[Rob80b]

Wonder if they could beb compared to the hd800s?

Two different phones from two different eras and directives. Relatively speaking the HD600 series are your basic utilitarian allowing music to be enjoyed without amplified speakers or just as a basic monitoring device for musicians and a descent one at that. I believe Sennheiser's initial goal was just to produce a set of drivers that focused on proper timbre and sound reproduction without regard to all the other “audiophile” accoutrements such as staging width, height and depth, imaging, etc, etc. And like a good pair of pair of classic shoes, no real need to radically modify although there have been revisions over the last 20 years.
The HD800 on the other hand are an attempt to take headphone listening to a whole different level, to appease the audiophile and all that entails, staging width, height, depth, layering, etc, etc….the design was approached from a different perspective and from the ground up with regards to housing, driver, ear/canal interaction....trying to emulate or somewhat satisfy the experience when listening to a properly set up stereo system.

If we dont keep soundstage in mind?

Now having said that, yes there is no reason that both phones cannot reproduce and have similar tonal and timbre of the recorded musical event but the HD600 series cannot compete with HD800 series with regards to everything else, that would be wishful thinking.

 

[wantan]

Now having said that, yes there is no reason that both phones cannot reproduce and have similar tonal and timbre of the recorded musical event but the HD600 series cannot compete with HD800 series with regards to everything else, that would be wishful thinking.

Can the HD800 produce the weight and and body the same way the 600 series can? EQ allowed of course.

 

[Rob80b]

Can the HD800 produce the weight and and body the same way the 600 series can? EQ allowed of course.

I've the HD800S, but again 2 different perspectives, the HD600 series just by their closer proximity the the ear will produce a more dense concentrated sound, which most head-fiers prefer....the HD800 will recreate the same bass but the body will not be as intimate or full.
One cannot take the same approach when listening to both phones as it is almost apples to oranges.
For a bit more body and sound pressure while retaining the HD800 approach there's the HD820.

 

[haasaaroni]

I've the HD800S, but again 2 different perspectives, the HD600 series just by their closer proximity the the ear will produce a more dense concentrated sound, which most head-fiers prefer....the HD800 will recreate the same bass but the body will not be as intimate or full.
One cannot take the same approach when listening to both phones as it is almost apples to oranges.
For a bit more body and sound pressure while retaining the HD800 approach there's the HD820.

Yeah, that seems right to me. I find the 800(S) also doesn’t have the timbre the 600 series has. And I think it has a lot to do with that concentration of sound.

I personally only use my 8XX for orchestral recordings, while the 600 series for anything with vocals and small ensembles where timbral accuracy is at the forefront of my attention.

 

[Rob80b]

Yeah, that seems right to me. I find the 800(S) also doesn’t have the timbre the 600 series has. And I think it has a lot to do with that concentration of sound.

Relative to the Sennheisers..... for intimacy, warmth and bass impact the S2 all the way. : )
Although if not doing direct comparisons I'm more than content the majority of time with the HD800S.

I personally only use my 8XX for orchestral recordings, while the 600 series for anything with vocals and small ensembles where timbral accuracy is at the forefront of my attention.

Which is where I really came to liking the HD820, as a closed back they offer a bit of the missing link adding more texture and definition to the bass region. : )

 

[wantan]

I've the HD800S, but again 2 different perspectives, the HD600 series just by their closer proximity the the ear will produce a more dense concentrated sound, which most head-fiers prefer....the HD800 will recreate the same bass but the body will not be as intimate or full.
One cannot take the same approach when listening to both phones as it is almost apples to oranges.
For a bit more body and sound pressure while retaining the HD800 approach there's the HD820.

Great, thank you!
What amp/dac do you use for listening to the HD800s?
And where does the NDH30 fit into all this with HD660s2 and HD800s in your oppinion? I thought the NDH30 is a bit of the super HD650 everybody always wanted, it has the detail, bass and soundstage (not HD800 but still top notch) everybody wanted without being bright. But its loosing some of the magic, because of this.

I actually think this is all in the FR but measurements seem still to be unreliable especially in the treble and especially with angled driver designs. With different headphones you always get something and you also loose something, there is no real way "up".

 

[Rob80b]

Great, thank you!
What amp/dac do you use for listening to the HD800s?

Currently I've 2 main headphone stations, one with a Bryston BHA-1 headamp and a Cambridge CXN V2 and the other with a Sennheiser HDVD800 and a CXN V1, both with balanced connections from source to headphones. (sorry no PCs in the chain or provisions for applying EQ)

And where does the NDH30 fit into all this with HD660s2 and HD800s in your oppinion?

I've yet to own the Neumann NDH30 but have auditioned it twice but IMHO it does sit somewhere between the 2 Senns. It is using Sennheiser drivers and parts of a previous sennheiser housing (HD630VB) but tuned somewhat for professional use and said to emulate Neumann's own studio monitors.

 

[chesebert]

Great, thank you!
What amp/dac do you use for listening to the HD800s?
And where does the NDH30 fit into all this with HD660s2 and HD800s in your oppinion? I thought the NDH30 is a bit of the super HD650 everybody always wanted, it has the detail, bass and soundstage (not HD800 but still top notch) everybody wanted without being bright. But its loosing some of the magic, because of this.

I actually think this is all in the FR but measurements seem still to be unreliable especially in the treble and especially with angled driver designs. With different headphones you always get something and you also loose something, there is no real way "up".

HD6xx < HD650/HD600 < or = HD660S2 <<<< Clear < NDH30/Auteur Classic

This seems like the right pecking order to me.

800S has a completely different sound profile and cannot be reliably compared with the 6xxish sound profile without taking into account personal preference

 

[CaptainFantastic]

HD6xx < HD650/HD600 < or = HD660S2 <<<< Clear < NDH30/Auteur Classic

This seems like the right pecking order to me.

800S has a completely different sound profile and cannot be reliably compared with the 6xxish sound profile without taking into account personal preference

NDH30=560S<660S<660S2<650<600

 

[chesebert]

NDH30=560S<660S<660S2<650<600

Is that from your experience or you are going off the spec/review?

 

[CaptainFantastic]

Is that from your experience or you are going off the spec/review?

I did hear them all, but some not at the same time, I confess. Nonetheless, this is my opinion. I just go by how much I enjoy the music. Something with the 560S/NDH30 drivers doesn't play well with my ears. Sure, there's a chance it's placebo since I learned they are the exact same driver before hearing the NDH30, but I gave them an honest try.

 

[chesebert]

I did hear them all, but some not at the same time, I confess. Nonetheless, this is my opinion. I just go by how much I enjoy the music. Something with the 560S/NDH30 drivers doesn't play well with my ears. Sure, there's a chance it's placebo since I learned they are the exact same driver before hearing the NDH30, but I gave them an honest try.

Fair enough. We all hear differently.

I have 2 pairs of NDH30, 650 (old stock), 660S2, Clear all sitting in front of me and been swapping back and forth.

 

[kman1211]

I did hear them all, but some not at the same time, I confess. Nonetheless, this is my opinion. I just go by how much I enjoy the music. Something with the 560S/NDH30 drivers doesn't play well with my ears. Sure, there's a chance it's placebo since I learned they are the exact same driver before hearing the NDH30, but I gave them an honest try.

Have any idea what it is about the drivers that didn't play well with your ears? I'm familiar with the HD 560S/400 Pro but not the NDH-30. I have a few complaints about the sound of the HD 560S.

 

[xSDMx]

HD6xx < HD650/HD600 < or = HD660S2 <<<< Clear < NDH30/Auteur Classic

This seems like the right pecking order to me.

800S has a completely different sound profile and cannot be reliably compared with the 6xxish sound profile without taking into account personal preference

Have you heard the OG HD 660S?

 

[CaptainFantastic]

Have any idea what it is about the drivers that didn't play well with your ears? I'm familiar with the HD 560S/400 Pro but not the NDH-30. I have a few complaints about the sound of the HD 560S.

As I recall, because I almost always test for this and it's most important to me, the vocals didn't transmit the emotion I look for. And I don't need an "intimate" sound stage for that too happen; I own the ZMF Verite and Atrium, which have two very different ways of presenting vocals compared to the HD-600. Definitely worth an audition with your favorite tracks before a purchase.