[elmoe]

This is true, neither of these have a 'premium feel', but they sound and measure premium - MUCH better than many of the so called 'premium brands'. Which is more important is of course a subjective opinion.

Understood and I agree that more often than not, "budget" gear can perform as well as "premium" gear. That being said, I am looking for premium gear recommendations that are a step above budget gear.

In this price range Chord Qutest could be the best option. No unnecessary functions and great sound. I love mine.

Thank you, that is the kind of recommendation I am looking for. I will give the Qutest a listen if i can find one locally.

If you want the best components, this is it: http://www.audio-gd.com/R2R/R8/R8EN.htm
Or save some money if you do not need balanced output: http://www.audio-gd.com/R2R/R2R2/R2R2EN.htm

I think a R2R ladder DAC will suit your tube amp much better than a delta sigma DAC.

I appreciate the recommendation, but R2R audio-gd DACs are not what I am looking for. I've had many chances to listen to them and would like a delta sigma DAC, as I personally feel that is a much better fit to the smoother-sounding MPX3.

I would say Holo Spring 2, level 1 or level 2. It's laughably superior to the R2R mentioned above...
For top-tier D-S DAC I would go Auralic Vega, any variant within your price range as vega is freaking great too, real top notch engineering on both.

Both work very well for speaker set-ups (the intended use case).

Great, this was already a great DAC a few years ago when I was more involved, it sounds like it is still well regarded nowadays and definitely something I am considering as a valid option. Thanks for the recommendation!

 

[MikeW]

Yeah, he had a pro dac, and requested neutral, and here come the esoteric botique suggestions for freaking R2R and NOS.. those are great products, but reading between the lines I don't think that's what he's looking for, if you are, may as well throw in a suggestion for Yggdrasil. And I really don't understand the limitation of no features your placing on yourself. Very strange. Anyways.. Gungnir DS perhaps. Most pro gear or better dac's are packed with features. Chord's not immune either, with their alien lights and filters... most DS dac's that are simliar but upgraded versions of what you already own and are looking for come with plenty of extra's and often times at no added cost. RME ADI-2 (my dac im biased) been compared favorably to Chord Quetest and Mytek Brooklyn +.. dac's that cost twice as much with half the features.

If your into fancy parts SMSL VMV D1 is packed full of em too, and it's rather feature lite.. still rather have the adi-2.

I don't get to caught up in measurements, I look at them and acknowledge them, however I've owned poor measuring gear and superb measuring gear, I enjoyed the poor measuring gear quite alot so there is that. Fact is a 50$ fio will measure better then Yggy and Holo spring.. who cares. Similiar a cheap 100$ op-amp based headamp will measure better then a EC Aficionado.. who cares.

My current DAC measures among the best in all regards, including it's built in head-amp.. I previously owned a Bifrost Multibit, enjoyed it quite abit, this unit's in a different price bracket however. It's better to be an end results kinda guy. If it sounds good it's good. Some thing measure exceptionally well and also sound nice, something measure like crap and sound nice. Some things measure well and sound awful, and everything in between. I personally don't care for most Sabre dac's, some of the best measuring around.

Judging by your choice to pair a piece of pro gear with a single power, im likely preaching to the choir.

TLDR: most pro dac's have features, don't limit yourself for no reason, or some expectation that your buying more performance because your choice lacks features. Suggestions, vmv d1, gungnir ds, adi-2, mytek with sabre warning, Chord with poor value warning..

Edit: i got to throw in Dangerous Music Convert-2.. probably one of, if not the best DS dac availible. It's a bit unwieldy though and not to consumer friendly. Your asking for High end DS though. Kinda comes with the territory.

 

[Ragnar-BY]

I will give the Qutest a listen if i can find one locally.

If you can`t find Qutest, look for Chord Hugo 2. With same DACs on board sound signature is similar enough to audition Hugo 2 and order Qutest if you like the sound. Qutest sounds slightly better as a DAC, so it should be a safe bet.

 

[DrTone]

A used Resonessence Veritas might fit the bill. It's designed by Sabre engineers.

https://www.resonessencelabs.com/shop/veritas/

 

[elmoe]

Yeah, he had a pro dac, and requested neutral, and here come the esoteric botique suggestions for freaking R2R and NOS.. those are great products, but reading between the lines I don't think that's what he's looking for, if you are, may as well throw in a suggestion for Yggdrasil. And I really don't understand the limitation of no features your placing on yourself. Very strange. Anyways.. Gungnir DS perhaps. Most pro gear or better dac's are packed with features. Chord's not immune either, with their alien lights and filters... most DS dac's that are simliar but upgraded versions of what you already own and are looking for come with plenty of extra's and often times at no added cost. RME ADI-2 (my dac im biased) been compared favorably to Chord Quetest and Mytek Brooklyn +.. dac's that cost twice as much with half the features.

If your into fancy parts SMSL VMV D1 is packed full of em too, and it's rather feature lite.. still rather have the adi-2.

I don't get to caught up in measurements, I look at them and acknowledge them, however I've owned poor measuring gear and superb measuring gear, I enjoyed the poor measuring gear quite alot so there is that. Fact is a 50$ fio will measure better then Yggy and Holo spring.. who cares. Similiar a cheap 100$ op-amp based headamp will measure better then a EC Aficionado.. who cares.

My current DAC measures among the best in all regards, including it's built in head-amp.. I previously owned a Bifrost Multibit, enjoyed it quite abit, this unit's in a different price bracket however. It's better to be an end results kinda guy. If it sounds good it's good. Some thing measure exceptionally well and also sound nice, something measure like **** and sound nice. Some things measure well and sound awful, and everything in between. I personally don't care for most Sabre dac's, some of the best measuring around.

Judging by your choice to pair a piece of pro gear with a single power, im likely preaching to the choir.

TLDR: most pro dac's have features, don't limit yourself for no reason, or some expectation that your buying more performance because your choice lacks features. Suggestions, vmv d1, gungnir ds, adi-2, mytek with sabre warning, Chord with poor value warning..

Edit: i got to throw in Dangerous Music Convert-2.. probably one of, if not the best DS dac availible. It's a bit unwieldy though and not to consumer friendly. Your asking for High end DS though. Kinda comes with the territory.

Thanks Mike, that's exactly the type of response I was hoping to get. Your whole post is spot on and yes, you're preaching to the choir The only reason I mentioned lack of features is to have a focus on performance, but if you're telling me features mostly come at no extra cost, I am definitely not against them by any mean, and I figured it would be this way. Not so much a restriction, just something I don't want to pay extra for. I've actually been reading up on the ADI-2, which I don't think was around back then. From the research I've done so far, and obviously until I can find one to demo, it seems to fit the bill as far as the kind of sound signature I am looking for.

If you can`t find Qutest, look for Chord Hugo 2. With same DACs on board sound signature is similar enough to audition Hugo 2 and order Qutest if you like the sound. Qutest sounds slightly better as a DAC, so it should be a safe bet.

Gotcha, yes a Chord Hugo 2 I believe I can find locally for a listen. I will give that a try.

A used Resonessence Veritas might fit the bill. It's designed by Sabre engineers.

https://www.resonessencelabs.com/shop/veritas/

That looks good. I will research some more and try to find one locally for a listen, thank you!

 

[elmoe]

Dangerous Music Convert-2

Mike, I think this might be the one. Got a listen in today and I am sold. It is slightly above my price range new, do these come up used on Head-Fi? Best I could find was ~2200 used on eBay. Is it worth waiting for one to pop up here or on audiogon?

 

[MikeW]

Im jealous... that ones out of my price range and i've never heard it. But i've heard great things. It's not really the kind of gear that show's up on Head-Fi. Ebay may be your best bet for a used unit, or perhaps Pro-Audio forums. I think I saw one a couple weeks ago on ebay for 1900, with a missing/damaged volume control module.

 

[elmoe]

I may need to hold off another month... Wife won't be happy but gotta do what I gotta do. Thanks for the recommendation that is pretty much exactly what I was looking for.

 

[MikeW]

Glad I could be of help, there's alot more impressions and information on that product on friends.

 

[richard51]

Try to buy used at low cost around 100 bucks the NOS dac of Starting Point Systems tda 1543 of total minimalistic design... It run with internal battery that I charge with an external battery... The sound is absolutely marvellous and rightly implemented without defects to my ears...Dont let be fooled by the hype and the marketing reviews,i will not change this dac for a 10,000 dollars one, because it deliver music without any of the limitation that some people speak about before their urge to "upgrade... Money paid is the proof for many that their gear is TOTL... That is not so simple in audio...

Astounding purchase on ebay with no negative reviews except some remarks about limitations by people with big pocket who like the "sport" of upgrading components...My experience is cleaning the audio grid and the electrical grid is way more rewarding and most of the times more upgrading than investing in one costly piece of gear, and by the way this dac in a cleaned system does not have any of these so called"limitations", I know that first hand ...

 

[MikeW]

If NOS is your thing... i'd steer more towards Spring Holo... I personally own an 8X TDA1543 Teradak, and also a 16x TDA1543 Chameleon. They are good, but have compromises in other ways I find intolerable. Poor input stage chief among them, this part is so important. Neither is close, IMHO to something like a Convert-2.. that's a serious, serious piece of gear, it's input stage is otherworldy. That guy is crazy about jitter and usb... the Convert-2 is "Delta Sigma's" Yggy.. Dave is likely better, but uhh, 14k.

Edit: you may want to PM user Cskippy, he has owned many pieces of gear, including Yggdrasil, and is a current owner of Convert-2, nice fellow. Also, make sure your gear can handle Convert-2's very hot output stage.. (+23db??) you'll have to look into that further on your own.

 

[elmoe]

Try to buy used at low cost around 100 bucks the NOS dac of Starting Point Systems tda 1543 of total minimalistic design... It run with internal battery that I charge with an external battery... The sound is absolutely marvellous and rightly implemented without defects to my ears...Astounding purchase on ebay with no negative reviews except by people with big pocket who like the "sport" of upgrading components...My experience is cleaning the audio grid and the electrical grid is way more rewarding and most of the times more upgrading than investing in one costly piece of gear ...

Thanks. I will get around to clean power, but integrated in a DAC I'm not so sure about. You got me curious though, I might grab one of these just for testing's sake...

If NOS is your thing... i'd steer more towards Spring Holo... I personally own an 8X TDA1543 Teradak, and also a 16x TDA1543 Chameleon. They are good, but have compromises in other ways I find intolerable. Poor input stage chief among them, this part is so important. Neither is close, IMHO to something like a Convert-2.. that's a serious, serious piece of gear, it's input stage is otherworldy. That guy is crazy about jitter and usb... the Convert-2 is "Delta Sigma's" Yggy.. Dave is likely better, but uhh, 14k.

Yeah I'm not quite at the 14k on a DAC stage just yet. I'm not big on NOS for a DAC. I need something professional, neutral, clean and as analytical as possible to pair with the MPX3. That's my sweet spot. Wish I had a few more hours with the Convert-2, but the 30 mins I got were enough to know it's a step up from my DAC-1 and still hits all the right notes, if I find it for under 2k I'll jump the gun, if I don't by April I might just buy it new.

 

[richard51]

read about this dac here and listen to the designer video:

https://audio.starting-point-systems.com/

and if you are interested buy one used at low cost like me….

This dac had plenty of details in a cleaned audio grid...But musicality also...And because of his minimalistic design few electronics components and then a lower noise level...Any components introduce noise, the art of designing is to calculate the noise introduced and the noise eliminated or filtered but it is always a trade-off exchange when introducing complex electronics... Sometimes simple design is pure genius...For 100 bucks used you have nothing to loose and perhaps like me you will be smiling to reviewer with 10,000 dollars dac...

 

[Zhanming057]

If you care about neutral, R2R is not what you should be looking at.

A couple thoughts:

- Crane Song Solaris. Yes, it has volume control, it even has a non terrible headphone amp inside it, still one of the best performers in its class)
- RME Adi-2 DAC. Absolutely chock full of features, some of which are kind of useful, great value at less than $1,000
- Benchmark DAC 3. Neutral, well controlled.

If you want value, professional DAC's are where it's at.

 

[elmoe]

read about this dac here and listen to the designer video:

https://audio.starting-point-systems.com/

and if you are interested buy one used at low cost like me….

This dac had plenty of details in a cleaned audio grid...But musicality also...And because of his minimalistic design few electronics components and then a lower noise level...Any components introduce noise, the art of designing is to calculate the noise introduced and the noise eliminated or filtered but it is always a trade-off exchange when introducing complex electronics... Sometimes simple design is pure genius...For 100 bucks used you have nothing to loose and perhaps like me you will be smiling to reviewer with 10,000 dollars dac...

Yep for a hundred bucks, it's definitely worth a listen. I can't find one under $250 right now, and am extremely skeptical to be honest, but if I find one for $100 or less I will give it a try.

If you care about neutral, R2R is not what you should be looking at.

A couple thoughts:

- Crane Song Solaris. Yes, it has volume control, it even has a non terrible headphone amp inside it, still one of the best performers in its class)
- RME Adi-2 DAC. Absolutely chock full of features, some of which are kind of useful, great value at less than $1,000
- Benchmark DAC 3. Neutral, well controlled.

If you want value, professional DAC's are where it's at.

Yep,obviously going the Benchmark route is something I thought about, RME ADI-2 as well from what I've read about it so far. I will look into the Crane Song Solaris, that one I've never heard of.