[krismusic]

I just figure that headphones are very different to loudspeakers. With their own strengths and shortcomings. Personally I am not too interested in binaural recordings etc unless I like the music that is recorded. BTW. My head is in fact completely spherical.

 

[zhubajie]

Quote:

I just figure that headphones are very different to loudspeakers. With their own strengths and shortcomings. Personally I am not too interested in binaural recordings etc unless I like the music that is recorded. BTW. My head is in fact completely spherical.

For music that is recorded with loudspeakers in mind, witch is most of the music, the sound will always be between left and right with the middle part usually sounding a bit to the back.
It sounds to me as I am with my back to the stage.
 
When I listen to binaural files everything is really sounding 3D and then it's much more noticable that the front part is missing.
Many might not care because they are used to it and are fine with and never listen to binaural music either.
I just think it's interesting to know why this is. Call it a personal quest
 
Hmm... I found an old link that touches my topic. Interesting read. : http://www.head-fi.org/t/446433/the-quest-for-soundstage

 

[davidsh]

The Stax behemoth: http://www.head-fi.org/a/stax-sr-007-omega-ii-a-review-after-4-years-of-ownership-darth-nuts-epic-review
 
Also, I want to tell you something. Music like binaural music is made with the average ear in mind, in other words based on an average HRTF (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Head-related_transfer_function). If your HRTF deviates from the norm, you could experience the issues you... experience. The problem might be unique to you (or the extend of the problem, whatever).
 
By the way, I have looked into the thread you linked to. It's quite cool, but it blurs the sound as well (dolby headphone/channel mixer setup). Don't really like it, despite being quite cool.

 

[zhubajie]

Quote:

The Stax behemoth: http://www.head-fi.org/a/stax-sr-007-omega-ii-a-review-after-4-years-of-ownership-darth-nuts-epic-review
 
Also, I want to tell you something. Music like binaural music is made with the average ear in mind, in other words based on an average HRTF (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Head-related_transfer_function). If your HRTF deviates from the norm, you could experience the issues you... experience. The problem might be unique to you (or the extend of the problem, whatever).
 
By the way, I have looked into the thread you linked to. It's quite cool, but it blurs the sound as well (dolby headphone/channel mixer setup). Don't really like it, despite being quite cool.

1. The current SR-009 costs a whopping US$ 5000.-. I'm quite sure I will never pay that for a headphone. The linked review is interesting however and I'll read it this evening at home.
 
2. It's only logical no brain\ear\head is 100% alike. This explains the slight differences my wife heard when testing. The forward sound still came from above her forehead but not as far above as I experienced it. She pointed where exactly the sound was coming from while playing the excellent Audiostax binaural testfile "01 Kunstkopfumgang Im IRT, Dr. Theil.flac".
 
3. Indeed but the info in the thread was an interesting read.
I'm not interested in creating a PC with all kinds of software mumbo jumbo to get 3D sound. At home I have my loudspeakers. I want my portable stuff to remain portable and get the most out of it.

 

[davidsh]

We are talking about the sr-007 in the review (the mk.1 version, the newest is mk. 2). The mk. 2 can be had new for 1500 bucks via pricejapan. Ain't that bad 

 It likes a good amp, though.
 
I just can't seem to understand why the majority of people around here think Stax is reserved for ultra hi-end headphone nerds spending 10k+ dollars. There are many good and very competitive options from Stax below 1000$ for a system, especially if you go used. At the moment I am using my system standalone for all types of music ranging from metal to blues, jazz, classical, rock, acoustic and so on.. 
/end rant
 
Above mostly had nothing to do with you.

 

[zhubajie]

I think, when it comes to portable audio,  for most people everything above, say, $ 500.-  changes to *TOO MUCH*. Be it $1000 or $10000 

A lot of us are poor nerds.
And do you know how many gadgets I can buy for that money?!
 
.... but back on topic.
When looking for 3D sound, binaural and surround sound I found some interesting topics so I have some reading to do. I made a start with that Stax review and it's interesting.
I have a feeling the audiologists, I mailed my question to, trashed my mail or forwarded it to the psychiatry department. But I might be a tad too impatient.
 
To be continued...

 

[davidsh]

Quote:

I think, when it comes to portable audio,  for most people everything above, say, $ 500.-  changes to *TOO MUCH*. Be it $1000 or $10000 

A lot of us are poor nerds.
And do you know how many gadgets I can buy for that money?!
 
.... but back on topic.
When looking for 3D sound, binaural and surround sound I found some interesting topics so I have some reading to do. I made a start with that Stax review and it's interesting.
I have a feeling the audiologists, I mailed my question to, trashed my mail or forwarded it to the psychiatry department. But I might be a tad too impatient.
 
To be continued...

Whatever floats your boat... (you sir, are not a proper audiophile)
 
I'd tend to agree with you, though. Frontal positional cues seem to be harder to reproduce for some reason. You might want to email chesky recordings, they must know a lot about the matter.

 

[zhubajie]

Quote:

Whatever floats your boat... (you sir, are not a proper audiophile)
 
I'd tend to agree with you, though. Frontal positional cues seem to be harder to reproduce for some reason. You might want to email chesky recordings, they must know a lot about the matter.

1. 

 ... but a proper audiophile can be a poor gadgetfreak too ... 

 
2. Yep, that's what I understand too.
    I followed your advice and sent them my question. I hope they will answer.
    I will post it here when I receive it.

 

[JK1]

High frequencies are very directional in nature. Low frequencies are very nondirectional in nature. You should try adjusting the crossfeed settings on your players until you find those that suit you. Just about all recordings are made with the intention of being played through speakers. The crossfeed settings on your player will determine how much of the opposite channel is mixed in, and with what time delay, so you can approach the speaker listening experience when using headphones.

 

[Diablosbud]

Most audio recordings are mixed and mastered using stereo speakers, so when we listen to them on headphones the sound seems to have a different orientation. I almost guarantee that is why you feel this way. Sometimes I put my headphones on and I think there is something wrong with the imaging, then I realize I'm just used to my speaker setup. Try a binaural recording and see if you still feel the same way.

 

[zhubajie]

It would be so nice if people read more than the header of the thread before responding.....

 

[Diablosbud]

Sorry

. I'm not really sure what else it could be. Maybe your positioning the headphones too far back on your head. What is your source? Does it have any digital signal processing enabled? I honestly think this is just a fault of headphones, perhaps if you get a really well programmed cross-feed you will feel differently about headphones. Every cross-feed is different, so don't write that option off so quickly. I always feel weird about headphone imaging and I feel like I'm missing something with cross-feed, so I just try to deal with the fact that my headphones have a different presentation than my speaker system. It's kind of made me put more money into my speaker setup. I started my audiophile journey with headphones only to jump ship to speakers (I love planar magnetic headphones for their deep bass and electrostatic headphones are somewhat affordable compared to their speaker counterparts).

 

[krismusic]

What options are available to give cross feed, other than that incorporated into an amp?

 

[Chromako]

Oook. We've run-very- far away from the original question. But the point about your brain not getting the usual cues for positioning is the key- the brain expects and uses the mixing of the channels and phase differences to draw a spacial picture. You have none of that with headphones. Each brain will interpret the "unnatural" lack of channel mixing differently, perhaps explaining your funky positioning-interpretation. 
 
So. You can make the cues artificially by using DSP. That's what the Dolby Headphone DSP is for. It's not perfect, but it's pretty decent. I use it for gaming, and it can be creepy good for that. 
 
Also.. Linky. That's what 3D positioning is all about. Listen with headphones, of course. This creation requires specialised microphones (synthetic head) or sophisticated DSP to make. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8IXm6SuUigI
 
Listen to that. Do it now. And CLOSE YOUR EYES when doing so. 
 
Crossfeed: Foobar plugins. Also, Fidelia with the DSP option. Fidelia with DSP is what I use for music, and Dolby Headphone for games.

 

[JK1]

Quote:

What options are available to give cross feed, other than that incorporated into an amp?

Rockbox gives great control over crossfeed. Rockbox will even run on the $31 4GB Sandisk Clip+(which has a microSDHC card slot, so you could add a 32GB card, or even a 64GB microSDXC card formatted as FAT32). The Sandisk Clip Zip though, at around $7 more than the Clip+ is more convenient than the Clip+ using Rockbox, as the player is basically the same size, but has a larger screen.