp is ”necessary“, since the sound of my old Japanese preamp (same 30 yrs, Rotel RHQ 10 Michi Series) is not to my liking anymore, although it is fine on its own. Anyway, getting back to new and old vinyl records is great fun!

 

[dadracer2]

I do vaguely recall that. I'm thinking of doing a full upgrade of all of the tubes (I have Sophia Electric 300Bs at the moment but they're quite old) but finding which is best is a headache. I'm definitely going for the new Western Electric 300Bs but trying to work out which 6SL7(GT) valves to match that are of commensurate quality (plus OD3 & 5AR4 for the regulator and rectifier respectively) is bewildering.

I am working on a similar game plan for my HA300. Luckily I only have 2 valves to consider, the 6SN7 and the 300B as the rectifier valves are already the only ones available (22DE4). As I am not an expert on valves I took some advice and the common wisdom suggested that changing the 6SN7 (or 6SL7 in your case) first will make more of an impact on the final sound than changing the 300B as they are earlier in the signal path. It is bewildering though and there seem to be more opinions than people on this whole forum. Good luck!

 

[sp33ls]

I think you'll find that the general consensus is the earliest stages of amplification make the biggest sonic differences. Thus driver tubes tend to.be what's recommended as the starting point for tube rolling, followed by the power tubes afterwards.

But c'mon, those in this hobby can't stop at just one.

 

[dadracer2]

Thanks to all comrades providing input for me, starting from my post two pages back (https://www.head-fi.org/threads/sen...ost-for-summary.795365/page-473#post-16852786).

My take is: (1) Tube amps are serious pieces of equipment and serious investments, but (2) very worthwhile to own. (3) There is no uniform ”tube character“ beyond the very superficial first impression, and the differences provide for good to magnificent synergies. (4) One should be aware that tubes can be temperamental, which might involve further maintenance costs. (5) Supply chain issues both due to the pandemic and the war impact all life, tube amps being no exception, but actually hit badly due to Russia as tube manufacturing country. Actually, one feels a bit ashamed thinking of such ”problems“ in a time where all hell has opened to mankind.

Personally, I think I will go for the recommended tube amp auditioning venture; will be fun if it will be possible due to pandemic rules. You have provided me with good insight such that I can approach dealers with some necessary background. Maybe I might get myself a tube amp when a good reason for a big treatment comes along.

On the other hand, I have another project route to venture along: Recently, I got a good overhaul of my 30 year old Linn LP12 turntable including a new pickup. Turns out an investment into a new phono preamp is ”necessary“, since the sound of my old Japanese preamp (same 30 yrs, Rotel RHQ 10 Michi Series) is not to my liking anymore, although it is fine on its own. Anyway, getting back to new and old vinyl records is great fun!

That's the benefit of this forum, as someone has probably already faced the issues you have and is happy to help.

Ah yes the LP12. I remember it from the early days. My elder son lives about 10 miles from the factory! Good luck as they need a lot of attention. A good phono amp will be very worthwhile. Are you using a MM or MC cartridge?

 

[dadracer2]

I think you'll find that the general consensus is the earliest stages of amplification make the biggest sonic differences. Thus driver tubes tend to.be what's recommended as the starting point for tube rolling, followed by the power tubes afterwards.

But c'mon, those in this hobby can't stop at just one.

It's ok I'm not suggesting stopping at one, just some prudence in taking each step. It's very easy to get drawn by the voluptuousness of the 300B...

 

[111MilesToGo]

That's the benefit of this forum, as someone has probably already faced the issues you have and is happy to help.

Ah yes the LP12. I remember it from the early days. My elder son lives about 10 miles from the factory! Good luck as they need a lot of attention. A good phono amp will be very worthwhile. Are you using a MM or MC cartridge?

Yes, good old LP12. My 30 years old one is the basic model. I was lucky since the Akito tone arm still is in good shape, no replacement necessary. Replacements and maintenance just for the subchassis springs, the oil etc, and the dust cover holders. My new cartridge is MM, Audio Technica VM 760 SLC, chosen for its special needle shape, light high-strength magnet, and budget. Audio Technica reportedly provides better value for a price than Ortofon. Of course, I am aware that better options exist, but that would take a new tone arm first. And I know of a certain FR rise at the top end which ATH is ”famous“ for. But now a new phono preamp first. The name of the game always is the same, A leads to B leads to C … As long as there‘s fun along the way …

 

[dadracer2]

Yes, good old LP12. My 30 years old one is the basic model. I was lucky since the Akito tone arm still is in good shape, no replacement necessary. Replacements and maintenance just for the subchassis springs, the oil etc, and the dust cover holders. My new cartridge is MM, Audio Technica VM 760 SLC, chosen for its special needle shape, light high-strength magnet, and budget. Audio Technica reportedly provides better value for a price than Ortofon. Of course, I am aware that better options exist, but that would take a new tone arm first. And I know of a certain FR rise at the top end which ATH is ”famous“ for. But now a new phono preamp first. The name of the game always is the same, A leads to B leads to C … As long as there‘s fun along the way …

I know how you feel. I had a Roksan Xerxes for over 32 years from new. If you are using an MM cartridge then getting a good phono stage should be easier and less expensive than an MC one at least.

 

[111MilesToGo]

Ah, to expand a little further on ”valve amps 101“: Incidentally, @Andykong (Cayin) had recently written up a brief general introduction here:
https://www.head-fi.org/threads/mez...-array-headphone.960638/page-60#post-16758280

 

[helljudgement]

It seems to be common knowledge that these cans - in particular the HD 800 S - do gain considerably from a tube amp.

I‘d like to simply ask which tube amps you could really recommend for these cans from your experience. What tube amp principles - with transformers or OTL, single ended triode or others? I mean to ask for ideas and points / criteria to consider.

My ideal tube + headphones sound? Not much of an idea yet. Guess auditioning should develop a feeling. But I think I can ask here even before such rounds. When my searches will have settled, sound quality and immersion into the music will be the primary decision driver.

As with most gear the best way to get a feel of it is to go try it out which can be difficult especially when the gear is niche which headphone tube amps are. Another alternative is to get one off the second hand market which tend to be cheaper and may come with additional tubes. Given your limited exposure to tubes this is probably the best method for you at the moment. I've mostly resorted to blind buying my amps in recent years due to the lack of places to try tube headphone amp so I understand the frustration of trying to venture into new gear.

At your budget you can certainly look at boutique options like DNA, Eddie Current, Woo audio or Ampsandsound. I personally use DNA and Eddie Current with my hd800. But I'd recommend getting into cheaper tube amps to get a feel of how tube differ from solid state before splurging. The Schiit Vali and Valhalla are certainly great options to start with. I've heard and owned earlier versions of schiit amps over a decade ago and find they sound great. The original Vali is one of my favorite amp with hd600-800 and I used it for years before jumping on DNA and EC amps.

 

[thefitz]

The Schiit Vali's not what I would refer to as a "tube amp". It's a solid state amplifier with a tube in the preamp, as is Lyr. The Valhalla is a proper tube amp.

 

[cavedave]

Hey guys have not posted in some time thought I would throw this in for the ones with the HD800s. I use the Burson conductor XP with mine but more then that and probably something most won’t want to do. But I replaced the little wires inside the headphone that go from the connector to the tabs on the speakers. I used some 24awg cardas wire and the difference is just wonderful. I have tried different cables and amps and nothing transformes these headphones as much. No brightness at all now. Perfect with any cable even the stock one. Those little wires do more to hold these back then any mod I have heard of and almost nobody talks about it that I know of. Well worth the little effort it takes to do it.

 

[dadracer2]

Hey guys have not posted in some time thought I would throw this in for the ones with the HD800s. I use the Burson conductor XP with mine but more then that and probably something most won’t want to do. But I replaced the little wires inside the headphone that go from the connector to the tabs on the speakers. I used some 24awg cardas wire and the difference is just wonderful. I have tried different cables and amps and nothing transformes these headphones as much. No brightness at all now. Perfect with any cable even the stock one. Those little wires do more to hold these back then any mod I have heard of and almost nobody talks about it that I know of. Well worth the little effort it takes to do it.

Can you send a photo? What did you find to be the main differences?