[joenetic]

Thanks for all experience share ! I always keep Bifrost 2 turn on, I will listen to it again by this weekend.

 

[Quiz]

Between the Saga+ and Midgard, which would be better as a preamp for the Bifrost 2/64 and some JBL LSR305 studio monitors? What makes the Saga+ more expensive than the Midgard and will there be any sound quality differences?

 

[Daniel Johnston]

Between the Saga+ and Midgard, which would be better as a preamp for the Bifrost 2/64 and some JBL LSR305 studio monitors? What makes the Saga+ more expensive than the Midgard and will there be any sound quality differences?

Saga+ is a dedecated tube buffer preamp and midgard is a headphone amp that you can use as a preamp. Most if not all Schiit headphone amps can be used as preamps into external amplifiers/powered speakers.

Since you ruled out using passive mode with your active monitors, you are committing yourself with tubes in the Saga+. Midgard is SS and mainly a heaphone amp.

Saga+:
Inputs: 5 RCA pairs, selectable via front switch or remote
Outputs: 2 RCA pairs, selectable via front switch or remote
Buffer Stage: Hybrid push-pull tube-BJT buffer stage with equalized transconductance
Volume Control: relay-switched stepped attenuator with discrete thin-film resistors , 64 1dB steps
Power Supply: One 24VA transformer with regulated +/-100V rails, plus 6.3VDC heaters and 5VDC for microprocessor

The Saga+ is a spectacular preamp. If you want to experiment with tubes and have basic preamp functions, try the Vali3. If you want SS, cheap, and good get the Magni Unity.

 

[tincanear]

Between the Saga+ and Midgard, which would be better as a preamp for the Bifrost 2/64 and some JBL LSR305 studio monitors? What makes the Saga+ more expensive than the Midgard and will there be any sound quality differences?

Saga+ (and the now-discontinued Saga S which is all solid-state, no tubes) both have remote control of volume and source selection too (Midgard doesn't have remote control, but does have balanced XLR line outputs). Depending on your setup, the remote control functions may allow for locating the preamp closer to the powered speakers (LSR305) with shorter interconnects for improved noise floor, especially a lower listening volumes.

 

[tincanear]

@Quiz for your use case, with Bifrost 2/64 DAC, and the JBL LSR305 monitors, there is another low-cost XLR-compatible alternative pre-amp in Clearance / B-stock section currently in limited quantities, Magnius ($149 Closeout / $139 B-stock) the predecessor to Midgard

product into chapter by Jason S here:
https://www.head-fi.org/threads/sch...bable-start-up.701900/page-4194#post-15796738

(available in black only, no silver)
also has a headphone amp on-board,
no remote control,
two input choices (one stereo XLR bal, one stereo SE RCA),
uses a nice 27mm Alps Blue Velvet series potentiometer too.
External "wall-wart" power supply can be swapped for 230V units (or just order one in addition to the unit itself which is defaulted to 115V USA plug)

 

[joenetic]

Thanks for all experience share ! I always keep Bifrost 2 turn on, I will listen to it again by this weekend.

Bifrost2/64 module has played few days continuesly, I listened to it tonight again, sadly everything is same, I restored original module and listened again, everything came back
Bifrost2/64 module is not my cup of tea, but it is great module to all people like it.

 

[Quiz]

Thanks for all the responses.

With the Bifrost 2/64, and if I am talking about sound quality alone, which would be better? The Saga+ or the Midgard? Also, would either of these preamps "change" the sound quality of the Bifrost 2/64?

 

[theveterans]

Thanks for all the responses.

With the Bifrost 2/64, and if I am talking about sound quality alone, which would be better? The Saga+ or the Midgard? Also, would either of these preamps "change" the sound quality of the Bifrost 2/64?

Sound quality alone, Saga+ would be superior to the Midgard. The reason is that a BJT tube buffer is the best implementation for a preamp application. With Midgard, you're using a circuit that's meant to drive headphones rather than maximizing the buffer amplification (Saga+) that gives the power amp the best quality of input signal it needs (in this case, your amp inside your monitors). Heck, I'd even put Schiit Lokius with EQ turned on to FLAT sounding better as a preamp to your monitors than the Midgard since Lokius uses current buffer preamplification that's meant to drive a power amp properly.

 

[Daniel Johnston]

Thanks for all the responses.

With the Bifrost 2/64, and if I am talking about sound quality alone, which would be better? The Saga+ or the Midgard? Also, would either of these preamps "change" the sound quality of the Bifrost 2/64?

Do you want vacuum tubes or not? Tubes have high amounts of harmonic distortion which many here like what it does to the sound. So yes, it may change the sound if the BF. Saga+ is the better preamp than the Midgard. But you are comparing two pretty different solutions.

 

[Quiz]

Could someone state what the purpose of the tube in the Saga+ is? If I am not mistaken, it is used as a "buffer." Is there a difference between using a tube as a buffer (what does that mean?) vs. in some "traditional" sense?

 

[Quiz]

By the way, how is the Kara?

 

[Daniel Johnston]

Could someone state what the purpose of the tube in the Saga+ is? If I am not mistaken, it is used as a "buffer." Is there a difference between using a tube as a buffer (what does that mean?) vs. in some "traditional" sense?

By the way, how is the Kara?

https://www.head-fi.org/threads/sch...most-improbable-start-up.701900/post-10194517

Read Jason's chapters and you'll find your answers.

 

[theveterans]

Could someone state what the purpose of the tube in the Saga+ is? If I am not mistaken, it is used as a "buffer." Is there a difference between using a tube as a buffer (what does that mean?) vs. in some "traditional" sense?

Tubes are excellent in providing voltage amplification and injecting that coveted tube sound. Buffer is closely related to unity gain amplifier where you “boost” the signal without increasing gain. The traditional preamp uses feedback op-amps for buffering (e.g. Topping Pre90) while Saga+ uses tubes along with BJT follower for buffering.

By the way, how is the Kara?

Kara is completely different amplifier where it uses nested differential stages (i.e. balanced by nature) for gain and buffering amplification. As for sound, Kara and Saga+ should be similar in terms of slam, dynamics, detail retrieval, bass and treble heft, but Saga+ will have a very slight tube quality injected to it (a very slight emphasis in vocal incisiveness, soundstage can be presented in a way that is tube-like i.e. open and large in scale). Both Kara and Saga+ sound noticeably better than the Midgard when it comes to preamp purposes. That's because Midgard's topology isn't meant to sound extremely well in coupling to high impedance power amplifiers, only through headphones on balanced outputs where that Halo circuit on Midgard makes great sound

 

[Quiz]

Tubes are excellent in providing voltage amplification and injecting that coveted tube sound. Buffer is closely related to unity gain amplifier where you “boost” the signal without increasing gain. The traditional preamp uses feedback op-amps for buffering (e.g. Topping Pre90) while Saga+ uses tubes along with BJT follower for buffering.



Kara is completely different amplifier where it uses nested differential stages (i.e. balanced by nature) for gain and buffering amplification. As for sound, Kara and Saga+ should be similar in terms of slam, dynamics, detail retrieval, bass and treble heft, but Saga+ will have a very slight tube quality injected to it (a very slight emphasis in vocal incisiveness, soundstage can be presented in a way that is tube-like i.e. open and large in scale). Both Kara and Saga+ sound noticeably better than the Midgard when it comes to preamp purposes. That's because Midgard's topology isn't meant to sound extremely well in coupling to high impedance power amplifiers, only through headphones on balanced outputs where that Halo circuit on Midgard makes great sound

Thanks.

Does the tube in the Saga+ degrade slowly over time (thus slowing degrading the sound quality over time) or is it more of a "it's working or it's not" situation? Also, how long does the tube last before it needs to be replaced?

 

[theveterans]

Thanks.

Does the tube in the Saga+ degrade slowly over time (thus slowing degrading the sound quality over time) or is it more of a "it's working or it's not" situation? Also, how long does the tube last before it needs to be replaced?

It's working until it isn't. There's zero degradation at all with tubes (the preamp tube do not dim down or lose brightness the same as incandescent light bulb). The normal functioning tube in Saga should give you at bare minimum a decade of use at 4 hours of listening per day before it just gives no sound. I haven't replaced mine Saga tube for 7 years and counting now