[sheldaze]

yes of course the differences in dacs are rather small compared to headphones and even amps.  Agreed. 
 
What I have always followed is that you should probably feed the chain with the best source you can.  I followed that advice for many years of vinyl listening and it has served me well.  And it continues with digital.
 
It confounds me how many folks will use a phone and a $150 dac / amp with Senn 800s for example.

+1
 
I had this exactly discussion yesterday, when trying to explain my hobby. You cannot build upon that, which is already broken. Amplifier and headphone cannot make magic out of that which is already distorted or otherwise incorrect. And this goes all the way back to the recording studio - but I won't venture there.

 

[Bob A (SD)]

  What I have always followed is that you should probably feed the chain with the best source you can.  I followed that advice for many years of vinyl listening and it has served me well.  And it continues with digital.
 
It confounds me how many folks will use a phone and a $150 dac / amp with Senn 800s for example.

+2  
 
Perhaps "confounds" is too gentle a term for that insane ineptitude.  LOL
 
Take a look at "My Systems..." link in my signature which should confirm where I'm coming from. 

 

[bixby]

  +2  
 
Perhaps "confounds" is too gentle a term for that insane ineptitude.  LOL
 
Take a look at "My Systems..." link in my signature which should confirm where I'm coming from. 

You have been on a long journey I can see.  Lots of old school stuff.  I wish I had some of the older stuff today to compare.  We have both gone down different paths and you probably need to filter my comments with your preferences, for sure.
 
I used to have an ack dac 2.0 way back when I thought Grados were good.  I never cared for it but it was the gateway drug that prompted me to buy the ridiculously expensive (at the time) EAD 7000 MkIII r2r dac at one point.  It could not hold a candle to what is happenin' today!

 

[Bob A (SD)]

 

  +2  
 
Perhaps "confounds" is too gentle a term for that insane ineptitude.  LOL
 
Take a look at "My Systems..." link in my signature which should confirm where I'm coming from. 

You have been on a long journey I can see.  Lots of old school stuff.  I wish I had some of the older stuff today to compare.  We have both gone down different paths and you probably need to filter my comments with your preferences, for sure.
 
I used to have an ack dac 2.0 way back when I thought Grados were good.  I never cared for it but it was the gateway drug that prompted me to buy the ridiculously expensive (at the time) EAD 7000 MkIII r2r dac at one point.  It could not hold a candle to what is happenin' today!

LOL.  The stuff wasn't "old school" when it was bought but I'm certainly "old school" now.  Been retired for 9+ years now,
 
Yeah many loved the dAck! like me and others not so much.  Lots of discussion about it back in 2003-6 when it was a hot commodity.  I'm probably one of the few still using it.  But as said it works for me giving me a nice analog rendition of my redbook CD collection through my biamped, sub augmented, modded Maggies.  Never saw the need to upgrade from it. 

  

 
 

 
 
 
 
Not mine but a picture of the Flexi-Rack design in response to the "rep" comment:

 

[Psalmanazar]

Bifrost 4490 vs Modi 2U 4396:

The Bifrost 4490 staging is wider and should have more detail than the Modi 2U 4396 but doesn't as it's much warmer with tons of excess bass impact that masks the lower mids. The M2U 4396 sound is actually higher fidelity despite being cheaper. The Bifrost 4490 is warmer than the Bifrost Multibit, which has more detail but is way gooier and lacks bass impact compared to the excess impact of the Bifrost 4490. If you don't actually care about hi-fidelity reproduction of instruments and male voices, then you might like the Bifrost 4490 better than the Modi 2U 4396 but it must be understood that it is lower fidelity and you are merely preferring it's presentation. The Bifrost 4490 may well be less out of phase but who cares as it's not reproducing the various elements it's placing within the sound stage well and the instrumental separation still sucks compared to the Bimby.

Size of staging: Bifrost 4490 > Bimby > Modi 2U 4396

Accuracy of staging: Bimby > the other two no contest

Tone: Modi 2U 4396 > both of them easily

The Schiit solution? Buy Modi 2U 4396 and save for the Yggdrasil. I hope the Modi 2U 4490 is better than the other AK4490 implementations I have heard which weren't all that great.

 

[Bob A (SD)]

Psalmanazer,
 
  Thanks for sharing your impressions.  Very very interesting!   Figure my Modi 2 (4396) + Wyrd is basically the equal of the Modi 2 (4396) Uber save the input flexibility.

 

[bixby]

  Bifrost 4490 vs Modi 2U 4396:

The Bifrost 4490 staging is wider and should have more detail than the Modi 2U 4396 but doesn't as it's much warmer with tons of excess bass impact that masks the lower mids. The M2U 4396 sound is actually higher fidelity despite being cheaper. The Bifrost 4490 is warmer than the Bifrost Multibit, which has more detail but is way gooier and lacks bass impact compared to the excess impact of the Bifrost 4490. If you don't actually care about hi-fidelity reproduction of instruments and male voices, then you might like the Bifrost 4490 better than the Modi 2U 4396 but it must be understood that it is lower fidelity and you are merely preferring it's presentation. The Bifrost 4490 may well be less out of phase but who cares as it's not reproducing the various elements it's placing within the sound stage well and the instrumental separation still sucks compared to the Bimby.

Size of staging: Bifrost 4490 > Bimby > Modi 2U 4396

Accuracy of staging: Bimby > the other two no contest

Tone: Modi 2U 4396 > both of them easily

The Schiit solution? Buy Modi 2U 4396 and save for the Yggdrasil. I hope the Modi 2U 4490 is better than the other AK4490 implementations I have heard which weren't all that great.

Excellent impressions!  Could you help me understand the rest of the setup?
 
What computer, OS, player software, dedicated to music or not, amp, and headphones?

 

[Psalmanazar]

 
Excellent impressions!  Could you help me understand the rest of the setup?
 
What computer, OS, player software, dedicated to music or not, amp, and headphones?

T series Thinkpads on full USB power all the time with Windows -> Foobar 2k with all processes in high or realtime priority -> ASIO -> DAC -> Magni 2U -> HD 650

For certain ultra-warm recordings, the HD 650 needs 100 hz reduced a couple db, the upper mids boosted a db or two, and 11ish khz boosted on some mixes but I don't use EQ at all for the most part when testing DACs. I need to buy a new pair of near fields and am will probably get a balanced desktop sized DAC when I buy them. Maybe Emotiva DC-1?

The DAC impressions didn't change with the Asgard 2. If you use some hazy OTL tube amp, the Bifrosts will probably just be horrible. If you use Beyerdynamic or the stock HD 800, yeah your transducer is just ridiculously bright and painfully linearly distorted.

 

[bixby]

  T series Thinkpads on full USB power all the time with Windows -> Foobar 2k with all processes in high or realtime priority -> ASIO -> DAC -> Magni 2U -> HD 650

For certain ultra-warm recordings, the HD 650 needs 100 hz reduced a couple db, the upper mids boosted a db or two, and 11ish khz boosted on some mixes but I don't use EQ at all for the most part when testing DACs. I need to buy a new pair of near fields and am will probably get a balanced desktop sized DAC when I buy them. Maybe Emotiva DC-1?

The DAC impressions didn't change with the Asgard 2. If you use some hazy OTL tube amp, the Bifrosts will probably just be horrible. If you use Beyerdynamic or the stock HD 800, yeah your transducer is just ridiculously bright and painfully linearly distorted.

Very similar to what I use aside from a few minor changes.  HP Elitebook F2k, waspi event, polaris , hd650.  The big thing in my setup is the Win machine has always been thicker and warmer sounding without as much clarity as my mac mini based speaker setup.  I'll have to throw the 4490 and amp into the main system to hear what the 4490 sounds like there.

 

[NewEinstein]

OK ... there seems to be one way to tell if you have a 4490 Modi2U or the older version:

"The Uber's USB input is also now self-powered, not bus-powered...mainly to improve compatibility with power-marginal USB ports (cough...Windows...cough)." (Quote from Jason @ Schiit)

So if the Modi is recognized by your computer without its power being on its an old version (bus powered). Mine is only recognized when I switch the Modi itself on (self powered) -> new 4490 version

Philip

 

[streetfighter]

OK ... there seems to be one way to tell if you have a 4490 Modi2U or the older version:

"The Uber's USB input is also now self-powered, not bus-powered...mainly to improve compatibility with power-marginal USB ports (cough...Windows...cough)." (Quote from Jason @ Schiit)

So if the Modi is recognized by your computer without its power being on its an old version (bus powered). Mine is only recognized when I switch the Modi itself on (self powered) -> new 4490 version

Philip

 
Hmmm, I tried this. I plugged in my Modi 2 Uber into my Macbook Pro's USB port, didn't see anything pop up in the sound settings. I turn my Modi 2 Uber on, and it pops up. I guess this means I have the new 4490 version?

 

[NewEinstein]

   
Hmmm, I tried this. I plugged in my Modi 2 Uber into my Macbook Pro's USB port, didn't see anything pop up in the sound settings. I turn my Modi 2 Uber on, and it pops up. I guess this means I have the new 4490 version?

That is how I would read Jasons comment ... but I can't guarantee that of course.
 
Maybe someone with the 4396 Modi2U can crosscheck how that one behaves?

 

[sayitaintsoap]

I switched the toggle of my Modi 2 uber in the back to off. Windows still recognizes it in playback devices. Can even see the volume meter going up and down if music's playing. That means I have the new updated one? We're still leaving it plugged into the wall outlet, right?

 

[Defiant00]

  I switched the toggle of my Modi 2 uber in the back to off. Windows still recognizes it in playback devices. Can even see the volume meter going up and down if music's playing. That means I have the new updated one? We're still leaving it plugged into the wall outlet, right?

 
That means it's the older one.
 
The new ones will disappear from Windows when you turn it off.

 

[NewEinstein]

  I switched the toggle of my Modi 2 uber in the back to off. Windows still recognizes it in playback devices. Can even see the volume meter going up and down if music's playing. That means I have the new updated one? We're still leaving it plugged into the wall outlet, right?

it that case it seems that the USB chip in your Modi2U is powered by the USB bus as it is still working even when the power of your Modi2U is switched off ... that would mean that you have the version with the AKM 4396 DAC-Chip.
 
When I switch mine off with the switch on the back Windows doesnt recognize it any more. That one is the new version and the USB chip is powered by the Modi2U and not from the computers USB bus.
 
EDIT: Defiant00 was faster