[Toad_of_Toad_Hall]

I've just placed an order for a pair of HE560s with Jan for $495.00 USD (part of his November sale). I don't think that price can be beaten anywhere. Jan has also given me his permission to post his email response to my issue here on HeadFi:

____________________________________________

Dear Nathan,

> On the high gain setting there is audible transformer hum between 2
> o'clock and 6 o'clock on the knob.

Any amplifier will produce background noises and transformer humm. It
simply can't be prevented.

However, what's important is the Signal to Noise Ratio. Do you hear the
background noises at normal listening levels or not.

Most probably you did your test with a rather sensitive (low impedance)
headphone. At 2 o'clock while listening to music you would blow your ears.

The HE-560 is less sensitive than most other headphones. As a result you
will not hear humm at 2 o`clock. The signal simply isn't large enough to
become audible with an insensitive headphone.

As said, at normal listening levels with any headphone the background
noises of the JAZZ are not a problem.

> 1. Do you envisage that I will need to turn up the knob to or beyond 3
> o'clock with the HE560s?

Strongly depends on the output level of your source.

But at 3 o'clock you won't hear hum with the HE-560 because the
headphone is not very sensitive.

> 2. Is it normal for the Jazz to have the hum I described?

Yes, due to the small enclosure the internal transformer is placed
rather close to the amplification circuitry. It's a simply matter of size.

Question: Was the input of the amp opened or short-circuited when you
did testing?

Cheers

 

[RazorJack]

Interesting!

Dear headfellows,

please be aware that any amplifier will produce hum and other background noises. It simply can not be prevented.

Jan

I've done a quick experiment after reading through the last couple of pages of this thread.

This might be weird (in a good way), but with my CONCERTO, on high gain with the volume knob turned up all the way, there's still ZERO hum through my beyerdynamic T1. Absolutely nothing.

With music playing that is supposed to be absolutely quiet, I can hear a hum. But when I hit pause it's gone. So it's the background noise from the recording I'm hearing, not the amp. A cool tune to use to perform this test is "r ess" by Autechre from their Oversteps album. It fades in very slowly from absolute "silence" over a period of 2 minutes.

However, with the JAZZ, I do hear a slight hum, with or without the track playing. Again, this would be at an ear-deafening volume level. At normal or even super loud listening levels it's dead silent.

 

[JimJames]

jazz corda ff + 100-150€ DAC or R2R11? To shine the most with classical if possible
Is it worth going for the daccord? It'd be a BIG financial effort for me right now (broke student)

 

[BLacklWf]

My main headphone is HD6XX these days and I'm thinking Jazz FF vs Jotunheim. Any comments will be appreciated!

 

[MRC001]

...
This might be weird (in a good way), but with my CONCERTO, on high gain with the volume knob turned up all the way, there's still ZERO hum through my beyerdynamic T1. Absolutely nothing.
...
However, with the JAZZ, I do hear a slight hum, with or without the track playing. Again, this would be at an ear-deafening volume level. At normal or even super loud listening levels it's dead silent.

The Jazz is in a small box putting the power transformer physically near the signal carrying circuit. It's a big (10W) toroidal transformer, so it should have naturally low noise. But proximity to the signal circuit may elevate the noise floor, compared to all else equal with a bigger box, or having the power supply in an entirely different box. My Jazz noise floor is different at work & at home, so it is somewhat sensitive to the environment. In either case, the noise floor is so low it is inaudible at all realistic listening levels, even on the quietest passages of high dynamic range music like large choral or symphonic recordings.

Regarding the other question: I've used the Jazz with HD-580, HD-600, LCD-2, LCD-X, and HE-500 headphones. It drives all with plenty of authority, with high enough resolution to bring out their differences and character. When I first got the Jazz I preferred it to other good amps I had owned, like the Headroom Maxed out Home. To my ears, the Oppo HA-1 beats the Jazz, but not by much. Sonically, they are surprisingly similar to me.

 

[Toad_of_Toad_Hall]

The following comments are of limited usefulness as I have not heard all of the gear you are comparing the Jazz to. Didn't want to leave you hanging too long without a response, so I'll contribute what I can.

jazz corda ff + 100-150€ DAC or R2R11? To shine the most with classical if possible
Is it worth going for the daccord? It'd be a BIG financial effort for me right now (broke student)

Which headphone/s do you use? What are your sonic preferences? The Jazz-ff is neutral in sound. It won't "fix" an overly warm or bright pair of headphones if you need to compensate for some characteristic you don't like. I am a recent Jazz-ff owner and love it with classical music as it is smooth (gets smoother with a little burn-in) and resolves well. Very versatile too and will be able to deal with any non-electrostatic headphones you buy in the future. Based on experience and recent comments from Jan and others the signal to noise ratio is excellent and there is no hum or hiss in quiet passages. Important for lovers of classical music.

I owned and loved the StageDAC, the Daccord's predecessor, but recommend that you hold off. Don't stretch yourself financially over audio. Wait until you can afford it and then make a decision. Make do with a more affordable DAC in the meantime.

My main headphone is HD6XX these days and I'm thinking Jazz FF vs Jotunheim. Any comments will be appreciated!

I've owned the HD600's and many people whose opinion I respect have gone on record stating that headphones in this family (HD600, HD650, HD6XX) combine well with the Jot. Have read comments, though, that it can be slightly etched/aggressive in the treble, so it would depend a little on your sonic preferences. I imagine that someone else out here has heard the HD6XX/Jazz-ff pairing and can chip in.

 

[BLacklWf]

Appreciate your feedback!

I've owned the HD600's and many people whose opinion I respect have gone on record stating that headphones in this family (HD600, HD650, HD6XX) combine well with the Jot. Have read comments, though, that it can be slightly etched/aggressive in the treble, so it would depend a little on your sonic preferences. I imagine that someone else out here has heard the HD6XX/Jazz-ff pairing and can chip in.

 

[JimJames]

Which headphone/s do you use? What are your sonic preferences? The Jazz-ff is neutral in sound. It won't "fix" an overly warm or bright pair of headphones if you need to compensate for some characteristic you don't like. I am a recent Jazz-ff owner and love it with classical music as it is smooth (gets smoother with a little burn-in) and resolves well. Very versatile too and will be able to deal with any non-electrostatic headphones you buy in the future. Based on experience and recent comments from Jan and others the signal to noise ratio is excellent and there is no hum or hiss in quiet passages. Important for lovers of classical music.

I owned and loved the StageDAC, the Daccord's predecessor, but recommend that you hold off. Don't stretch yourself financially over audio. Wait until you can afford it and then make a decision. Make do with a more affordable DAC in the meantime.

I am buying my first hifi system, so I'm still deciding between K712 (228€), ATH AD1000/2000 (210/460€, maybe not worth the difference?) and HD700(~350€). And I listen to many many genres but would sacrifice a bit of versatility to enjoy symphonies (specially a guy like Wagner) the best to a headphones ability, so I'm looking for great imaging, soundstage and detail but natural instead of analytical. As for amps I could get Fostex HPA4 for 250€, r2r11 for 290€+shipping+taxes=? or corda jazz ff which gives me a good feeling for 340€+some DAC. Oh and the fact that you said it doesn't have any noise floor is great for me!
I'm not really into the hifi world (maybe a got little overwhelmed by it, or maybe I'm just trying to cover too much distance in short time, because I just can't wait to get my first hifi setup, simply can't believe I've waited to turn 23 years old to get one) so was thinking of going straight to electrostatics (stax 31000, 600€ if ebay ones aren't scams) and never look back.
Thanks for your help man!

 

[MRC001]

The headphones make more difference than the DAC or amp. Some people say the opposite. But consider: headphones are trivially easy to differentiate in double-blind tests because the sonic differences are big and obvious. But amps and DACs are much harder because the differences are much more subtle.

So on a starving student budget, I'd save on the DAC+amp and spend more on the headphones. I'd check used on eBay. Two benefits to buying used: (1) better sound for the money, (2) better resale: if you later upgrade you'll get your money back. Audiophiles are always upgrading in the constant search for better sound, so there's a good selection of quality used gear.

I might suggest using a sound card as your DAC, with a separate analog amp (like the Jazz). I have a Asus Xonar DX in one computer, an old ESI Juli@ in another. They're both great. But this will cost more than a single DAC+amp box so that might be better on a budget.

 

[MRC001]

PS to Jim James: if you're looking at the HD700, try the HD600 too. The 700 is more expensive and looks nicer (more like the 800), but the 600 has a smoother response and more neutral, natural sound. Don't let first listening impressions fool you... sometimes what grabs you at first listen ends up being artificial or fatiguing in the long run. I'm not saying the 600 is "better"; preferences vary. But it's definitely worth a listen.

 

[nlse]

@MRC001 @Toad_of_Toad_Hall

what are your experience of the jazz in the neutrality stand-point

as the warm-signature of an amp would be beneficial to some records still for the price right now, 260 euro, could be quite good to go with it


do you know of any alternatives, on side of a warmer sound, or are the neutrality good enough, is it more clarity or how would you decribe the sound on that side of it, is it linear, or are the dynamics large enough to express and may be filters to put on it when used with a computer?

 

[MRC001]

I've said this before: to my ears, the Jazz is a neutral amp. It is also musical, but with the Jazz, neutrality comes first. It is the least expensive amp I've seen that gives a taste of how good the best solid state can be.
When Jan says it is for tube lovers (or words to that effect) I take that to mean the Jazz doesn't sound harsh or lean like some other solid state amps having equally excellent measurements.

 

[Toad_of_Toad_Hall]

@MRC001 @Toad_of_Toad_Hall

do you know of any alternatives, on side of a warmer sound, or are the neutrality good enough, is it more clarity or how would you decribe the sound on that side of it, is it linear, or are the dynamics large enough to express and may be filters to put on it when used with a computer?

Is the Jazz neutral? Yes, for a given value of "neutral". A hard term to define.
Do I know of any warmer amps? Yes. The Schiit Vali 2 would be an affordable example, but I don't find it to be as resolving as the Jazz-ff.
Are the dynamics large enough? For me, yes. Depends on what you listen to. Compressed music will remain bland and compressed.
Are there filters to apply when using a computer? Many! Which software do you use? A simple EQ might be all you want to get a warmer sound.

Are you asking these questions because you are considering buying the Jazz-ff, or just out of curiosity?

What would I do? Well, exactly as I have done. I bought the Jazz-ff and apply EQ when I see fit depending on the album and the headphones. If you're not listening to music from a computer (eg CD player or record player) you could add the Schiit Loki (the equalizer, not the discontinued DSD DAC) to your chain and play around with the tone colour.

What should you do? Try and listen to the Jazz or Jazz-ff if possible. Failing that, read this thread in its entirety. Some of your questions have already been answered.

 

[VRacer-111]

@MRC001 @Toad_of_Toad_Hall

what are your experience of the jazz in the neutrality stand-point

as the warm-signature of an amp would be beneficial to some records still for the price right now, 260 euro, could be quite good to go with it


do you know of any alternatives, on side of a warmer sound, or are the neutrality good enough, is it more clarity or how would you decribe the sound on that side of it, is it linear, or are the dynamics large enough to express and may be filters to put on it when used with a computer?

The JAZZ-ff is pretty much a dead neutral amp, not warm and not harsh in the highs either, very well balanced. It is detailed and fairly well resolving, but not quite what I really like for my musical preference - wanted a powerful high current, low impedance amp which was warmer with more bass presence/impact and detail along with being able to tune with different opamps. The Gustard H10 is that amp for me.

 

[nlse]

Are you asking these questions because you are considering buying the Jazz-ff, or just out of curiosity?

What should you do? Try and listen to the Jazz or Jazz-ff if possible. Failing that, read this thread in its entirety. Some of your questions have already been answered.

yes going through some devices and seems to be hard to find one that should fit, still i do not have a good option to listen to it, if i dont buy it and i would not like to send things back

the Gustard H10 could have been 1 thing, still didnt find it so easily available and the price was around 350+


trying the wait til and check with all before buying , as some new devices are getting released and a dac + amp would be quite beneficial, still was going through that an amp with a hifime sabre dac, could have been something that may have worked


the availability to places are not the greatest , to listen to, and they mostly sell things that are of higher price, that would not fit per money spent



also had the thought of linear sound and dynamics, out of the neutrality? still it may cover with neutral still , that was more specific in the question

as @MRC001 had with the element, that feels very uncomfortable to go to, even quite close to in terms of sound
still as there are more solid parts in the jazz, it could deliver a more solid sound