[Light - Man]

   
A83 is not power hungry, but would benefit from a warmer/neutral source to tame down its top end brightness.  From HO of AP100 it might be a bit too bright, with E12A you are getting more into a neutral territory.  With Cayin C5 - it's even better.  Gotta admit, haven't tried fw70, wonder if sound has changed back from early days of previous firmware releases.
 
If you want to push your IEMs to 3D limit, you need a DAP with a dual-DAC where L/R channels processed separately for a better staging control.  Example is something like Cayin N6 or AK120ii, or the upcoming FiiO X7.  At the same time, we are talking about a significant price jump from AP100...

Hi Twister, thanks for the info.
 
Yes the FW70 is well worth the upgrade but Fidizs recommend  FW69 first. I only have experience with FW67, 69 and 70. FW 70 seems to me to have a fuller sound, better bass, better transparency and 3D sound.
 
Could you reccommend any good value IEM's (for occasional use) from your experience for the the AP100 un-Amped that has a neutral sound with good mids and controlled bass and top end.
 
Any IEM's I have heard sounded unnatural and tinny.

 

[twister6]

 

   
A83 is not power hungry, but would benefit from a warmer/neutral source to tame down its top end brightness.  From HO of AP100 it might be a bit too bright, with E12A you are getting more into a neutral territory.  With Cayin C5 - it's even better.  Gotta admit, haven't tried fw70, wonder if sound has changed back from early days of previous firmware releases.
 
If you want to push your IEMs to 3D limit, you need a DAP with a dual-DAC where L/R channels processed separately for a better staging control.  Example is something like Cayin N6 or AK120ii, or the upcoming FiiO X7.  At the same time, we are talking about a significant price jump from AP100...

Hi Twister, thanks for the info.
 
Yes the FW70 is well worth the upgrade but Fidizs recommend  FW69 first. I only have experience with FW67, 69 and 70. FW 70 seems to me to have a fuller sound, better bass, better transparency and 3D sound.
 
Could you reccommend any good value IEM's (for occasional use) from your experience for the the AP100 un-Amped that has a neutral sound with good mids and controlled bass and top end.
 
Any IEM's I have heard sounded unnatural and tinny.

 
I'm a big fan of Audio-Technica "house" sound of natural organic tonality.  CKR9 would be your best best.  I had both CKR9 and CKR10 sent to me by AT for review, and i returned back CKR9 thinking I would prefer bassier fuller sound of CKR10, but now thinking I made a mistake since I have been obsessed with a more neutral sound.  Right now, not even using IEMs, only ATH-MSR7 full size - absolutely LOVE it and highly recommend it.
 
But for whatever you are looking for in IEMs (and I'm looking for the same, btw), you will have to look in to CIEMs with multi-BA drivers.  I can get my "target" sound with UM Pro 50, but need to use EQ.  I think you will be happy with CKR9.

 

[HaypurTiryading]

I did not install the final 070 fw yet but anyone tell me about; is shuffle option include in fw? (aka selectable folder option, folder shuffle) ? Thanks. If I find a time at the weekend, i will upgrade my hidizs. 

 

[Light - Man]

   
I'm a big fan of Audio-Technica "house" sound of natural organic tonality.  CKR9 would be your best best.  I had both CKR9 and CKR10 sent to me by AT for review, and i returned back CKR9 thinking I would prefer bassier fuller sound of CKR10, but now thinking I made a mistake since I have been obsessed with a more neutral sound.  Right now, not even using IEMs, only ATH-MSR7 full size - absolutely LOVE it and highly recommend it.
 
But for whatever you are looking for in IEMs (and I'm looking for the same, btw), you will have to look in to CIEMs with multi-BA drivers.  I can get my "target" sound with UM Pro 50, but need to use EQ.  I think you will be happy with CKR9.

Hi Twister, will check out the CKR9 when they become available in UK.
 
Regarding fw70 I have gone back to fw69 as I was having trouble with the back button not being responsive and if I pressed it a few times it would mostly do nothing other than ask if I wanted to delete the file I was playing.
 
Also on further listening to fw70 I am not so sure about the overall sound as it seems to have more gain as well as bass which to me is not necessary and I found the sound lacking the finess and refinement I like.
 
I am also tempted to get another Fiio  E12A (Amp), how does the ATH-MSR7 sound with the AP100 on its own and with the E12A.
 
I wonder if the pre Amp on the EQ of the AP100 will be as close to having a gain control or do Fidizs have any plans for a gain control, I notice that just changing the pre Amp settings alters the overall frequency balance even when the EQ remains in flat mode. btw I am not a fan of EQ's but the AP100 being hardware based is better than all the DAPs I have tried.
 
I believe that Fidizs should concentrate on maintaining or improving its mission of good sound quality and not get side tracked with shuffle features etc. that most Audiophiles do not rate high on their list of requirements.

 

[twister6]

@Light - Man : you do NOT need amp for AP100 to drive anything.  It already has a very powerful amp.  Unless you don't like its sound characteristics and want to pair up LO of AP100 with another amp - there is no need for E12A or C5 or anything else.
 
As a matter of fact, I just got for review ATH-R70x and using AP100 as a burn in source.  R70x is 470 ohm set of cans that you need some serious power to drive (this is high impedance reference quality headphones!).  AP100 drives them with authority and still has some headroom to spare!!!  MSR7 has "portable" impedance rating, no need for any amps to drive it.  I would only recommend it if you find MSR7 on a bright side for your taste and thus use a warmer portable amp to smooth out its sound.  Otherwise, save yourself money and stick with AP100 driving headphones from HO.

 

[fxim]

True that, ap100 is great at powering cans. In fact, it sounds better with higher impedance cans. It is only on low impedance sensitive iems that it sounds noisy n sometimes a bit off in soundstage n bass.

 

[Light - Man]

  Hi Twister, will check out the CKR9 when they become available in UK.
 
Regarding fw70 I have gone back to fw69 as I was having trouble with the back button not being responsive and if I pressed it a few times it would mostly do nothing other than ask if I wanted to delate the file I was playing.
 
Also on further listening to fw70 I am not so sure about the overall sound as it seems to have more gain as well as bass which to me is not necessary and I found the sound lacking the finess and refinement I like.
 
I am also tempted to get another Fiio  E12A (Amp), how does the ATH-MSR7 sound with the AP100 on its own and with the E12A.
 
I wonder if the pre Amp on the EQ of the AP100 will be as close to having a gain control or do Fidizs have any plans for a gain control, I notice that just changing the pre Amp settings alters the overall frequency balance even when the EQ remains in flat mode. btw I am not a fan of EQ's but the AP100 being hardware based is better than all the DAPs I have tried.
 
I believe that Fidizs should concentrate on maintaining or improving its mission of good sound quality and not get side tracked with shuffle features etc. that most Audiophiles do not rate high on their list of requirements.

 
 

  @Light - Man : you do NOT need amp for AP100 to drive anything.  It already has a very powerful amp.  Unless you don't like its sound characteristics and want to pair up LO of AP100 with another amp - there is no need for E12A or C5 or anything else.
 
As a matter of fact, I just got for review ATH-R70x and using AP100 as a burn in source.  R70x is 470 ohm set of cans that you need some serious power to drive (this is high impedance reference quality headphones!).  AP100 drives them with authority and still has some headroom to spare!!!  MSR7 has "portable" impedance rating, no need for any amps to drive it.  I would only recommend it if you find MSR7 on a bright side for your taste and thus use a warmer portable amp to smooth out its sound.  Otherwise, save yourself money and stick with AP100 driving headphones from HO.

Thanks Twister and Fxim, good to have your views and I will give the amping option a miss for now!!! and mess around with the EQ to fine tune the sound.
 
Twister do you still have your loaner AK120ii and overall do you prefer the Cayin N6 if you only had the choice of only having "one" of the mentioned DAPs (sound quality only) and where do you see the Fiio X3ii fitting in to the equation? I read that one person had mixed views ( re: AK120ii vs X3ii). I can of course ask you this question over on the AK thread but I thought AP100 fans would be interested in your views (and also because of the same DAC chip as the AK, Hidizs and the new X3ii all share)
 
Fxim, so far are you happy with fw70?
 
Has anyone tried messing with the pre-amp only option on the AP100 to adjust the sound on IEMs? and perhaps make most of them sound less bad! LOL

 

[twister6]

Twister do you still have your loaner AK120ii and overall do you prefer the Cayin N6 if you only had the choice of only having "one" of the mentioned DAPs (sound quality only) and where do you see the Fiio X3ii fitting in to the equation? I read that one person had mixed views ( re: AK120ii vs X3ii). I can of course ask you this question over on the AK thread but I thought AP100 fans would be interested in your views (and also because of the same DAC chip the AK and Hidizs and the new X3ii all share)  

 
I guess we are using AP100 thread as 'Switzerland' to stay in a neutral territory while discussing AK, Cayin, and FiiO DAPs?

 
I'm a very bad example to ask about personal DAP preferences, because a) sound quality is very subjective, b) it will depend greatly on pair up with your headphones, your style of music, and sound preference, c) lately I have been putting overall user experience (which includes interface and other features) on a higher pedestal, and d) in the last 6 months I got a bit spoiled with a chance to test a lot of great DAPs.
 
Astell & Kern was kind enough to let me keep AK120ii for a little bit longer since I have more DAPs in queue for review.  Purely on sound quality, and sound quality only, N6 is still at the top of my preferred food chain.  But it's bulky, unfortunately, for everyday pocket use.  X3ii is great, but just like with AK120ii, it pairs up better with neutral or brighter headphones.  AP100 has a better sound quality (pre fw 70 since I didn't have a time to test the latest firmware), I did mention that from day one that sound quality of AP100 is even a notch better than X5, but user interface is what holding it down from being my everyday driver (again, purely subjective personal opinion, especially after playing with something like AK120ii).  Considering me using MSR7 a lot lately and how well it pairs up with AK120ii, that is a combo I reach out to most of the time lately.  And keep in mind, AK120ii preference is not necessary because of the sound, but the touch/hardware interface and the whole user experience.
 
Of course, I'm really curious to see what Hidizs is going to come up with next, which I'm hoping is just around the corner?  Plus, there is a lot of buzz around X7 as the next AK killer.  Will see.

 

[ozkan]

  Of course, I'm really curious to see what Hidizs is going to come up with next, which I'm hoping is just around the corner?  Plus, there is a lot of buzz around X7 as the next AK killer.  Will see.

 
+1.

 

[HaypurTiryading]

I like the 070 fw guys. It better matches with my B&W P5 v1's and vacuum tube based stereo system. I'm using lo off, src @ 24-176 and no eq. Bass response is better than 069, it came to my ears very tight and controlled. 3d sound stage is better. Stage is airier than 069. But 070's sound turned into fun type, sweet-colorful type. (I can't describe that I want.)  I like the sweet, fun type sound. But not neutral as 069 anymore. In the other case 069's sound came to my ear a bit sluggish. I think it's caused from fw based gain settings + changed sound character. This gain also brings a little micro details. The only missing part of Ap100 is music management system. I have 4300 lossles song in my sd and divided into about 300 folders. That's why i want folder shuffle option. 

 

[fxim]

I have reverted back to v70 beta2 firmware because it goes better with my amp and delivers more treble. I will wait for v71 before I go back to a normal firmware. I find that v70 has too much bass and deviates from the original Hidizs house sound of being bright n treblely with forward vocals. Cheers

Btw, I tri out the aune b1 amp, it was great. Very different from the e12a. The aune gives a wider sounstage with great separation, great for classical passages. Vocals especially female vocals, the e12a sounds more intimate an more enjoyable. Really tempted to buy the aune as my desktop amp to use at home.

Just tried out high gain (e12a) on my sensitive IEMS. They make my Fidue A83 (impedance < 10 ohms) sound like it is connected to tube amp with minor soothing hiss of the olden days, (effect is less so on my Fostex Te05 and ATH im02). The trebles become much more lively and more minuet details come out. Luckly, Hidizs AP100 has an adjustable LO. I find that the A83's work best when the E12a amp is set right at the 12 o'clock position. (My guess is that the current is more constant).

Now i set my AP100 at around AP100 around 8-15 vol for the LO and keep the E12a at 12 o'clock.

Hidizs, I love the adjustable LO, keep this feature in the future devices. It allows greater flexibility when pairing with other systems or configurations!!!

Though it may not be the best configuration, providing a switch to switch between adjustable Lo and real Lo would be a good option.

 

[twister6]

I have reverted back to v70 beta2 firmware because it goes better with my amp and delivers more treble. I will wait for v71 before I go back to a normal firmware. I find that v70 has too much bass and deviates from the original Hidizs house sound of being bright n treblely with forward vocals. Cheers

Btw, I tri out the aune b1 amp, it was great. Very different from the e12a. The aune gives a wider sounstage with great separation, great for classical passages. Vocals especially female vocals, the e12a sounds more intimate an more enjoyable. Really tempted to buy the aune as my desktop amp to use at home.

Just tried out high gain on my sensitive IEMS. They make my Fidue A83 (impedance < 10 ohms) sound like it is connected to tube amp with minor soothing hiss of the olden days, (effect is less so on my Fostex Te05 and ATH im02). The trebles become much more lively and more minuet details come out. Luckly, Hidizs AP100 has an adjustable LO. I find that the A83's work best when the E12a amp is set right at the 12 o'clock position. (My guess is that the current is more constant).

Now i set my AP100 at around AP100 around 8-15 vol for the LO and keep the E12a at 12 o'clock.

Hidizs, I love the adjustable LO, keep this feature in the future devices. It allows greater flexibility when pairing with other systems or configurations!!!

 
LO volume control in AP100 is an anomaly   Don't think it was an intentional design feature, but rather due to a type of devices and signal flow architecture they selected.  LO is typically an output from D/A where volume is at the max, and volume adjustment is after filter and amplification stage.  I think in AP100 volume adjustment is done in such way that it affects D/A output and as a result it controls both LO and HO outputs.  I wish Hidizs would post a block diagram of their internal architecture so we can confirm this.  Since they are using that unique CS8422 sample rate converter (triggered by SRC button), I wonder if that's where the volume adjustment is done since it's probably placed before CS4398 DAC.

 

[fxim]

true that,  AP 100 is a strange beast as i don't get how the firmware affects the sound signature so much and what the CS8422 chip's relationship to the whole audio process.  Furthermore, the new hidizs web site is confusing, the old one was more straight forward and to the point.

 

[lukeap69]

   
LO volume control in AP100 is an anomaly  

I agree wholeheartedly! 

 

[Light - Man]

Ibasso DX50 and 90 also have volume adjusted line out. I only had them for a few months but I read other owners who remarked on changing sound quality with different fw updates.
 
I am also surprised by the different sound from fw69 compared to 70, I am now using FW70 beta 2 after fxim mentioned that he found it good and so far I also agree.
 
I notice that Hidizs only have fw69 available from their website and one wonders if they are testing us for our feedback on this site.
 
Fxim when you mention high gain do you mean adjustment with the Pre amp option (but it also alters the sound) or am I missing something.
 
I think that Hidizs have so far missed a trick and should have some sort of gain contol e.g. Ibasso have a hardware gain switch (low med and high) and Fiio has high and low gain option in settings.