[33na3rd]

Is the noise floor prominent on 4x gain ? I’m think about a Kara and was wondering about this anyone have an input ?

Kara is quiet in 4x mode.
If you have a noisy source it may be more apparent in 4x mode because the source is being amplified, but the noise is not coming from Kara.

I have three sources, a DAC and two phono units. The DAC and phono unit @42dB are completely silent in 4x mode. The other phono unit, currently set @54dB, can be heard slightly at high volume levels in 4x mode when testing for noise. But these are at levels that I would never listen to music at. Again, this noise is from the phono unit, not from Kara. I've never heard noise from Kara when listening to music.

 

[decooney]

Reading lots of comments about Kara having "more weight, clarity" and yet none to much about things like it maybe having a nice "tone, or texture, or midrange body", nada ???. Stuff we might normally read on other forums about high fidelity preamplifiers and linestanges people spend more $ on. Sure everyone says the preamp should not add anything. Okay, maybe that works for some, yet those preamps seem to get resold faster imo, and folks are on to the next preamp to try.

While I can appreciate a nice clean neutral preamp, if it's lacking some character and engaging type of sound to keep one interested, it's just another preamp in the pile for me. It's nice, yet I'm not into Freya + with tubes, already having other nice 6SN7 tube preamps. Was hoping someone might describe more than weight or clarity, or I totally missed it with Kara. Would like to consider trying Kara, but not convinced yet.

??
Any other comments or comparisons to reference back to or links? [thanks in advance for other helpful and sound related replies].

 

[adias]

Reading lots of comments about Kara having "more weight, clarity" and yet none to much about things like it maybe having a nice "tone, or texture, or midrange body", nada ???. Stuff we might normally read on other forums about high fidelity preamplifiers and linestanges people spend more $ on. Sure everyone says the preamp should not add anything. Okay, maybe that works for some, yet those preamps seem to get resold faster imo, and folks are on to the next preamp to try.

While I can appreciate a nice clean neutral preamp, if it's lacking some character and engaging type of sound to keep one interested, it's just another preamp in the pile for me. It's nice, yet I'm not into Freya + with tubes, already having other nice 6SN7 tube preamps. Was hoping someone might describe more than weight or clarity, or I totally missed it with Kara. Would like to consider trying Kara, but not convinced yet.

??
Any other comments or comparisons to reference back to or links? [thanks in advance for other helpful and sound related replies].

Ok… order one. Try it for 2 weeks. Like it, keep it. Don’t, return it.

Do not rely on what others tell you. Decide for yourself.

 

[decooney]

Ok… order one. Try it for 2 weeks. Like it, keep it. Don’t, return it.

Do not rely on what others tell you. Decide for yourself.

Thanks, yep - been down that path with Schiit before. Found out they claim there is "no break in period", yet on my last round of DACs and such, the settling in period went beyond 14 days. And yet we read here the sound improved after 14 days even more. I'm not a reviewer, and looking for best preamp I can get for under $1,000 or may step up to under $2,000 for a second system I put in rotation once in a while. Kara looks good on paper, just hoping to learn more from all of you trying it out. Just went through the same with dacs, and the Schiit got resold in favor of something more enjoyable to listen to, fwtw. Oh well, thanks anyhow.

 

[33na3rd]

Reading lots of comments about Kara having "more weight, clarity" and yet none to much about things like it maybe having a nice "tone, or texture, or midrange body", nada ???. Stuff we might normally read on other forums about high fidelity preamplifiers and linestanges people spend more $ on. Sure everyone says the preamp should not add anything. Okay, maybe that works for some, yet those preamps seem to get resold faster imo, and folks are on to the next preamp to try.

While I can appreciate a nice clean neutral preamp, if it's lacking some character and engaging type of sound to keep one interested, it's just another preamp in the pile for me. It's nice, yet I'm not into Freya + with tubes, already having other nice 6SN7 tube preamps. Was hoping someone might describe more than weight or clarity, or I totally missed it with Kara. Would like to consider trying Kara, but not convinced yet.

??
Any other comments or comparisons to reference back to or links? [thanks in advance for other helpful and sound related replies].

I get what you're saying. But I'm afraid that I can't really help you there.

Kara is extremely transparent. To me, transparent is the highest praise that a preamp can receive. When I'm looking for color, I tend to look for it in my sources and loudspeakers. I want my electronics to be neutral.

I don't know if this will help or not, but my favorite preamp that I have owned is my highly modified Melos SHA Gold.
Kara is my second favorite, and comes very close to the Melos.
Kara gets used everyday because it sounds good and is reliable. Kara is my daily driver.
Kara may end up being my favorite...

I think that you're absolutely correct about 15 days being too short for a component to settle in.
My Kara took at least three weeks.
My Yggy + GS2 took a little over one month.
My Bifrost 2 OG took almost 2 months.

But, all of the above did improve within the first two weeks, giving me a glimpse of what was to come.

Kara is great, but unfortunately I lack the vocabulary to convey just how great it is.

 

[decooney]

@33na3rd yep, that's perfect, you answered my question indirectly and a way I can relate to regarding the Melos still holding primary position, even if its close. Got it, thanks for the writeup. I was trying to avoid having to do a fully upgraded Threshold or Pass or others on my radar, for system 2. Will stick with the original gameplan then I think.

 

[adias]

I get what you're saying. But I'm afraid that I can't really help you there.

Kara is extremely transparent. To me, transparent is the highest praise that a preamp can receive. When I'm looking for color, I tend to look for it in my sources and loudspeakers. I want my electronics to be neutral.

I don't know if this will help or not, but my favorite preamp that I have owned is my highly modified Melos SHA Gold.
Kara is my second favorite, and comes very close to the Melos.
Kara gets used everyday because it sounds good and is reliable. Kara is my daily driver.
Kara may end up being my favorite...

I think that you're absolutely correct about 15 days being too short for a component to settle in.
My Kara took at least three weeks.
My Yggy + GS2 took a little over one month.
My Bifrost 2 OG took almost 2 months.

But, all of the above did improve within the first two weeks, giving me a glimpse of what was to come.

Kara is great, but unfortunately I lack the vocabulary to convey just how great it is.

I agree. A colored system colors all music the same way. A neutral system lets each track shine with its own color.

Kara has 3 flavors. Passive is colorless but it depends on associated component impedances. x1 buffer gain is neutral. x4 12dB gain is slightly warm but still very neutral. I did not think Kara required a long burn-in.

 

[adias]

@33na3rd yep, that's perfect, you answered my question indirectly and a way I can relate to regarding the Melos still holding primary position, even if its close. Got it, thanks for the writeup. I was trying to avoid having to do a fully upgraded Threshold or Pass or others on my radar, for system 2. Will stick with the original gameplan then I think.

Curious… can you tell us the details of the component pipelines in your 2 systems? Sources, amplification, transducers.

You clearly have strong component opinions and we might learn from those choices.

 

[Bowmoreman]

Reading lots of comments about Kara having "more weight, clarity" and yet none to much about things like it maybe having a nice "tone, or texture, or midrange body", nada ???. Stuff we might normally read on other forums about high fidelity preamplifiers and linestanges people spend more $ on. Sure everyone says the preamp should not add anything. Okay, maybe that works for some, yet those preamps seem to get resold faster imo, and folks are on to the next preamp to try.

While I can appreciate a nice clean neutral preamp, if it's lacking some character and engaging type of sound to keep one interested, it's just another preamp in the pile for me. It's nice, yet I'm not into Freya + with tubes, already having other nice 6SN7 tube preamps. Was hoping someone might describe more than weight or clarity, or I totally missed it with Kara. Would like to consider trying Kara, but not convinced yet.

??
Any other comments or comparisons to reference back to or links? [thanks in advance for other helpful and sound related replies].

So, here’s how I would put it (with almost 2 months on my Kara now) spanning LP and CD playbacks

1. Kara doesn’t seem to add/change “tone”, “texture”, or “midrange body” on its own. It’s NEUTRAL about these… your source will be the tell. Period.

2. It is absolutely “self silent”. yeah, I can hear noise if I have my Skoll on 70dB gain, and Kara on 4X, and I crank volume to 15:00… barely it’s like thermal noise of the moving coil doing nothing… it is quiet…. QUIET, hear me?

3. It has made all my NORMAL engaging music, regardless of source/type, MORE engaging. Like a sonic “spotlight” INTO all the various aspects of micro and macro-dynamics, staging/soundscape, dimensionality, etc. From Kraftwerk or Robbie Robertson, to Enya or Kate Bush, to Rammstein or Rush, Prokofiev to Rachmaninov, Davis or Art Pepper… pretty much any of my great recordings have all strutted their particular “stuffs”…

I raced it (best I could) against my Classe’ DR6. As a phono combo, Kara/Skoll is easily the equal of the DR6; and bettered it in some areas (noise floor especially). Over the decades I’ve own/used things like NAD, Adcom, ARC SP3 and SP6, and Classe’ (auditioned far more in my home rigs and friends setups).

My memories and instincts are very much reminded of the early, class-A, ML gear from the late 1970’s (JCP? ML3?) sound, except without all the ML “dark” (that’s what we called it back then). There is a natural “unctuousness” to its sound: music just flows, naturally and powerfully.

@Jason Stoddard and team have built an extremely impressive pre-amp. World-class at the price. Bravo!

All I could ask for would be: a) a Balance control, b) perhaps another seat of balanced In/Out, and c) a volume pot that didn’t sound like it was being electrocuted every time it moves one step… <grin> (and yes, I know some of those would mean MOAR $$).

For the record, my main chain: Denon 301II/SME/Sota Star Sapphire>Skoll via balanced (LP). Cambridge Audio Azur751BD (Digital). Pre: Kara (via XLR, replacing Classe DR6 which is in queue to be re-capped), Amp: Classe’ DR9>Apogee Duetta Signature… cans: Koss ESP950. I’ve had the main chain (minus The Schitt schtuff) for 34 years, and know it’s beguiling and musicality (go team RIBBONS!) characteristics very, very well.

Kara rocks; I dare say end-game for those with a speaker based main system.

 

[Adam Balm]

Jason nailed it too..."Kara kills Freya S"

 

[decooney]

@Bowmoreman ..."Kara rocks; I dare say end-game for those with a speaker based main system".

On that note, It's possible what I'm looking for is a preamp at [Tyr amp level] of design, quality, and craftsmanship - and equivalent type feedback from customers.

If/when that occurs, it would be quite fun for this type of future preamp to assume the primary position in my main system. Will keep an eye out down the road

 

[adias]

On that note, It's possible what I'm looking for is a preamp at [Tyr amp level] of design, quality, and craftsmanship - and equivalent type feedback from customers.

If/when that occurs, it would be quite fun for this type of future preamp to assume the primary position in my main system. Will keep an eye out down the road

My Kara drives Tyrs… and yeah the synergy is there and Kara is Schiit top tier.

 

[decooney]

@adias My Kara drives Tyrs… and yeah the synergy is there and Kara is Schiit top tier.

Nice! Like the Tyr! Pretty cool. I thought about demoing a pair of Tyr amps just to try them with my custom designed speakers, in place of my existing tube mono blocks and paired with my triode tube preamp. For preamps, what I'm referring to is this type of example. Pairing Tyr amps up with a really good quad 6SN7 Triode true Class A preamp [or better] and hearing the difference. i.e. what I use now, mostly, past 5 years. Then, designing a solid state Class A preamp for Tyr that can attempt to match this type of engaging level of sound without running any tubes at all. While it's not going to be the same, it's a fun target and goal. I keep going to back to my tube preamp paired with my current Class A 50w SS amp or my tube mono blocks. I would not mind owning a really nice SS preamp to put in play and pull my triode quad 6SN7 preamp out of the mix once in a while.

I'm one of these so called golden-era diehards, stuck in the past to some degree, old school perhaps. LESS into modern hi-fi sound -or- any type of overly-precise or extra detailed type of sound. Can't stand it really. Hurts my ears and brain perhaps. Tyr originally caught my attention due to some of the attributes they were going for in the design. Give me an old set of cursive writing Toshiba Mosfet OPTs in my amps, and I'm golden. Got those in an older modified and upgraded Pass/Forte' Class A 50w amp i run now. Some custom stuff going on, with help from a few friends. Yep, and its warm and toasty, just how we like it, bias up. Still looking for another ss preamp to try, nothing serious, just fun. Enjoy the Tyr amps and the Kara! Sounds like fun.

 

[adias]

Nice! Like the Tyr! Pretty cool. I thought about demoing a pair of Tyr amps just to try them with my custom designed speakers, in place of my existing tube mono blocks and paired with my triode tube preamp. For preamps, what I'm referring to is this type of example. Pairing Tyr amps up with a really good quad 6SN7 Triode true Class A preamp [or better] and hearing the difference. i.e. what I use now, mostly, past 5 years. Then, designing a solid state Class A preamp for Tyr that can attempt to match this type of engaging level of sound without running any tubes at all. While it's not going to be the same, it's a fun target and goal. I keep going to back to my tube preamp paired with my current Class A 50w SS amp or my tube mono blocks. I would not mind owning a really nice SS preamp to put in play and pull my triode quad 6SN7 preamp out of the mix once in a while.

I'm one of these so called golden-era diehards, stuck in the past to some degree, old school perhaps. LESS into modern hi-fi sound -or- any type of overly-precise or extra detailed type of sound. Can't stand it really. Hurts my ears and brain perhaps. Tyr originally caught my attention due to some of the attributes they were going for in the design. Give me an old set of cursive writing Toshiba Mosfet OPTs in my amps, and I'm golden. Got those in an older modified and upgraded Pass/Forte' Class A 50w amp i run now. Some custom stuff going on, with help from a few friends. Yep, and it’s warm and toasty, just how we like it, bias up. Still looking for another ss preamp to try, nothing serious, just fun. Enjoy the Tyr amps and the Kara! Sounds like fun.

With respect… I suspect your quest is theoretical. You like warm, second order harmonic, colored sound. As a reference, I do not. I suspect what you have is what you like.

 

[decooney]

With respect… I suspect your quest is theoretical. You like warm, second order harmonic, colored sound. As a reference, I do not. I suspect what you have is what you like.

More of a natural sound. Musician is in the room. When piano keys and guitar strings sound realistic. When going to the high-end audio shows with a group of friends, it does not take long to separate the sound rooms from the music rooms. Anything overly-precise, or oversampled, we are headed for the EXIT door.

For example, I was in the Non-Oversampling NOS filter mode camp when evaluating a Schiit Bifrost 2/64 dac. Nice for the $. On this forum, the other camp preferred the Mega Combo Burrito (MCB) filter mode. MCB filter mode had extra detail, more bass boom, less natural sounding, a little over-processed sounding to me for my system, speakers, and room. And yet could be the best for someone else's system, with less efficient speakers, or a dead sounding room.
As I recall, there was me and only one other guy on this forum in a thread who liked NOS mode more. All of the rest preferred MCB filter mode. Interesting.

Visited with my local area audio dealer this weekend. He's been in business since 1967, close to 57 years in operation. You go into this place, open 2-3 days a week, and what you see is people sitting and listening to music, up to 4-5 hours at a time. Truly natural sounding. Clearly a formula for success after 57 years.