[jlemaster1957]

Bringing this back to the bottom of the thread. TL;DR how does NOS cp to no NOS with Yggy+ and does flavor matter?
Have now searched both Forum and Google extensively. There are almost NO detailed user impressions in any flavor of Yggy+ NOS SQ. If any/all flavors have true NOS, NOS opens up the possibility of user defined filters eg HQP or use of Hugo M-scaler. Most user impressions prior to availability of NOS as an option in Yggy+ state that the Yggy filters take over and ‘everything sounds the same’ (in terms of upsampled or modulated files once transcoded to PCM and processed by Yggy).

I realize that, if a person really wants to use NOS/HQP with Yggdrasil, someone might say ‘just get a Holo Spring/May then’. My counter would be a) cost of the May is about twice that of Yggy (admittedly Spring is much closer unless you add the preamp which is $600 USD but with the hot Spring output voltage I would want to do so) ; b) it is virtually impossible to audition/return the Holos unless they need warranty service vs 15 day return window for Schitt products- short but probably enough to allow adequate initial burn-in and decide if you like it enough to keep it; c) no matter how good a Holo is, inevitably there will be a Spring 4 and/or May 2- Holo does not do modular updates/upgrades like Schitt.


Maybe it will turn out that there is still minimal difference in SQ with Yggy+ in NOS vs Yggy
+ with ‘mega combo burrito’ filters engaged; or instead that SQ is worse In NOS regardless what is done in HQP.

It kinda does matter - to me at least. I am on the Yggy - Spring 3 fence, tipping towards Yggy but only barely. I don’t have any HQP servers or an HQP license (more cost but if I knew the cost of those alone would strongly tilt the balance towards Yggy SQ’wise and that my other gear would play with it —the latter is my main worry— I would’t quibble).

Post edited: I had not yet noted when posting above initially that @GoldenOne is about to release a video (soon? I hope?) comparing the 3 Yggy+ flavors in which —given his attention to it in other work —I anticipate he will address NOS and potentially HQP functionality. I note also @ozziegurkan @sahmen @madFloyd and prob’ly @supersonic395 all may now have Yggy+s so pls weigh in with NOS vs No NOS impressions, and if doing so pls state what ‘flavor’ you are using.

@ozziegurkan reported on this yesterday here, post 112,785. In short, NOS on Yggy+ allows HQP and subjectively improves technicalities in a systems with a great amp and Susvaras.

 

[Moose246]

Hi all....looking for some insight on partnering HQPlayer with Yggy OG A2 Unison. Have a few questions -maybe someone here has had the same and can opine. I'll preface that I'm definitely not a technical expert on the Yggy or HQPlayer....just a music lover who likes to tinker as well.

- I guess the first question is whether HQPlayer actually does anything or makes a difference since Yggy upsamples. (My technical shortcomings exposed here)

- What should the HQPlayer settings be for Sample Rate and Bit rate? Are there any other settings that have to be a certain selection? Modulator, for example, since Yggy can't do DSD.

- Sans HQP I use Roon running on rock PC fed to the Yggy via Pi2AES (AES to Yggy). I can get Roon to interface with HQP but have to point it to the PC that I'm running the Roon software and go into the Yggy via USB. So I have my main PC where Roon interface is on, a nuc with the Roon rock/core, and the Pi2AES. Wondering how I could still use the Pi2 chain with Roon and HQP.

 

[jlemaster1957]

Hi all....looking for some insight on partnering HQPlayer with Yggy OG A2 Unison. Have a few questions -maybe someone here has had the same and can opine. I'll preface that I'm definitely not a technical expert on the Yggy or HQPlayer....just a music lover who likes to tinker as well.

- I guess the first question is whether HQPlayer actually does anything or makes a difference since Yggy upsamples. (My technical shortcomings exposed here)

- What should the HQPlayer settings be for Sample Rate and Bit rate? Are there any other settings that have to be a certain selection? Modulator, for example, since Yggy can't do DSD.

- Sans HQP I use Roon running on rock PC fed to the Yggy via Pi2AES (AES to Yggy). I can get Roon to interface with HQP but have to point it to the PC that I'm running the Roon software and go into the Yggy via USB. So I have my main PC where Roon interface is on, a nuc with the Roon rock/core, and the Pi2AES. Wondering how I could still use the Pi2 chain with Roon and HQP.

Pls see above post citation to @ozziegurkan’s one on the main Schitt thread for an example of using HQP with Yggy+. There were earlier posts on this thread that found little difference on the Yggy A2OG pre+, but now that Yggy+ has NOS that seems to maybe be different.

If I understand the Roon implementation of HQP, you should point Roon to HQP (even if both are running in different devices, if they are on the same local network this should work) then have the output on HQP set to Pi2 —>Pi2AES—> AES input on the Yggy+ (probably what you are doing I just was unclear if you were looking for advice on that). @earnmyturns or @ozziegurkan could better respond if they read this- as I am still running Roon Core/Server on a 2017 MBP that doesn’t have the capacity to run HQP also, so planning to add a mini-PC to host HQP.

 

[Moose246]

Pls see above post citation to @ozziegurkan’s one on the main Schitt thread for an example of using HQP with Yggy+. There were earlier posts on this thread that found little difference on the Yggy A2OG pre+, but now that Yggy+ has NOS that seems to maybe be different.

If I understand the Roon implementation of HQP, you should point Roon to HQP (even if both are running in different devices, if they are on the same local network this should work) then have the output on HQP set to Pi2 —>Pi2AES—> AES input on the Yggy+ (probably what you are doing I just was unclear if you were looking for advice on that). @earnmyturns or @ozziegurkan could better respond if they read this- as I am still running Roon Core/Server on a 2017 MBP that doesn’t have the capacity to run HQP also, so planning to add a mini-PC to host HQP.

Thanks for the response! How do I set up HQP to output to the Pi2AES? Under 'Output Device Settings' I'm currently using WASAPI to "Speakers (2- Schiit Yggdrasil Unison USB)". If I select any of the others, particularly those with Network in the name, there are no device selections.

 

[jlemaster1957]

Bringing this back to the bottom of the thread. TL;DR how does NOS cp to no NOS with Yggy+ and does flavor matter?
Have now searched both Forum and Google extensively. There are almost NO detailed user impressions in any flavor of Yggy+ NOS SQ. If any/all flavors have true NOS, NOS opens up the possibility of user defined filters eg HQP or use of Hugo M-scaler. Most user impressions prior to availability of NOS as an option in Yggy+ state that the Yggy filters take over and ‘everything sounds the same’ (in terms of upsampled or modulated files once transcoded to PCM and processed by Yggy).

I realize that, if a person really wants to use NOS/HQP with Yggdrasil, someone might say ‘just get a Holo Spring/May then’. My counter would be a) cost of the May is about twice that of Yggy (admittedly Spring is much closer unless you add the preamp which is $600 USD but with the hot Spring output voltage I would want to do so) ; b) it is virtually impossible to audition/return the Holos unless they need warranty service vs 15 day return window for Schitt products- short but probably enough to allow adequate initial burn-in and decide if you like it enough to keep it; c) no matter how good a Holo is, inevitably there will be a Spring 4 and/or May 2- Holo does not do modular updates/upgrades like Schitt.


Maybe it will turn out that there is still minimal difference in SQ with Yggy+ in NOS vs Yggy
+ with ‘mega combo burrito’ filters engaged; or instead that SQ is worse In NOS regardless what is done in HQP.

It kinda does matter - to me at least. I am on the Yggy - Spring 3 fence, tipping towards Yggy but only barely. I don’t have any HQP servers or an HQP license (more cost but if I knew the cost of those alone would strongly tilt the balance towards Yggy SQ’wise and that my other gear would play with it —the latter is my main worry— I would’t quibble).

Post edited: I had not yet noted when posting above initially that @GoldenOne is about to release a video (soon? I hope?) comparing the 3 Yggy+ flavors in which —given his attention to it in other work —I anticipate he will address NOS and potentially HQP functionality. I note also @ozziegurkan @sahmen @madFloyd and prob’ly @supersonic395 all may now have Yggy+s so pls weigh in with NOS vs No NOS impressions, and if doing so pls state what ‘flavor’ you are using.

This is more than I know boss. Hopefully @earnmyturns or @ozziegurkan or another active HQP user will weigh in here to help.

In the meantime you might checkout the HQP Desktop thread over on the Roon Community forum. This is an active thread, it seems. Sorry I can’t seem to post a link for this you’ll need to Google it. I’ve tried 3 times to paste the correct link and it keeps going to a page called ‘RIP Wayne Shorter’.

 

[Moose246]

You can run Roon on your PC, and use a Pi4 as a network endpoint with usb out to your DAC and it will sound great and is super simple and cheap. At some point in the future, if you want to upgrade you can get a dedicated Roon core and HQPlayer as well, which I use and I think is worth every penny!

How do you use HQPlayer and the Pi? I have a Pi2AES and am trying to figure out how to integrate it with HQPlayer and Roon. I can get it to work going directly from my pc to the Yggy via USB, but not through the Pi2.

 

[earnmyturns]

This is more than I know boss. Hopefully @earnmyturns or @ozziegurkan or another active HQP user will weigh in here to help.

In the meantime you might checkout the HQP Desktop thread over on the Roon Community forum. This is an active thread, it seems. Sorry I can’t seem to post a link for this you’ll need to Google it. I’ve tried 3 times to paste the correct link and it keeps going to a page called ‘RIP Wayne Shorter’.

I know a bit about HQPlayer and how to run it with Roon, and a bit about using HQPlayer with NOS DACs, but very little about the Yggdrasil+ and its NOS mode.

You run HQPlayer (Desktop or Embedded) on some computer on your local network. How powerful a computer? It depends on how demanding your HQPlayer configuration is. AFAIK, Yggdrasil+ accepts 192kHz PCM max, even in NOS, so the most you'd need to do is to run one of the HQPlayer PCM digital filters with that output rate. That probably needs less compute than my standard Holo configurations (poly-sinc-... filters, ASDM7ECv2 modulators, DSD256 output) that use 50-60% of a Mac Mini M1 or 30-40% of an i9-11900. You can point Roon to HQPlayer on the Settings>Setup page for Roon, providing the local host name or IP address of the computer where HQPlayer is running. The computer where HQPlayer is running can output directly to the DAC via USB, or to another device (computer or streamer) that accepts NAA over the local network, which then drives the DAC (that's how I have things set up, NAA from HQPlayer server to mini PC running the Signalyist NAA image then USB to DAC).

Would I do all of the above for the Yggdrasil+? If I had everything already including the HQPlayer license, why not? But given that Y+ accepts max 192kHz PCM, I really doubt there's much of a win for external HQPlayer upsampling filters to 192kHz over Schiit's own DAC-specific filters. I'd probably not go to the complexity and expense just for the Y+. which is so good self-contained.

 

[sp33ls]

I like to let Yggy's proprietary filter [] do the heavy lifting. I know Mr. Moffat is the same way.

After all, that's a big part of what we're paying for in a high-end DAC.

Still, I'd be interested in hearing others' preferences.

 

[George Hincapie]

You may be right, but the moment a $2k DAC can beat an $8k DAC, it then becomes a race to the bottom.

More like a race to rational pricing.

 

[Recursion]

More like a race to rational pricing.

And so it should be, it's only good that the $8k DAC would drop down in price over time. It serves to stimulate further research and innovation, as believe it or not, but even that $8k DAC can be improved upon. Perhaps not by a lot, but it sure can be. Those innovations will eventually trickle down further, which is a good thing, as without it we would have a boring and perhaps dead audio market.

All of this reasoning makes me wonder what the TOTL audio market would be like in say 10 years lol. How much more room for improvement is there in CD quality audio for example? Will red book itself ever become the bottleneck?

 

[tesarpa]

Will red book itself ever become the bottleneck?

No, never. The quality of recording is unfortunately limiting much more.

 

[thefitz]

More like a race to rational pricing.

You see this in Chi-Fi all the time. This $1000 IEM competes with the $3000 IEM... and then there's a $500 IEM that's a mini version of the $1000 IEM... then there's the $250 little brother of the $500 IEM... and we eventually have dead-serious discussions about what twenty dollar IEM is best.

It's an obsession with "giant killers" that ends at $20. I bet there will be a $10 jobbie that kills the $20 one.

I probably mentioned this already, but my favourite example of this was in a single comment on an InnerFidelity review. A commenter misunderstood a several thousand dollar Mjolnir Audio amplifier review to be about the Schiit Mjolnir (~$3000 to $800 without saying a word) and tried to ply a confirmation out of Tyll that the newly-released Jotunheim rendered the Mjolnir obsolete ($800 to $400). Seriously - $3k to $0.4k in one sentence.

A race to the bottom.

 

[George Hincapie]

You see this in Chi-Fi all the time. This $1000 IEM competes with the $3000 IEM... and then there's a $500 IEM that's a mini version of the $1000 IEM... then there's the $250 little brother of the $500 IEM... and we eventually have dead-serious discussions about what twenty dollar IEM is best.

It's an obsession with "giant killers" that ends at $20. I bet there will be a $10 jobbie that kills the $20 one.

I probably mentioned this already, but my favourite example of this was in a single comment on an InnerFidelity review. A commenter misunderstood a several thousand dollar Mjolnir Audio amplifier review to be about the Schiit Mjolnir (~$3000 to $800 without saying a word) and tried to ply a confirmation out of Tyll that the newly-released Jotunheim rendered the Mjolnir obsolete ($800 to $400). Seriously - $3k to $0.4k in one sentence.

A race to the bottom.

I sort of get your perspective, but the profiting in our hobby is just insane. Quality at reasonable cost has to be better for everyone. Other than those slurping profits of course.

 

[thefitz]

I sort of get your perspective, but the profiting in our hobby is just insane. Quality at reasonable cost has to be better for everyone. Other than those slurping profits of course.

Oh yes, 10000% it is out of hand, make no mistake!

My IEM example also extends exponentially in the other direction - Effect Audio makes a $5K USD IEM CABLE!!! That's, like, objectively evil, no?

It's a race in both directions, no doubt - and I have no interest in the snobbery associated with either trek. Yes, the... 10 people buying $5k IEM cables look down their noses at idiots like me with my ALO Reference 8 cable. But the 234789327 people who bought the AliExpress 16-core cable are looking down their noses at me.

But make no mistake - it's not a race to rational pricing. It's a race to the bottom.

For a decade-plus, universal wisdom said you need to hook your HE-6 up to a speaker amp, or perhaps a small nuclear reactor. One of closest things you'd get to consensus in this hobby, even if the rationale behind why wasn't always the easiest sell. Welp, Fang pulls a Fang and fire-sells the HE-6SEv2 for 75% off and all of a sudden 90% of HE-6-series owners are asking if the Topping A90 is better for the v2 than their THX 789.

 

[Daniel Johnston]

So, my Ygdrassil won’t power on. I don’t see any fuses that are readily accessible. I do have email to Schiit sent.