[artur9]

Thanks very much artur9 for taking the time to explain things. I must admit, looking at that site regarding the H95 affected the psyche. You end up saying that if this piece has so many bad readings then why would I want it.

I have to order items as I'm far away from these stores so I'm trying to do my due diligence before having a piece sent to me. A little harder to do.

Thanks

I hear you!

What I've been doing is cycling between measurements, reviewers who's opinion on something I've experienced matches mine, back and forth.

Some reviewers I would recommend are Jonathan Valin, Herb Reichert, Julie Mullins, Drew Kalbach. Reviewers I shun Steve Guttenberg, John Darko, Andrew Quint.

One I find interesting on Youtube is Steve Huff (I think). He's also into paranormal phenomena so there's that! :-D

 

[2bxfile]

I hear you!

What I've been doing is cycling between measurements, reviewers who's opinion on something I've experienced matches mine, back and forth.

Some reviewers I would recommend are Jonathan Valin, Herb Reichert, Julie Mullins, Drew Kalbach. Reviewers I shun Steve Guttenberg, John Darko, Andrew Quint.

One I find interesting on Youtube is Steve Huff (I think). He's also into paranormal phenomena so there's that! :-D

Thanks artur, I've been looking into some of these reviewers already.

 

[adias]

I hear you!

What I've been doing is cycling between measurements, reviewers who's opinion on something I've experienced matches mine, back and forth.

Some reviewers I would recommend are Jonathan Valin, Herb Reichert, Julie Mullins, Drew Kalbach. Reviewers I shun Steve Guttenberg, John Darko, Andrew Quint.

One I find interesting on Youtube is Steve Huff (I think). He's also into paranormal phenomena so there's that! :-D

Steve Guttenberg (The Audiophiliac) and Darko are bad?!?

 

[artur9]

Steve Guttenberg (The Audiophiliac) and Darko are bad?!?

For SG, his video reviews seem to be about him and the gear secondarily (by far). I also find him annoying.

Darko comes across as a shill to me.

 

[RickB]

For SG, his video reviews seem to be about him and the gear secondarily (by far). I also find him annoying.

Darko comes across as a shill to me.

Not to mention that some Americans have trouble understanding Darko's writing style, which might have contributed to him switching to mainly videos over writing articles. I can't be bothered with videos most of the time, I'm usually using my Mac to listen to music in "exclusive mode."

 

[Brubacca]

Not to mention that some Americans have trouble understanding Darko's writing style, which might have contributed to him switching to mainly videos over writing articles. I can't be bothered with videos most of the time, I'm usually using my Mac to listen to music in "exclusive mode."

At first I was not a Darko fan. He used words like chocolate to describe audio. Confusing.

Now I have to say I enjoy his reviews. Seems like a kind of guy that I could have beer with and listen to music. I’m not a electronica guy, but he has done some interesting videos on it.

 

[2bxfile]

Could anyone speak to the following Dacs as being a good contender to the MMB2 or maybe even having the edge on the Schiit?​

I'm looking at these as a possible choice. They are priced around the same as the MMB2 to get to Canada from California (roughly)- exchange and shipping.

AK4499​

Thanks

SMSL SU-9 Balanced DAC ​

Topping D30Pro​

Topping D70s MQA​

Topping D90 Balanced USB​

Topping E70 Stereo DAC​

Topping E70 Velvet AK4499EX Flagship DAC​

 

[Hyde00]

Could anyone speak to the following Dacs being a good contender to the MMB2 or maybe even having the edge on the Schiit?​

I'm looking at these as a possible choice.

Thanks

SMSL SU-9 Balanced DAC ​

Topping D30Pro​

Topping D70s MQA​

Topping D90 Balanced USB​

Topping E70 Stereo DAC​

Topping E70 Velvet AK4499EX Flagship DAC​

I'll be honest I haven't used any of the DAC you listed. I've only tried SMSL SU-1 LOL.

But from my experience after trying about 10+ different dacs from various types (ESS, AKM, R2R, Multibit, FPGA......etc) at this point I'd say in general resolution is less of a problem now, the bigger issue is more tonal balance / timber / sound signature......etc. Then after that I think "broadly speaking" each technology obviously has its strengths and weaknesses. Like delta sigma (AKM, ESS....etc) is better at detail retrieval and R2R is better at imaging and soundstage (more 3D per say) and Multibit is said to be about middle ground.

The Topping and SMSL dacs you listed are all delta sigma dacs so they're probably good at details but some might complain it might sound more "digital" vs the R2R dacs in similar price range. But again implementation is important so this is just "speaking generally".

Oh so Schiit just announced their Unison USB Multibit DAC Card, so now you can have Modi Multibit 2 level of dac inside your amp. For example you can get Rag 2 + Multibit DAC Card now.

https://www.schiit.com/products/true-multibit-unison-usb-card

I have a Lyr 3 now I wonder if I want to get this to make it a dac/amp combo just for fun LOL.

That being said, I sold my MMB2 and went back to SDAC (AK4452), to me SDAC sounds richer/thicker (MMB2 is more clean) but yes MMB2 has better details. So at this point I would almost say there's no straightforward way to pick dacs anymore LOL. I'm sacrificing certain aspects to gain certain aspects where I value more.

It's like those designer diagram Money x Fast x Good and you can only pick 2 LOL.

Maybe figure out what's most important to you then you can pick the type of dac that suits you more if that makes sense (i.e. do you want clean sound or thick/rich sound also how much you value timber vs detail retrieval.......etc, or if you want more relax/natural sounding or do you want laser to your ears where you can hear the grass grow.....etc).

EDIT1: Forgot to say Topping dacs tend to be quite linear and measure super well, so if you like neutral / super detailed sound then Topping is good choice. I don't like neutral sound so I steer away from Topping dacs LOL, but everyone have different preferences so I can still see the appeal. D90 is probably going to be the most detailed dac ever. SMSL tend to be a bit slightly less analytical than Topping dacs.

EDIT2: If you're worried about shipping/import cost you can always look into Canuck Audio Mart, there are a lot of local deals for cheaper.

 

[2bxfile]

I'll be honest I haven't used any of the DAC you listed. I've only tried SMSL SU-1 LOL.

But from my experience after trying about 10+ different dacs from various types (ESS, AKM, R2R, Multibit, FPGA......etc) at this point I'd say in general resolution is less of a problem now, the bigger issue is more tonal balance / timber / sound signature......etc. Then after that I think "broadly speaking" each technology obviously has its strengths and weaknesses. Like delta sigma (AKM, ESS....etc) is better at detail retrieval and R2R is better at imaging and soundstage (more 3D per say) and Multibit is said to be about middle ground.

The Topping and SMSL dacs you listed are all delta sigma dacs so they're probably good at details but some might complain it might sound more "digital" vs the R2R dacs in similar price range. But again implementation is important so this is just "speaking generally".

Oh so Schiit just announced their Unison USB Multibit DAC Card, so now you can have Modi Multibit 2 level of dac inside your amp. For example you can get Rag 2 + Multibit DAC Card now.

https://www.schiit.com/products/true-multibit-unison-usb-card

I have a Lyr 3 now I wonder if I want to get this to make it a dac/amp combo just for fun LOL.

That being said, I sold my MMB2 and went back to SDAC (AK4452), to me SDAC sounds richer/thicker (MMB2 is more clean) but yes MMB2 has better details. So at this point I would almost say there's no straightforward way to pick dacs anymore LOL. I'm sacrificing certain aspects to gain certain aspects where I value more.

It's like those designer diagram Money x Fast x Good and you can only pick 2 LOL.

Maybe figure out what's most important to you then you can pick the type of dac that suits you more if that makes sense (i.e. do you want clean sound or thick/rich sound also how much you value timber vs detail retrieval.......etc, or if you want more relax/natural sounding or do you want laser to your ears where you can hear the grass grow.....etc).

EDIT1: Forgot to say Topping dacs tend to be quite linear and measure super well, so if you like neutral / super detailed sound then Topping is good choice. I don't like neutral sound so I steer away from Topping dacs LOL, but everyone have different preferences so I can still see the appeal. D90 is probably going to be the most detailed dac ever. SMSL tend to be a bit slightly less analytical than Topping dacs.

EDIT2: If you're worried about shipping/import cost you can always look into Canuck Audio Mart, there are a lot of local deals for cheaper.

Thanks very much Hyde for your reply. You gave me a lot to chew on and a lot of valuable information due to your experience.

I have been looking at CAM for some deals.

It would be great to have two different sounding dacs (each having a desired signature) to switch back and forth depending on mood and track. I wonder how I could do that on the fly? I would have to have two usb ports on my desktop MB - I think - I now only have one on my MSI board...........I'd have to think this one through.

Hyde, could you give me a few ideas on some R2R Dacs that have been implemented well? Appreciate it. Some that are in the price range of the Schiit MMB2 and BF2/64.

Hyde, you said that you went back to SDAC (AK4452). Can you tell me about this piece, what it is and how much? Is that an R2R?

Thanks again fellow Canadian - "The true north strong and free"......at least at one point in time.

 

[Hyde00]

Thanks very much Hyde for your reply. You gave me a lot to chew on and a lot of valuable information due to your experience.

LOL ah yes my experience buy dac, does not like, cry some men tears, sell it, repeat many times until wallet gives up.

It would be great to have two different sounding dacs (each having a desired signature) to switch back and forth depending on mood and track. I wonder how I could do that on the fly? I would have to have two usb ports on my desktop MB - I think - I now only have one on my MSI board...........I'd have to think this one through.

I think to compare 2 dacs you need something like the Schiit Sys.

https://www.schiit.com/products/sys

Though this only support single ended, does your unit need XLR (balanced) or it's only RCA (single ended)?

This would also help us figure out if you even need balanced dacs.

Hyde, could you give me a few ideas on some R2R Dacs that have been implemented well? Appreciate it. Some that are in the price range of the Schiit MMB2 and BF2/64.

HMMMMMMM the tricky thing is that generally speaking, R2R are expensive to make. So there really isn't much "budget" R2R dacs out there. The only ones I can think of off my head are:

MMB1
MMB2
EF400
BF2 OG
BF2/64
Denafrips Ares II
Musician Draco

Though I've read that Denafrips Ares II suppose to pair well with speakers. Some people like it better on speakers than headphone.

Otherwise I'm really hoping other companies would do what Schiit did and make single ended R2R dacs like the Modi Multibit line up.

Hyde, you said that you went back to SDAC (AK4452). Can you tell me about this piece, what it is and how much? Is that an R2R?

Actually it's a really cheap dac LOL. And AK4452 is an AKM chip delta sigma dac.

Grace Design made the SDAC for Drop.
https://drop.com/buy/massdrop-x-grace-design-standard-dac

It's nothing fancy but somehow I really like the tonal balance.

Thanks again fellow Canadian - "The true north strong and free"......at least at one point in time.

lol no problem, glad to help fellow Canadians out! Feel free to shoot me a PM if you have more questions.

Picking a dac is a big task LOL.

 

[2bxfile]

LOL ah yes my experience buy dac, does not like, cry some men tears, sell it, repeat many times until wallet gives up.

I think to compare 2 dacs you need something like the Schiit Sys.

https://www.schiit.com/products/sys

Though this only support single ended, does your unit need XLR (balanced) or it's only RCA (single ended)?

This would also help us figure out if you even need balanced dacs.

HMMMMMMM the tricky thing is that generally speaking, R2R are expensive to make. So there really isn't much "budget" R2R dacs out there. The only ones I can think of off my head are:

MMB1
MMB2
EF400
BF2 OG
BF2/64
Denafrips Ares II
Musician Draco

Though I've read that Denafrips Ares II suppose to pair well with speakers. Some people like it better on speakers than headphone.

Otherwise I'm really hoping other companies would do what Schiit did and make single ended R2R dacs like the Modi Multibit line up.

Actually it's a really cheap dac LOL. And AK4452 is an AKM chip delta sigma dac.

Grace Design made the SDAC for Drop.
https://drop.com/buy/massdrop-x-grace-design-standard-dac

It's nothing fancy but somehow I really like the tonal balance.

lol no problem, glad to help fellow Canadians out! Feel free to shoot me a PM if you have more questions.

Picking a dac is a big task LOL.

Hello Hyde:

Hope all is well. Thanks again for your efforts in offering up so much information for me. Appreciated.

Are you ready for the barrage? Don't faint on me now - well here goes...............

Can you tell me why you sold your MMB2 (R2R)? Was it not warm enough in your opinion? I know that you said it was clean and the SDAC was richer and thicker.

Can you tell me how you found the imaging and soundstage between the two Dacs?

Can you tell me how much the Massdrop X Grace costs all in CDN? Have you had it long enough to say definitively that it's the boy for you?

Would you say, in your opinion, that its sonics (SDAC Grace) punch above its price point?

Finally, have you heard that when dealing with computer derived audio, that balanced will give you less issues than single ended RCA's or, have you had no problems with your MMB2 or SDAC in this regard?

Thanks Hyde.

 

[artur9]

Hello Hyde:

...

Finally, have you heard that when dealing with computer derived audio, that balanced will give you less issues than single ended RCA's or, have you had no problems with your MMB2 or SDAC in this regard?

Balanced is usually an unnecessary expense. Its big benefit is in long cable runs or noisy environments. My HT setup is all balanced because it helps with preventing ground loop hum. I mean, I could fix the hum by actually doing some cable management but life is too short.

One R2R that I've heard of, and which sounds good supposedly, is the Soekris.

My personal preference for DACs chip goes: Schiit MB, Linn, AKM, (far far down the list) ESS.

 

[2bxfile]

Balanced is usually an unnecessary expense. Its big benefit is in long cable runs or noisy environments. My HT setup is all balanced because it helps with preventing ground loop hum. I mean, I could fix the hum by actually doing some cable management but life is too short.

One R2R that I've heard of, and which sounds good supposedly, is the Soekris.

My personal preference for DACs chip goes: Schiit MB, Linn, AKM, (far far down the list) ESS.

Thanks artur - all good information. Now I know that I do not have to have balanced and many times it is an extra cost to the unit. Just as an aside, I'm seriously looking at the Rega Brio all analogue for my new amp. I've heard so many good things about it, but at the same time, the more I research it, the more I find many are hearing a hum/buzz through their system. I was told and also read that it is because of the small form factor giving way to some components being too close to one another.

 

[artur9]

Thanks artur - all good information. Now I know that I do not have to have balanced and many times it is an extra cost to the unit. Just as an aside, I'm seriously looking at the Rega Brio all analogue for my new amp. I've heard so many good things about it, but at the same time, the more I research it, the more I find many are hearing a hum/buzz through their system. I was told and also read that it is because of the small form factor giving way to some components being too close to one another.

T+A has some good mini-components. I have the Amp8 and the Cala, both of which have met expectations. They might be out of your price range (I got mine used). I'm crazy sensitive to hum and I haven't heard any from either.

Looking at competing units might yield some good results.

 

[2bxfile]

T+A has some good mini-components. I have the Amp8 and the Cala, both of which have met expectations. They might be out of your price range (I got mine used). I'm crazy sensitive to hum and I haven't heard any from either.

Looking at competing units might yield some good results.

Sensitive ears are both a blessing and a curse.

You are correct, those suggestions look like they drip money - you are lucky to have them.