[HPiper]

 
I agree 100%. When playing back well recorded and well mastered music, you are in for a REAL treat. I too am in love with the 650. I am still in a bit of disbelief when I listen to them. It's like I am in shock that I actually own something that sounds this good! LOL!

 

 
I will even go one step further and say I am in shock that something this good exists at all. The technology to produce something so accurate is just amazing.

 

[cddc]

I found some of Gould's Beethoven performances a little odd. He was so eccentric with tempos and staccato playing, that he kind of lost the romance in some of the pieces, just imo though.

Bach's a different matter with him though.

I'm a synth player and my wife plays the piano. On electric, she loves the HD650 because the ids are so good.

 
Haven't heard Glenn Gould's Beethoven yet, but definitely dislike his Goldberg Variations, no matter on harpsichord or piano. Aria and Variation 1 sound so dull with him.
 
Pierre Hantai and Xiao-mei Zhu's Goldberg Variations sound way better than Gould's.

 

[Beatwolf]

   
I agree. I started with the STX and the HD650's. I was really enjoying this setup and then attended my first head-fi meetup. I then upgraded to a schiit bifrost (standard) and a valhalla 2. I first tried the valhalla 2 with the STX and immediately noticed how much more presence the whole setup had. Love the OTL designs with the 650 ( I have since listened to the BHC, Woo and a few others with the 650 and all are fantastic with their own little signature). Then I replaced the STX with the Bifrost and didn't notice much at the beginning. I do feel that after my ears and brain went through their burn in I did notice a difference.
 
Having said all that, I would definitely support your upgrade path; first the amp (a OTL if the 650's are your only HP, which i believe you stated they are) and then a multi-bit DAC. I am planning on sending my BF in for the multibit upgrade soon, if nothing more than to keep up with the new hotness, but also because I am running the original BF without the UBER, so I can skip all that nonsense and go straight to the MB revolution.
 
Good luck with your amp search!

Thanks for the input on that. Thought I would be finished for a little while searching for gear, after finally deciding on the 650s but apparently not... Which Schiit product would go well with the ST?

 

[Quinto]

   
Haven't heard Glenn Gould's Beethoven yet, but definitely dislike his Goldberg Variations, no matter on harpsichord or piano. Aria and Variation 1 sound so dull with him.
 
Pierre Hantai and Xiao-mei Zhu's Goldberg Variations sound way better than Gould's.

dull?

  I know it's a matter of taste but, I meant..DULL really?? wow..

 

[cddc]

   
dull?

  I know it's a matter of taste but, I meant..DULL really?? wow..

 
 
not to offend...but to me it's pretty rigid and dull...I have Gould's Goldberg Variations albums on both harpsichord and piano...but YMMV
 
just check out the following performers:
 
1. Pierre Hantaï
 

 
 
2. Zhu Xiao-Mei
 

 

[Sal1950]

Zhu looks like she's in pain?

 

[cddc]

  Zhu looks like she's in pain?

 
not sure...she's really into the music, i guess

 

[Quinto]

Can't stand harpsicord (understatement) myself..as for sustain pedal-Bach,.. for me it muffles the true beauty and genius of Bach's work, counterpoint, obviously Gould's strong point
 
One of the main attraction of music in general is of course the way everybody has it's own unique perspective/appreciation

 

[cddc]

  Can't stand harpsicord (understatement) myself..as for sustain pedal-Bach,.. for me it muffles the true beauty and genius of Bach's work, counterpoint, obviously Gould's strong point
 
One of the main attraction of music in general is of course the way everybody has it's own unique perspective/appreciation

 

 
 
To me harpsichord sounds pretty good, if memory serves I think The Goldberg Variations was written for harpsichord.
 
But I agree with you that "One of the main attraction of music in general is of course the way everybody has it's own unique perspective/appreciation. " 

 

 

[CanadianMaestro]

  Zhu looks like she's in pain?

I look like that when I listened to her Bach.
 

  Can't stand harpsicord (understatement) myself..as for sustain pedal-Bach,.. for me it muffles the true beauty and genius of Bach's work, counterpoint, obviously Gould's strong point
 

 
Harpsichord is a horizontal zitar, that's all LOL. Full-bodied piano for me. No compromise.

 

[Solrighal]

I'm far from a piano expert but clearly some of you guys are. Any thoughts on this beautiful (to me) album?
 
 
 
I think the HD 650 renders piano beautifully.

 

[iancraig10]

not to offend...but to me it's pretty rigid and dull...I have Gould's Goldberg Variations albums on both harpsichord and piano...but YMMV
 

Gould was a 'purist'. When Bach was alive, no pedal, no piano either. So to use pedal would change the character of the music in effect. Modern outlook has changed what Bach sounds like a lot, even down to tuning.

With each movement, the mood of the the piece would remain the same. Composers didn't look for changes of mood within each movement and speeds were approximate. There was no metronome to fix speeds. There was no real feeling of crescendo and diminuendo either, other than the music organically growing because of the texture.

That may well account for the idea that the music or performer is dull.

I often wonder what say, Baroque composers or even Mozart would say about modern performances of their work.

Harpsichords really don't play that loud live, and I have a feeling that we might well be listening too loud on recordings of them.

 

[CanadianMaestro]

^ I think Moz and Beeth would love modern perfs. Esp with modern pianos and full orchestras. Beeth lamented the limits of his fortepianos, and broke a few while composing his sonatas (think Hammerklavier!).
 
I have no doubt that if both were alive today, they would be using 650 as their monitor, and for their own personal enjoyment!

 

[iancraig10]

Beethoven busting his piano was more like due to him slowly becoming deaf!! I visited one of his houses in Vienna and he had the carpet taken out and sawed the piano legs off at one point just to make it louder.

I'm not sure that they'd appreciate modern 'romanticism' in performances. Music had developed as a 'craft' and had clear cut rules, but we tend nowadays to put a romantic bloom on many things that we play. They might have found modern instruments a bit aggressive as well.

I have a recording of even Stravinsky's period instruments from 1912. They are playing the Rite of Sping, and to be honest, it sounds more gutsy as a result of NOT having a modern aggressive sound. They had to play harder to get volume in a way whereas modern instruments are louder and tone has massively changed.

For instance, an oboe from Bach's time is almost unrecognisable if you compare to a modern oboe. (I play the one as well as synths) Classical oboes are closer to modern ones, but again, not as powerful.

So the balance in an orchestra compared to their time is very different.

Then again, if Mozart was alive now, he'd probably be writing for synthesisers, similar to the way that he wrote for piano and clarinet, which were both new inventions in his time.

Bach, I'm not sure about. Not sure how he'd find the 21st century and the changes to music.

 

[Arniesb]

Good job!  Took a while but sounds like you've really found the essence of the 650s
People speak of the "veil", on the 650 I respectfully disagree. To me "veil" would be a reference to missing information or info covered up. I don't find this to be the case, they are as revealing of inner detail that I could ever ask for. They do have a quality I would call euphony, in which they make some of my "not so good" sounding recordings gain a little more pleasantness but without removing any musical information. Don't know how to explain what they did, maybe it's in the tonal balance? But what I do know as you've read over and over here of people selling to upgrade only to come back and buy an new pair. Depending on taste true upgrades are hard and very expensive to come. The 650s were SOTA when released 12 years ago and have remained the can of choice for many owners ever since. I believe they will continue to please new owners for a long time into the future.

Sennheiser hd 650 is veiled with my Beyerdynamic A20 amp and not veiled with Fiio e12. I gotta say i love how organic and real HD650 sound with A20 when listening Adele, Lana del ray, Sam Smith or Indila, but hate how it sound with Top 40 hits or with a lots of energy. My Fiio E12 have more energy and is much faster and is better for Top 40 and similar music. Whould be nice to have Amp that has a bit of naturalness of A20 and energy of Fiio e12...