[plin]

Quote:

For the HD650, I think balanced has a greater effect than the cable itself, therefore it is more worthwhile to switch to balanced configuration than just upgrading the cable imo.
 
Based on earlier comments, I tried to terminate the stock cable to balanced just to experiment. But I had the hardest time. It was like the wires were solder repellent. The interesting part was the part of the wires were died in red and green color i guess to indicate channel. Has anyone successfully balanced the stock cable? Could've been my iron or me just having a bad day I guess.

The cable used in HD-650 is  a true litz wire. Every single strand is isolated. The isolation layer is indeed 'solder repellent'. You may succeed removing isolation with high temperature soldering, but it is not easy. Color indicates polarity (+ or -  signal).
 
 

 

[SemiAudiophile]

Quote:

The cable used in HD-650 is  a true litz wire. Every single strand is isolated. The isolation layer is indeed 'solder repellent'. You may succeed removing isolation with high temperature soldering, but it is not easy. Color indicates polarity (+ or -  signal).
 
 

aha! that explains it. is there another way to remove the isolation? i don't feel like buying a higher wattage iron. Also do you remember the color coding on the wires? I assumed red meant right positive, green for left positive and the others for ground.
 
edit: I think I found a helpful link to remove the isolation: http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=593024 I'm gonna try it when I get home

 

[plin]

Quote:

Also do you remember the color coding on the wires? I assumed red meant right positive, green for left positive and the others for ground.
 
edit: I think I found a helpful link to remove the isolation: http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=593024 I'm gonna try it when I get home

There are 2 wires, each caries the signal of each channel. 
I remember only red and green. What are the other colors?
 
Helpful link indeed.
 

 

[SemiAudiophile]

The other colors are just plain copper. I think I figured it out after a few tries. Green is left positive, copper negative, while Red is right negative, copper positive. 
 
I first tried using a lighter to burn off the isolation, but that just ended up burning the wire itself making it very weak and hard to deal with. The wire itself is already very thin. Then I tried just using the iron and letting it burn off the isolation by leaving it on for a minute or so. This worked better and you can tell its ready when the solder starts to stick to the wire. 
 
So after this experiment, I found that I was right; the stock cable sucks (in comparison to my silver plated copper wire). Switching back and forth, I found the stock cable to be un-involving and less musical in general. I felt like I had to concentrate and "listen harder" for details that I could easily hear with my spc cable. I find myself having to turn the volume knob up just to compensate for the loss. Stock cable sounded less airy, more congested/muddy, and in some ways more peaky, less smooth and coherent. The sounds coming out of it were portrayed as loose, flat, with less definition and dynamics. Making it appear dull and a less enjoyable overall experience.
 
A perfect example is listening to Diana Krall's Fly Me To The Moon, a song that I am pretty familiar with. With the stock cable, I have never been so bored listening to that song ever. 
 
My final opinion of the stock cable is that it really does not compliment the HD650 at all. In fact, it detracts from the performance of the HD650. I find that even a stock Grado cable sounds more transparent than this crap and is built better too. That is my 2 cents.
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Dogmatrix /img/forum/go_quote.gif
 
the stock cable is very good particularly in a single ended setup and I don't think a cable upgrade is good value without the switch to a balanced setup.

 
I agree to the 2nd part of that statement. If deciding on upgrading the cable, I would definitely go with a balanced cable with single ended adapter. If having to pick whether to choose a balanced stock cable or a upgraded single ended cable. I think I would still choose balanced stock cable, just because  going balanced helps take away that veiled effect and you get somewhat of a faster signature with less congestion and more air/space around instruments. Still a better cable will add upon by improving dynamic range and better definition. So it is kinda 50/50.
 
 

 

[Dogmatrix]

I think the whole debate highlights the real strength of the HD650 and that is its versatility, personally I have gone on a journey from $50 cmoy through hybrid tubes, full tubes to full balanced solid state with custom cable and enjoyed every minute. Even in a saturated market there are only a hand-full of headphones capable of such diverse application.
 
A note on cables. I was fortunate enough to work for a hi end speaker manufacturer for a couple of years and while I was there tests were conducted to establish the best type of wire for the speakers internal loom. In electronic testing the technicians could find no measurable difference on their test rigs. In the sound room, blind testing revealed a clear preference for silver plated copper. All internal looms were switched from OFC to Vanden Hul SPC.
 
The ears should always win the debate.

 

[purrin]

For those in this thread who may be interested: waterfall plot of the HD650.

 

[Satellite_6]

Quote:

For those in this thread who may be interested: waterfall plot of the HD650.

 
Wow. The K 601 actually looks a lot worse than I expected (I owned those) and you may the only one I've seen that measured a treble boost in the HD 650's - which is exactly what I hear - no darkness or veil. 

 

[Twinster]

Are you sure you got the cable wired properly?  Based on experience I would think the RED would be for right positive and the copper be the negative. That may explain why you didn't like it as much. 

 
Quote:

The other colors are just plain copper. I think I figured it out after a few tries. Green is left positive, copper negative, while Red is right negative, copper positive. 
 
I first tried using a lighter to burn off the isolation, but that just ended up burning the wire itself making it very weak and hard to deal with. The wire itself is already very thin. Then I tried just using the iron and letting it burn off the isolation by leaving it on for a minute or so. This worked better and you can tell its ready when the solder starts to stick to the wire. 
 
So after this experiment, I found that I was right; the stock cable sucks (in comparison to my silver plated copper wire). Switching back and forth, I found the stock cable to be un-involving and less musical in general. I felt like I had to concentrate and "listen harder" for details that I could easily hear with my spc cable. I find myself having to turn the volume knob up just to compensate for the loss. Stock cable sounded less airy, more congested/muddy, and in some ways more peaky, less smooth and coherent. The sounds coming out of it were portrayed as loose, flat, with less definition and dynamics. Making it appear dull and a less enjoyable overall experience.
 
A perfect example is listening to Diana Krall's Fly Me To The Moon, a song that I am pretty familiar with. With the stock cable, I have never been so bored listening to that song ever. 
 
My final opinion of the stock cable is that it really does not compliment the HD650 at all. In fact, it detracts from the performance of the HD650. I find that even a stock Grado cable sounds more transparent than this crap and is built better too. That is my 2 cents.
 
 
I agree to the 2nd part of that statement. If deciding on upgrading the cable, I would definitely go with a balanced cable with single ended adapter. If having to pick whether to choose a balanced stock cable or a upgraded single ended cable. I think I would still choose balanced stock cable, just because  going balanced helps take away that veiled effect and you get somewhat of a faster signature with less congestion and more air/space around instruments. Still a better cable will add upon by improving dynamic range and better definition. So it is kinda 50/50.
 
 

 

 

[SemiAudiophile]

I'm positive. I originally had Red for right positive, copper negative and found there was a channel imbalance. Switching them around made it sound normal.

 

[Twinster]

If you have a multimeter check if the second ring from the TRS 1/4 plug is the bigger plug from the cardas and compare with the first ring for the left side.
 

 
Quote:

I'm positive. I originally had Red for right positive, copper negative and found there was a channel imbalance. Switching them around made it sound normal.

 

 

[SemiAudiophile]

 
Quote:

If you have a multimeter check if the second ring from the TRS 1/4 plug is the bigger plug from the cardas and compare with the first ring for the left side.

I don't get what you mean. I re-terminated the stock cable to 4-pin balanced. I'm not using a TRS plug.
 
pin 1 = left positive
pin 2 = left negative
pin 3 = right positive
pin 4 = right negative

 

[Twinster]

Sorry my bad. I just find strange that they didn't kept the same standard by keeping the negative signal on the copper wire like the left side that's all.
 
Quote:

 


I don't get what you mean. I re-terminated the stock cable to 4-pin balanced. I'm not using a TRS plug.
 
pin 1 = left positive
pin 2 = left negative
pin 3 = right positive
pin 4 = right negative

 

 

[65535]

Larger pins are ground, connect them to the common (ground) which is the sleeve.
 
 

 

[BitterCold]

I live in the US and if I want to order a HD650 online, where is the cheapest place to order it?

 

[Hennyo]

ebay razerdogdeals