[gikigill]

Two Valis cost about AUD$300. The same here would be $450.

 

[wink]

What a laugh - Valli of the drolls......

 

[teofilrocks]

I'd like to know the story behind Schiit choosing to use flimsy little toggles on the back of all their gear. You have to buy the $1,700 Ragnarok to get a proper switch. 

 

 

[jimmers]

  I'd like to know the story behind Schiit choosing to use flimsy little toggles on the back of all their gear. You have to buy the $1,700 Ragnarok to get a proper switch. 

 

Are the toggles really flimsy?
I imagine these switches are used because they are PCB mount, I doubt the cost of the Ragnarok chassis mounted switch/fuse/socket was a consideration as I bought 10 of them for less than $20 shipped, more likely the cost of wiring them to the circuitry.
 
Edit: Typo

 

[Ableza]

I don't understand this obsession with power switches. If they do the job what does it matter? And no they are not flimsy.

 

[swannie007]

If you had a stack of gear in a small/tight space, then you might understand the obsession with wanting the bloody power switch on the front! Rear mounted power switches are a pain in the arse!

 

[StanD]

If you had a stack of gear in a small/tight space, then you might understand the obsession with wanting the bloody power switch on the front! Rear mounted power switches are a pain in the arse!

Yep, Banana Benders and Cane Toads insist upon big switches. 

 
Yes those little rear mounted switches are a pain in the butt. At least they don't require frequent operation.

 

[teofilrocks]

Are the toggles really flimsy?
I imagine these switches are used because they are PCB mount, I doubt the cost of the Ragnarok chassis mounted switch/fuse/socket was a consideration as I bought 10 of them for less than $20 shipped, more likely the cost of wiring them to the circuitry.

Ah, hadn't thought of PCB mount.

I don't understand this obsession with power switches. If they do the job what does it matter? And no they are not flimsy.

I wouldn't call what I have an obsession. Perhaps your thought is coming from somewhere else or was discussed earlier, I'm not sure. But I think the "if they do the job what does it matter" philosophy is a funny one to bring up on a forum that agonizes over the little differences in sound reproduction. Things like a how solid a piece of gear feels, even the power switch, is relevant to some, and they have a tendency to collect in places like this and around companies that care about the physical design of their products. Seems understandable enough to me.

 

[judmarc]

Ah, hadn't thought of PCB mount.
I wouldn't call what I have an obsession. Perhaps your thought is coming from somewhere else or was discussed earlier, I'm not sure. But I think the "if they do the job what does it matter" philosophy is a funny one to bring up on a forum that agonizes over the little differences in sound reproduction. Things like a how solid a piece of gear feels, even the power switch, is relevant to some, and they have a tendency to collect in places like this and around companies that care about the physical design of their products. Seems understandable enough to me.

I think the "no they are not flimsy" part of Ableza's absolutely accurate reply was most germane. Unless you have managed to break one with normal use or know anyone who has (which, having owned a Bifrost, seems to me near impossible), why would you use such an inappropriate adjective?

 

[StanD]

This type of switch has been in common use for decades and has over time proven to be rugged. You can find much larger switches that are constructed poorly. Small doesn't mean junk, these have the parts that see force made of metal, not plastic. IMO, one can make a functional argument over the placement of the switches as to user convenience but not to its quality.

 

[teofilrocks]

I think the "no they are not flimsy" part of Ableza's absolutely accurate reply was most germane. Unless you have managed to break one with normal use or know anyone who has (which, having owned a Bifrost, seems to me near impossible), why would you use such an inappropriate adjective?

Inappropriate? Lol.

I can only use the words that come to mind, naturally. The switch on the back of the Schiit gear I have/have had makes me think of two words "cheap" and "flimsy". The fact that I haven't broken one of the toggles yet doesn't keep those words from coming to mind, especially after looking up the definition of "flimsy" again just to check myself. I've built lamps using toggle switches that are quite solid and sturdy feeling. That is not what this feels like.

 

[johnjen]

Ah, hadn't thought of PCB mount.
I wouldn't call what I have an obsession. Perhaps your thought is coming from somewhere else or was discussed earlier, I'm not sure. But I think the "if they do the job what does it matter" philosophy is a funny one to bring up on a forum that agonizes over the little differences in sound reproduction. Things like a how solid a piece of gear feels, even the power switch, is relevant to some, and they have a tendency to collect in places like this and around companies that care about the physical design of their products. Seems understandable enough to me.

Schiit's design emphasizes functionality and performance at price points that are hard to match.
Part of functionality is the price, as in if you can't afford it, it's not very functional, for you.
Another part of functionality is the quality/throughness of the design, as in how can it perform at its best, given the contraints of all the parameters involved, (price, intended market, competition, etc.). 
 
So, "But I think the "if they do the job what does it matter" philosophy is a funny one to bring up on a forum that agonizes over the little differences in sound reproduction.", is true except that Schiit "agonizes over the little differences in sound reproduction" far more than amenities such as "flimsy little toggles", which are not flimsy.
 
My Mojo amp has one of these "little toggles" and it works quite well, is quite stout and I see no need to 'fix something that ain't broke'.
 
It's a switch, it works, it does it's part in allowing better parts to be used elsewhere while keeping the selling price the same.
 
And if the switch is a deal breaker, then, 'there are plenty of other products to choose from'.
 
Enough said, at least from me.
 
JJ

 

[Chris J]

Inappropriate? Lol.

I can only use the words that come to mind, naturally. The switch on the back of the Schiit gear I have/have had makes me think of two words "cheap" and "flimsy". The fact that I haven't broken one of the toggles yet doesn't keep those words from coming to mind, especially after looking up the definition of "flimsy" again just to check myself. I've built lamps using toggle switches that are quite solid and sturdy feeling. That is not what this feels like.

Maybe the lamp draws more current then a DAC?
Hmmm.....quite possible.
Yes, quite possible.

I'm sure the toggle switches specified by Schiit have the appropriate electrical ratings for the job.

 

[teofilrocks]

What can I say? I find the toggle is small, lightweight, and insubstantial in feel - pretty close to the definition of flimsy, just not easily damaged in my experience. I'm not saying Schiit is a cheapskate company for using it and I didn't say I wouldn't buy another Schiit product because of it. I'm saying that the little toggle switch is not what I'd expect from a $750 DAC or amp when looking at some of the other products out there or considering some of the other attention the physical design of these units receive. I'm sure there's a reason this part was selected, and I'm wondering what that reason is. Not complicated, or serious, as you could tell by my googley eyes and tongue-sticking-out face.

Edit: Not that I haven't gotten any good guesses. The PCB thought is good and the "putting that money into better audio components" is logical as well.

 

[teofilrocks]

Maybe the lamp draws more current then a DAC?
Hmmm.....quite possible.
Yes, quite possible.

I'm sure the toggle switches specified by Schiit have the appropriate electrical ratings for the job.

Lol. Yes, quite possibly, haha (though they were purposefully over-sized even for low-voltage lamp). Although I'm using the Wyrd so I'm confident I've the full 5V pumping through.