[Ripper2860]

I'm in a large apartment building in NYC, and there has been heavy, deep construction for two years a few dozen feet from my place. Last year, over months, I noticed our lights flickering subtly, which I assumed was a building-wide issue related to the construction. I was curious if this affected my audio equipment, but was unwilling to spend much, and picked up an AudioQuest Niagara 1200 during a sale. As far as I could tell it made no difference versus the wall power on any of my headphone or 2-channel equipment - at the time Schiit Asgard 3, Folkvangr, a Woo WA3, and Naim Supernait 2, all on their regular power cords. The background was just as quiet as before. Eventually we had a sudden, severe brownout, which prompted us moving out and several days of electrician work at the circuit box. I have no idea what was actually wrong, but I had a new (painted) hole in the wall when I returned. Now our power is normal again. The sound is the same as it ever was. To us, true, dramatic power issues had no audible consequences during the months they were occurring, nor did entry-level-fancy ~$1K power equipment. If I were going to spend $$$ to "clean up" sound, I would buy a bigger, nicer rug.

That's some nice gear so it would seem that your ears are not resolving enough if there was no audible difference.

Seriously though - I would never spend $$$ on power conditioning. $$ maybe, but never $$$.

OK- seriously, serious. I really think it's just mostly unfounded nervosa in my case. Power is pretty stable (for Texas) and I've taken reasonable precautions to get reasonably clean power short of a dedicated circuit. After that it's probably more bang for the buck for me to do some basic wire management keeping power cords away from signal cables, etc.

(BTW - Let me know if you decide to sell your Niagra 1200 for $$.).

 

[Pandahead]

Yes, the actual use case for a "power regenerator" is unstable source voltage or frequency. Think running your house off a diesel generator that has a poor speed governor system or a bad voltage controller. In other words, very limited indeed. The only time I have ever recommended such devices was when my little brother was in the Navy and brought back a bunch of 100V gear from Japan and he was concerned the +/- 10% fluctuations off 120V he frequently suffered in Lemore CA would harm his new toys. A power regulation system capable of the wattage he needed was a reasonable purchase for him. Other than those sorts of usages, it's a product in search of an application.

Based on your validation of Jason's statement about regeneration (not a device that might limit the current, type dealie filter thingies) and in order to educate the masses, what is your professional guesstimate based on what you think the US power grid in general is for head-fi and 2 channel folks that plugging directly into a wall socket is the best it's going to get.

So high that even trying a device on a trial basis is 99.999% of the time a guaranteed waste of time?

Because in a lifetime of giving hi-fi advice so far there is only one instance that plugging into the wall isn't as good as it gets and that's based on 100V gear.

Have you ever been curious to try a regenerative device? Or are you positive there's no point in trying one. If you have tried and feel comfortable the model/ manufacturers.


And, the same question to Jason how many regenerative devices have you tried, probably only with Schiit gear and if you feel comfortable the model/manufacturers.

Come to think of it, doesn't Dave have something he's invented and swears it improves stuff?

 

[Paladin79]

After all of the numerous projects that you completed this year, and dealing with difficult customers, send yourself on a well deserved vacation [or maybe a staycation].

The majority of my hobby is fun. I will relax over Xmas and New Years after I build some breadboards for a young woman starting a bakery.

Finnegan stays busy removing ornaments from our Christmas tree.

 

[jonathan c]

The majority of my hobby is fun. I will relax over Xmas and New Years after I build some breadboards for a young woman starting a bakery.

Finnegan stays busy removing ornaments from our Christmas tree.

Does Finnegan know that Telefunken G-73R pairs make great stocking socket stuffers for Dad?

 

[tincanear]

Can someone else here for the sake of my question that has a Freya and a pair of Aegirs just take a couple minutes and hook up your your system the way I described so I can get a "hmm that's strange it does seem to work fine" for a little clairity on this subject.

For ifi RCA out to Freya, Freya XLR out to dual Aegir (OG):
20W/speaker in passive gain mode, 80W/speaker in tube or active FET differential buffer mode. Perhaps Jason was thinking about not-yet-released Aegir2. Or a “little” pre-occupied with getting the last-minute holiday orders out in time for shipping. IIRC one year around this time, Jason was on the manufacturing floor building products.

(Added)
@acrosounder. You can test this easily: in freya passive mode, move the negative (black) speaker wire from the red binding post to the black (grounded) one, should be no change in volume

 

[corndog71]

I’ve lived in 10 apartments over the last 26 years. Most were fine power wise but a few of them were problematic. One had DC on the line that no conditioner or filter could remedy. A couple were noisy and filters did help.
Now I’m in a house which seems to have pretty clean power.

I have power filters / surge suppressors from PS Audio ( non regenerator), Blue Circle, Tripp Lite, Iso-Tek, Van Alstine, and Monster.

 

[GumbyDammit223]

We have 220V as a basis here in the Netherlands. The last decade it has gone up to 230V.
Now with wind generators and solar panels an offset of 10% is allowed (and pretty normal) by the utility companies. Because of massive problems on the grid they want to go 15% max offset. That could mean 265V max instead of the "old" 220V.
Now look at my Quad ESL-63's designed for 220V in the 80's.
They have a transformer and Cockroft-Walton multiplier to create bias voltage for the charge on the Mylar diaphragm. That just goes up linear with the grid voltage. It goes from 5.2 KV to 6.25 KV. It will go louder.... For a short period. Still thinking how to solve that in very limited space.

All of our laser power supplies designed for AC mains input must be capable of running +/- 10% around nominal line voltage, be it 120 or 220 VAC (with special consideration for Japanese AC). Some of the older power supplies designed by the parent company have their output vary in proportion to the 3-phase line input. For example, I could have a laser running fine at 100 Hz off of the nominal 208 3-phase in the lab, but push the PRF to 200 Hz, it will fault out. That's why I have a 3-phase boost transformer setup under my optical table wired for 240 VAC out. Then, 200 Hz isn't a problem. Unfortunately those power supplies haven't blown themselves up yet, so I can't technically obsolete that product line!

 

[Ableza]

Based on your validation of Jason's statement about regeneration (not a device that might limit the current, type dealie filter thingies) and in order to educate the masses, what is your professional guesstimate based on what you think the US power grid in general is for head-fi and 2 channel folks that plugging directly into a wall socket is the best it's going to get.

So high that even trying a device on a trial basis is 99.999% of the time a guaranteed waste of time?

Because in a lifetime of giving hi-fi advice so far there is only one instance that plugging into the wall isn't as good as it gets and that's based on 100V gear.

Have you ever been curious to try a regenerative device? Or are you positive there's no point in trying one. If you have tried and feel comfortable the model/ manufacturers.


And, the same question to Jason how many regenerative devices have you tried, probably only with Schiit gear and if you feel comfortable the model/manufacturers.

Come to think of it, doesn't Dave have something he's invented and swears it improves stuff?

I'm not sure what you are trying to say or ask, but in general any competently designed piece of audio gear sold in the US (not imported directly from off shore but actually intended to be sold here) will include a power supply sufficient to provide the voltage and current the device needs based on the standard variation around the 240-V US power grid. If it doesn't, then it's a crap piece of gear.

Can some people detect "improvements" based on power regurgitation systems? Sure, why not, who am I to say what someone else is going to perceive or believe? But from a technical point of view such devices are wastes of money except in extreme circumstances.

-edit - And of course there are instances where power filters are required - I use them - because of other issues in the house. But that's not the topic. We are talking about power regeneration devices.

 

[Ableza]

All of our laser power supplies designed for AC mains input must be capable of running +/- 10% around nominal line voltage, be it 120 or 220 VAC (with special consideration for Japanese AC). Some of the older power supplies designed by the parent company have their output vary in proportion to the 3-phase line input. For example, I could have a laser running fine at 100 Hz off of the nominal 208 3-phase in the lab, but push the PRF to 200 Hz, it will fault out. That's why I have a 3-phase boost transformer setup under my optical table wired for 240 VAC out. Then, 200 Hz isn't a problem. Unfortunately those power supplies haven't blown themselves up yet, so I can't technically obsolete that product line!

Ditto. I just finished an installation with $8 million worth of laser-cutting metal fabrication equipment, and the input voltage has to be within 5% of 480V. We installed transformers at each machine location to compensate for possible utility voltage droop.

 

[landwatersky]

Just curious if any of you use Urd into the Holo May KTE? Before I pull the trigger on the URD, I'd really like to know which USB cables perform well with the May. I did do a search through the 8874 pages of this thread but I didn't turn anything up. (PS: I think 8874 pages is the largest thread I have ever seen on any website since the beginning of the WWW )

 

[Ableza]

I'm in a large apartment building in NYC, and there has been heavy, deep construction for two years a few dozen feet from my place. Last year, over months, I noticed our lights flickering subtly, which I assumed was a building-wide issue related to the construction. I was curious if this affected my audio equipment, but was unwilling to spend much, and picked up an AudioQuest Niagara 1200 during a sale. As far as I could tell it made no difference versus the wall power on any of my headphone or 2-channel equipment - at the time Schiit Asgard 3, Folkvangr, a Woo WA3, and Naim Supernait 2, all on their regular power cords. The background was just as quiet as before. Eventually we had a sudden, severe brownout, which prompted us moving out and several days of electrician work at the circuit box. I have no idea what was actually wrong, but I had a new (painted) hole in the wall when I returned. Now our power is normal again. The sound is the same as it ever was. To us, true, dramatic power issues had no audible consequences during the months they were occurring, nor did entry-level-fancy ~$1K power equipment. If I were going to spend $$$ to "clean up" sound, I would buy a bigger, nicer rug.

A good story, thanks.

 

[Ripper2860]

OK -- non-audio related (I know)...

So we will be going to a party this evening for our niece that just graduated college with a degree in education. It's a casual affair and the wife walks in with a pair of designer jeans that are literally shredded. I just shook my head and posed the question...

Why do people pay exorbitant amounts of money for jeans that look like they belong to someone with no money??

And folks think audiophiles are nuts.

** What do you know I managed to tie it back to audio!

 

[Ableza]

Just curious if any of you use Urd into the Holo May KTE? Before I pull the trigger on the URD, I'd really like to know which USB cables perform well with the May. I did do a search through the 8874 pages of this thread but I didn't turn anything up. (PS: I think 8874 pages is the largest thread I have ever seen on any website since the beginning of the WWW )

What kind of USB input does it have? The URD is USB-C out, so you will need USB-C to whatever that machine requires.

 

[DougD]

So if a DAC has a unique sound signature and a pre-amp and amp also have unique sound signatures as well gain stages and perhaps level controls, then if you go with the highest gain or level settings on pre-amp and amp, are you not attenuating the signature of the DAC, and by the same token are you attenuating the signature of the amp and pre-amp when running the inverse where the dac is not seeing gain stages or increased power level controls?

This is not a philosophical question that can be answered by logic, nor is it a question that can be solved by the wisdom of the crowds.

For any given combo of a DAC + Amp + Headphones, you'll typically only have two user choices ... low gain or high gain.
* If your brain tells you that low gain sounds better, that is the right choice for you.
* If your brain tells you that high gain sounds better, that is the right choice for you.
* If you are not sure which you like the most, either it doesn't matter, or you need to run the experiment longer.

If the answer also depends on what you are listening to, then it's good to have choices.

 

[566854]

I plugged the main system into an ANKER 767 power station for half an hour or so, I thought the system performed better. Not a suitable use case unless you already have one for other reasons and you do not mind a small tank in your listening space.