[Tbone289]

Yeah, I don't know why you would lose resolution when the processing is basically add and subtract and filter in the analog domain, not digital. I only use the Syn in a home theater (speaker) application, but it sure doesn't sound like it's lacking resolution to me, whether processing is engaged or not.

As several reviewers have mentioned, the Syn scales with better DACs as well, that is, better than Schiit's ESS9018 implementation. I agree that using Lyr+ after Syn is a bit of an odd way to go. Lyr+ can only be as good as the signal fed to it, so it seems extraneous in the chain.

 

[bweiss711]

Yeah, I don't know why you would lose resolution when the processing is basically add and subtract and filter in the analog domain, not digital. I only use the Syn in a home theater (speaker) application, but it sure doesn't sound like it's lacking resolution to me, whether processing is engaged or not.

Yep, agreed. And if you have shaping turned off, and the volume pot turned all the way up, the Syn is simply a straight wire delivering an unmolested signal from your source to your amp for the main channels. And if you have processing and shaping turned on, you're already changing the original 2 channel signal so much, any additional lack of resolution is irrelevant.

And it sounds great anyways.

 

[Tbone289]

And it sounds great anyways.

It does indeed, and has just the right amount of control to tweak the sound to anyone's desire.

I hope the relative lack of discussion of Syn here is not indicative of how it is selling.

 

[Asura29]

I guess this depends on why you want to use the Syn as a pre-amp to the Lyr+. Will you be using the DAC on the Syn at all? Are you wanting to send the shaping (i.e. width and presence) controls to your headphones through the Lyr+? But yes, you can stack by sending the Bifrost 2 RCA out to the RCA in on the Syn, the RCA out on main L/R channels from the Syn to the RCA in on the Lyr+, and then the Lyr+ RCA out to your speaker amplifier.

I would actually consider using the Lyr+ as your pre-amp, and treat the Syn as additional processing before your speaker amps. Same configuration that you have now, but send the Lyr+ RCA out to the Syn RCA in, and then the Syn RCA outs to your speakers amps. I would leave the Syn main volume pot at its maximum, and use the Lyr+ attenuator for volume control. You get the benefit of sending the tube-ness (or solid-state-ness) from the Lyr+ to your surround speakers, a better method for volume control, and the Syn stays out of the signal path to your headphones.



I saw the same review, and kind of questioned it at the time. I personally haven't noticed anything. But again, my system isn't exactly the most resolving system. I love how it sounds, but I'm not going to suggest I can hear the tiniest resolution of every detail. My source is the original Modi Multibit sent through a Saga S to the Syn. (Same as I recommended for you, I have Syn volume pot all the way up and use Saga S attenuator for volume control). For speakers, I have the original ELAC UB5 and Emotiva BasX A-100 amp. My headphones are Hifiman HE400i and BeyerDynamic DT880. When I sit back and listen to 2 channel music (i.e. process and shaping turned off on the Syn), it still sounds great, and I assume my headphones sound as good as they can considering the quality of headphone amp in the Syn.

Your results may vary depending on your equipment. But also, Jason Stoddard has said in his live streams, that the Syn is clean enough to send a Yiggy through it, and not get it stepped on. However, if its something your worried about, taking the Syn out of the signal path to your headphones would solve that issue.

Thank you for all the informations, I'll use this setup mainly with headphones and I would like to use the Dac of the Bifrost and the Amp of the Lyr+, so basically use the Syn as additional processing to give to my setup features like width and presence.
I was thinking the same, it's looks strange that the Syn can create loss in resolution, especially because the processing isn't digital but analog, like the Schiit Loki or Lokius that with the EQ process doesn't create any loss of resolution, but at the end what really matter that it sounds good, and like you said maybe only if you have a high end setup you can feel it a little bit, but I doubt.
I think the Syn is a great add on to any system, it gives the simplicity and the flexibility in an existing setup that a lot of peoples was looking for and also for peoples that they're looking for one solution for everything.

 

[scottm18]

Can't believe I completely forgot about this new product from Schiit. Maybe some owners can help me answer a few questions about it...

So I'm personally still 100% in the analog world with my rig because let's face facts...it just sounds better cause last time I checked that's how you hear music. And not just any analog equipment--we're talking a Cary 5 channel amplifier and the awesome Audio Research MP1 multichannel preamp (see pics--but showing old amp). This is all driven by the coveted Oppo 205 Blu-ray player with the analog multi-channel out (my only digital source with its coveted HDMI input). But one issue i have that bugs me is that I used to have both the McCormick MAP1 and its big sister--a tubed Conrad Johnson MET1. They both had an "ARM" circuit that would slickly take a two-channel signal and turn it into multi-channel one... kind of like Pro logic or Neo 6 on steroids.

Sadly the only thing.. and I mean only thing missing on the MP1 preamp is that function. It actually almost has the reverse where you can take a two-channel signal and add a subwoofer to it...but you can't expand it to five channels like with the other two--and I greatly miss that. It would really come in handy with the two channel DSD recordings I have, Qobuz in high res, as well as even internet radio. I completely forgot in my search for a streamer/ DAC that is as convoluted as can be, about the Syn product...which just may be the answer to my dilemma?

I've attached an award-winning art demonstration of how I may be able to hook this in . As you can see the MP1 is literally an analog paradise with tons of incoming and outgoing connections... and the revealing sound is just out of this world. Its the greatest component I've ever owned...and it's worth a Fort Knox version of the Mint these days. It's not going anywhere anytime soon. So... as shown if I take the MP1 "record out" and send that to the Syn analog-in then take the Syn multi-channel analog out and loop it back into one of the now (still) two available Mch analog inputs, I should be golden with full high res simulated surround of whatever the source is when I choose that source input. I think?

And I would have a lot more control with that than I did over the minorly-adjustable ARM circuit...

Oh one big question I just thought of: If I go analog in from an analog source--MP1 in this case)--into the Syn then I don't need the DAC portion (the ESS there certainly can't match the Pro version in the Oppo 205). Does anyone know if it automatically bypass the Syn DAC if the incoming signal is already analog (or an option to do so?)

 

[Tbone289]

Oh one big question I just thought of: If I go analog in from an analog source--MP1 in this case)--into the Syn then I don't need the DAC portion (the ESS there certainly can't match the Pro version in the Oppo 205). Does anyone know if it automatically bypass the Syn DAC if the incoming signal is already analog (or an option to do so?)

Yes, the analog input bypasses Syn's DAC. For that matter, you could remove the DAC card from the Syn and it would operate solely as an analog preamp/matrix surround processor.

I've attached an award-winning art demonstration of how I may be able to hook this in . As you can see the MP1 is literally an analog paradise with tons of incoming and outgoing connections... and the revealing sound is just out of this world. Its the greatest component I've ever owned...and it's worth a Fort Knox version of the Mint these days. It's not going anywhere anytime soon. So... as shown if I take the MP1 "record out" and send that to the Syn analog-in then take the Syn multi-channel analog out and loop it back into one of the now (still) two available Mch analog inputs, I should be golden with full high res simulated surround of whatever the source is when I choose that source input. I think?

I think I need to understand your end goal better to answer this question. Syn itself is a preamp that processes a two-channel analog signal into six separate channels. L, C, R, a "split" surround channel (L&R) and a low-pass filtered subwoofer channel.

EDIT: From your illustration, it appears that this might work, as long as you can have a desired stereo input routing to the record outputs and at the same time have the "MC1" input (with Syn outputs connected) routing through the preamp to its outputs. However, I would think that the record outputs would just be a stereo duplicate of whatever input you have selected. In the case of the Oppo 205, you would want MC3 selected so the stereo signal from it will be on the record outputs, but can you also have MC1 inputs routed to the preamp output at the same time?

 

[USAudio]

FYI - Interesting new review of the Syn: Schiit Syn - Analog Extracted Surround Sound

Here's my comment I posted there:

My Outlaw Audio 1050 receiver was pushing 20 years old, so it was time for an upgrade...

While researching separate surround processors I noticed the Syn and decided to give it a go, along with a Monolith multichannel amp. The Syn offered a surprisingly good 5.1 surround experience with movies, but what was most surprising was how great it sounded with music!

Just to do my due diligence I also gave the separate surround processor a go, but honestly the surround experience wasn't any better (albeit in my simple 5.1 system) and the Syn was much better with music. So the surround processor went back and the Syn is staying.

The Syn is more of an audiophile product and I'm more of an audiophile than a videophile so YMMV, but if you you have a 5.1 system you might consider giving the Syn a try, you might be as pleasantly surprised as I was!

 

[scottm18]

However, I would think that the record outputs would just be a stereo duplicate of whatever input you have selected.

Yep...You are absolutely correct it seems--as shown by my first attachment. If it's going to work I would have to wire it up the second way (mod pic). I believe those are pre outs... But I really need to check with AR to be sure--will.probably need to wire the 2ch output from my Oppo into one of the 2ch inputs on the MP1 first. Something on this analog smorgasbord has got to do the trick to incorporate the Syn

 

[Tbone289]

However, I would think that the record outputs would just be a stereo duplicate of whatever input you have selected.

Yep...You are absolutely correct it seems--as shown by my first attachment. If it's going to work I would have to wire it up the second way (mod pic). I believe those are pre outs... But I really need to check with AR to be sure. Something on this analog smorgasbord has got to do the trick

OK, I guess my question now is... Where are you going with the Syn outputs? Yes, you can use Syn between your MP1 and multi-channel amplifier so that you can essentially have multiple inputs to Syn (provided by the MP1), but routing the Syn's outputs back into the MP1--that's where you lose me.

 

[Tbone289]

FYI - Interesting new review of the Syn: Schiit Syn - Analog Extracted Surround Sound

Here's my comment I posted there:

Thanks for sharing. It's nice to see more positive press on this great piece of Schiit equipment. I love mine for HT and music. Fortunately I don't have to use the included remote. I'm using it to bypass the preamp on an Denon AVR-1910 receiver and the Denon volume is still active in bypass mode, so I just leave Syn's main gain know maxed. That Denon never sounded anywhere near this good on its own, and I will likely run it until it dies.

 

[scottm18]

OK, I guess my question now is... Where are you going with the Syn outputs?

Yeah I think I'm going around in circles too--the issue you're getting at is it's only going to send through any output jacks with the input source on the front panel. I just realized all I would need to do is route the 2ch RCA out feed of the Oppo (which is run by a completely separate 9038Pro DAC) into the two channel RCA input of the Syn. Then I'd run the multi-channel output of the Syn into the multi-channel input of the MP1.

That would allow anything the Oppo processes in 2ch (which is basically all sources) to be run through the Syn before it routes back into the MP1. For regular discrete multi-channel use, I would use the existing Oppo MC3 input... but for any two channel I would use the MC1 Syn input. Best of all worlds..I think

If i do get another DAC/streamer to use the Syn on instead of the Oppo (because the streamer would be 100% two channel), I just have to make sure that it has analog out.

Looks like either way I'm going to be adding to the already eight miles of wires behind my cabinet (6 RCA channels in from the Oppo, 6 RCA/XLR channels out to the amplifier + sub out and phono preamp in) because I'm definitely going to pick this up and see what it can do!

 

[Tbone289]

Yeah I think I'm going around in circles too--the issue you're getting at is it's only going to send through any output jacks with the input source on the front panel. I just realized all I would need to do is route the 2ch RCA out feed of the Oppo (which is run by a completely separate 9038Pro DAC) into the two channel RCA input of the Syn. Then I'd run the multi-channel output of the Syn into the multi-channel input of the MP1.

That would allow anything the Oppo processes in 2ch (which is basically all sources) to be run through the Syn before it routes back into the MP1. For regular discrete multi-channel use, I would use the existing Oppo MC3 input... but for any two channel I would use the MC1 Syn input. Best of all worlds..I think

If i do get another DAC/streamer to use the Syn on instead of the Oppo (because the streamer would be 100% two channel), I just have to make sure that it has analog out.

Looks like either way I'm going to be adding to my already eight miles of wires behind my cabinet

Yep, looks like you got it. That's nice that the Oppo has multi-out and two-channel out!

 

[Tbone289]

One of the virtues of Syn is the ability to finely tune the dialog, from a focus/width and attenuation perspectives.

This works beautifully for F1 races which, in my opinion, always has the commentary mixed too loud to appreciate the engine sound echoing around the road course stadiums and city street courses. A bit of adjustment to focus the commentary dialog to the center channel and then attenuate, and the result is just as it should be.

 

[Raveron89]

Happy New Year All!!
Planning to grab the Syn finally to use as a preamp for my amps and introduce a center channel later once I build it and rears to follow.
One question I had was on how to level match different speakers and different amps on sound level.
I know this is not a Syn specific question but I'm guessing the user base here will be going through this exercise.
Thanks in advance!

 

[Tbone289]

There are gain knobs for center and surround channels individually. Set their level by ear relative to the L and R channels. The beauty of Syn is in the simplicity!

I set the levels with processing (width and presence) disabled, and then use the width and presence knobs as needed. Once overall levels are set I don't touch them much at all. I only rarely use processing for programs that need it, like the F1 racing example I mentioned above.

When listening to music with all channels active, I usually attenuate the subwoofer and center channels a bit. For TV and movies I have like to have the center and sub turned up higher for clearer dialog and low frequency effects.

Enjoy your Syn when you get it!! My advice above really only relates to 3.1 or 5.1 setups. I haven't really used it for 2-channel only, but I'm sure it will work out great.