[Publius]

tomek, would you be interested in posting some RMAA results? (Just curious)

 

[NotoriousBIG_PJ]

Quote:

Originally Posted by philodox uh, actually he said "while some may call it more 'digital', it seems more detailed and the images have a much clearer focus"Very well put.

Stronger leading/trailing edges doesn't equate to more detail to my ears, just added distortion. Also I found that the modded teac had a more 3-d presentation which means better focus to me. I can see why you guys would feel the opposite way though since playback with softer edges might give the illusion of less focus to the untrained or slightly deaf ear. On a side note, since ZZZ left, there hasn't been anyone with good ears at the meets to compare my impressions to.

If given the choice between only listening to the unmodded teac for the rest of my life and having no music, it would be a tough call hehe.

edit: Also the modded teac had its analogue stage (has many many parts) and replaced with 4 parts. Theres no way the old analogue stage is closer to neutral. This has nothing to do with the sonic balance of the two players compared above though, because they each use different dacs and transports.

Biggie.

 

[philodox]

Quote:

Originally Posted by NotoriousBIG_PJ I can see why you guys would feel the opposite way though since playback with softer edges might give the illusion of less focus to the untrained or slightly deaf ear.

Any positive can be described in such a way that it comes across as a negative and vice versa. What we find to be a positive obviously differs here.

I refuse to believe that by the simple fact that you have spent more money on this hobby and listened to more gear that your opinion on these two CD players is more valid than mine or Tomek's.

I guess if someone agree's with what you say they have good ears and if they don't then they are slightly deaf?

 

[NotoriousBIG_PJ]

Yep.

Biggie.

 

[philodox]

Quote:

Originally Posted by NotoriousBIG_PJ Yep.

lol... you kill me man

 

[tomek]

Quote:

Originally Posted by NotoriousBIG_PJ I can see why you guys would feel the opposite way though since playback with softer edges might give the illusion of less focus to the untrained or slightly deaf ear.

it's an interesting theory, since it was Andrea and my friend Marco who either found no real difference or preferred yours. They, like you, have either been in a band or listened to many play.

Me and my friend Liz on the other hand, noticed how the treble wasn't rolled off with my player. I could even hear instruments fade away and become hard to localize from my position by the players, not just in front of the speakers with the modded cdp in.

I don't doubt that their mod does something. I was finally happy that I'd found digital gear that actually did sound different. I'd love to see a FR graph to see whether the unmodded player is treble etched, or whether your player is rolled off to sound 'analogue'.

I know that I'd feel pretty bad had I just spent $1200 to have someone turn the treble control down by one. My $200 kenwood receiver can do it too, although it can also turn it back normal for free

Quote:

Originally Posted by Markl Tomek claims the stock unit without the zapfilter sounds more "digital" but for whatever reason he likes it better. To each his own. Enough said.

btw, I said nothing like this, and in fact, almost said the opposite. your obvious bias on this matter has caused you to misread my post.

 

[NotoriousBIG_PJ]

Quote:

Originally Posted by tomek Me and my friend Liz on the other hand, noticed how the treble wasn't rolled off with my player. I could even hear instruments fade away and become hard to localize from my position by the players, not just in front of the speakers with the modded cdp in. I don't doubt that their mod does something. I was finally happy that I'd found digital gear that actually did sound different. I'd love to see a FR graph to see whether the unmodded player is treble etched, or whether your player is rolled off to sound 'analogue'.

Heh there is no treble roll off on the modded teac. Your amp (and mine) on the other hand is definetly rolled off. Go listen to msjrr's setup and you will know what I mean. His amp extends like crazy and with those super tweeters, every cymbal goes on for like a minute (actually gets kind of annoying after a while lol). I've never heard a headphone or any other setup that could go even remotely that high. And the source of course, was the modded teac.

I've also heard their stonehenge speakers with supertweeters, modded teac and the super cheap wave mono blocks, and the treble extension wasn't there, so it isn't the super tweeters either.

Biggie.

 

[NotoriousBIG_PJ]

Quote:

Originally Posted by philodox lol... you kill me man

Alright man, theres only one way to settle this, but its going to take a lot of courage and will power... I purpose a dual of sorts. Your ears vs. my ears. Each will use their own equipment with their track of choice. This may be the hardest challenge in audio: a Stat Mat blind test. 10 reps, and to the victor go the spoils.

Are you ready?

Biggie.

 

[TrevorNetwork]

I'd do it, but I'd be using eric343's setup.

I have damn good hearing, especially for details. Although, thankfully, I am able to just turn it off, and relax.

 

[Publius]

You can do your own FR graphs you know... RMAA lets you write test signals to WAV files, which you can then burn onto CD, play back on the teac and record on your sound card.

 

[philodox]

Quote:

Originally Posted by NotoriousBIG_PJ Alright man, theres only one way to settle this, but its going to take a lot of courage and will power... I purpose a dual of sorts. Your ears vs. my ears. Each will use their own equipment with their track of choice. This may be the hardest challenge in audio: a Stat Mat blind test. 10 reps, and to the victor go the spoils. Are you ready?

I was getting worried until I read the last line. Then I laughed a little too loud for my work environment. Don't want to give them the impression that I'm not doing my job.

I'm pretty sure you were joking, but if you were serious I don't think it would work. You will not see a difference when switching from MAT to NOMAT as you would do in a DBT. Once the CDP has had the statmat in it the harmfull static is removed from the drive and it takes a while to build up again. This would make a controlled and measured test fairly difficult to orchestrate.

Snake oil or not, I'm confident that it makes an improvement even if it is only in my head.

 

[NotoriousBIG_PJ]

Well if thats the case then we could choose a random number between 1 and 10 and on that number the stat mat goes in and then we see if the lisener notices. Why am I even typing this.

Biggie.

 

[tomek]

how's this for a test.

just put aside the fact that the statmat just being in the room affects the sound.

you put in a cd and listen. listen as much as you want. then we stop, and we either put the statmat or not, you don't know. you listen again and judge the sound. is it same or different. we do this a few times, with one of those times being the one that the statmat is used. if it makes any difference worth it's price, you'd notice that when it was put on, there was a different sound.

i've done this before with other things. i can predict what happens. you hear a difference on one of the trials where nothing is changed, but don't notice when the statmat is put in.

trust me.

 

[philodox]

Quote:

Originally Posted by NotoriousBIG_PJ Why am I even typing this.

same reason as us... nothing better to do

Quote:

Originally Posted by tomek just put aside the fact that the statmat just being in the room affects the sound.

hold on here, we arent talking about rainbow foil...

Quote:

Originally Posted by tomek you put in a cd and listen. listen as much as you want. then we stop, and we either put the statmat or not, you don't know. you listen again and judge the sound. is it same or different. we do this a few times, with one of those times being the one that the statmat is used. if it makes any difference worth it's price, you'd notice that when it was put on, there was a different sound. i've done this before with other things. i can predict what happens. you hear a difference on one of the trials where nothing is changed, but don't notice when the statmat is put in.

That just might work. Of course I would have to play a whole bunch of music in my CDP before doing the test to work up some static.

EDIT: Biggie, I noticed you are selling the RS-1's... what will be replacing them?

 

[Leporello]

Quote:

Originally Posted by drminky It's hard to imagine a live classical lover prefering the harsh highs of CD, <snip>

Curiouser and curiouser... since I have no difficulties in imagining myself! OTOH, the highs of the CD medium do not sound harsh to me.


Regards,

L.