Project Ember Tube Rolling
May 11, 2017 at 5:46 PM Post #2,956 of 3,354
Yea that price isn't bad! I'm curious to see how it sounds, and I'll take your word blindly, I hear a lot of positive about the KenRad Tubes, they are known for their SLAMMING bass, so we will see! The adapter will arrive to me, by the end of the month. An I'll have the tube in about a week

You can try foil paper around the cable of the adapter. In my case with these tubes the Faraday cage alone did not remove all EMI entirely, but I use my Ember in a very nasty environment (my office) with many power supplies, computers and WIFI around....

Others tried successfully ferrite core filters like these, but check that it is for the right cable thickness:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/5pcs-3-5mm-...972299?hash=item28319b978b:g:LzIAAOSw3ZRY9dcW

Overall the biggest bass I have got with the Ember was with 6C8G RCA. I just didn't need so much bass :wink:
 
May 11, 2017 at 5:52 PM Post #2,957 of 3,354
You can try foil paper around the cable of the adapter. In my case with these tubes the Faraday cage alone did not remove all EMI entirely, but I use my Ember in a very nasty environment (my office) with many power supplies, computers and WIFI around....

Others tried successfully ferrite core filters like these, but check that it is for the right cable thickness:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/5pcs-3-5mm-...972299?hash=item28319b978b:g:LzIAAOSw3ZRY9dcW

Overall the biggest bass I have got with the Ember was with 6C8G RCA. I just didn't need so much bass :wink:
nwavesailor, offered to ship me one if it took the noise out of his 6f8g, I too am concerned about the bass, my 6sn7 EHs have a LOT so much so that it really doesn't suite any of my headphones all that well, but I'm hoping a slightly larger sound stage with the same quantity of bass will help to bring it back down to earth
 
May 11, 2017 at 6:14 PM Post #2,958 of 3,354
Tunkejazz, I bought those exact 3.5mm ferrite beads and in my situation, on the wire going to the cap of a TS 6F8G, it had close to 0 effect. I'm glad I only spent a little over $1 for the 5 pack.

Put my Faraday cage back in place (with a ground strap to the chassis) and..............................stone quiet again !!!!!!!!!!!:)

Bad news Mshenay on the ferrite beads, in my situation, useless. I also don't have enough chicken wire fencing left to have you build your own cage:slight_frown:
 
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May 11, 2017 at 6:59 PM Post #2,959 of 3,354
Tunkejazz, I bought those exact 3.5mm ferrite beads and in my situation, on the wire going to the cap of a TS 6F8G, it had close to 0 effect. I'm glad I only spent a little over $1 for the 5 pack.

Put my Faraday cage back in place (with a ground strap to the chassis) and..............................stone quiet again !!!!!!!!!!!:)

Bad news Mshenay on the ferrite beads, in my situation, useless. I also don't have enough chicken wire fencing left to have you build your own cage:slight_frown:

Just to reiterate what @nwavesailor said, I wouldn't use a 6F8G without shielding. My Raytheon VT-99 (6F8G) hums annoyingly loud in the left channel. Moving my hand near the tube or touching the thumbscrews quiets it down. With the amount of great tubes out there that don't require any type of cage... why bother?
 
May 12, 2017 at 11:48 AM Post #2,960 of 3,354
Just to reiterate what @nwavesailor said, I wouldn't use a 6F8G without shielding. My Raytheon VT-99 (6F8G) hums annoyingly loud in the left channel. Moving my hand near the tube or touching the thumbscrews quiets it down. With the amount of great tubes out there that don't require any type of cage... why bother?

well I hear about a lot of duals, but I'm trying to find a good single for now in that $50 price range, so I guess I'll hear it for my self. eBay is pretty decent about returns so I'm not super worried tbh worse comes to worse, It'll cost me $5 to send it back and I'll just try another
 
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May 12, 2017 at 2:18 PM Post #2,961 of 3,354
"well I hear about a lot of duals, but I'm trying to find a good single for now in that $50 price range, so I guess I'll hear it for my self. eBay is pretty decent about returns so I'm not super worried tbh worse comes to worse, It'll cost me $5 to send it back and I'll just try another."

Not sure what you mean about being able to return a tube and try another. I wouldn't count on being able to buy tubes on eBay and send them back just because you don't like them. Unless the tube is somehow defective, it isn't fair to the seller to send it back if the sound isn't to your liking. Nor should you tell the seller there is a problem with a tube just to be able to return it. Just my opinion about how to treat eBay sellers as long as their description of the item is correct. I don't sell on eBay but I've sold a lot on Head-Fi. I've had a couple of people here send tubes back to me when there was nothing wrong with them saying they had a problem but there was no problem when I got them back and checked them.
 
May 12, 2017 at 5:30 PM Post #2,962 of 3,354
"well I hear about a lot of duals, but I'm trying to find a good single for now in that $50 price range, so I guess I'll hear it for my self. eBay is pretty decent about returns so I'm not super worried tbh worse comes to worse, It'll cost me $5 to send it back and I'll just try another."

Not sure what you mean about being able to return a tube and try another. I wouldn't count on being able to buy tubes on eBay and send them back just because you don't like them. Unless the tube is somehow defective, it isn't fair to the seller to send it back if the sound isn't to your liking. Nor should you tell the seller there is a problem with a tube just to be able to return it. Just my opinion about how to treat eBay sellers as long as their description of the item is correct. I don't sell on eBay but I've sold a lot on Head-Fi. I've had a couple of people here send tubes back to me when there was nothing wrong with them saying they had a problem but there was no problem when I got them back and checked them.

Most of the vendors I buy from on eBay allow for exchanges. Based on if it works in your system or not, so if it is really noisy I pay to ship it back and exchange it for another Tube of theirs. I wouldn't lie to them about it working or not working, that's dishonest. An again, the vendors that I buy from have always offered me an exchange when I found a tube didn't work well in my Amp. I did it with the Starlight once, one of the tubes I got just did NOT have proper gain in the amp and was to quiet. I worked with a guy out of NC and he was more than happy to exchange it for another! I just paid to ship it back, which I had no problem with of course. Most of the US based guys are very easy to work with! An state their return policy pretty plainly.

Granted, when I make a purchase on head fi, if I don't like it I sell it. I've never even thought to return a product I purchased here, were not that kind of market place.

Also, speaking of Buying and Selling, when I've sold here I always ship with Insurance equal to the purchase amount. If there REALLY is physical dmg [and I've had tubes crack during transit] USPS is very easy to work with. They'll issue the full amount that you insured via check to the recipient [or buyer] so as a benefit to my self and my buyers, I insure my sales here on Head Fi. Of the two times I've had to use said Insurance, USPS wasn't difficult to work with, and my buyer didn't seem to mind getting a full refund plus the product that was purchased

I also purchased a Sylvania 6sn7 GT Black Base Green Letters, Top Getter and Stepped Plates on eBay for like $15 today as well, it had a small crack on the base. Buyer was pretty upfront about it, and because of that fault it was as cheap as it was, so I figured I'd get it to try as well!
 
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May 13, 2017 at 5:21 PM Post #2,963 of 3,354
Kenrad is the best and national union second.... for 7193 tubes..... its simple, all is better across the range.. soundstage is better definite and all frequencies are more vivid... and that is the same on my speakers or on my hifiman he 400...if you read on the internet you will discover many favorable reviews of people who goes from 6sn7 good tubes toward 7193 better tubes...I had not discovered one negative review on the net,( hence i bought several tubes) here is a sample of reviews from different sources:

«National Union vs RCA vs Ken-Rad 7193 tubes.
Since I have converted my Chenin to 7193s, I have been evaluating the different brands of 7193s available (in addition to enjoying the great sound!). Let me say that they are all excellent tubes, but there are some subtle differences between them, both in sound and in construction. All have black, relatively flat plates, with small boxes in the center.
National Union: The NUs have the smallest bottle of the three 7193s, and the getter is not visible from the exterior of the tubes. They have a round top and bottom mica. These were the first 7193s I ever heard, and they sound very good indeed. These are silky smooth, with a rich midrange. They are a little rolled off on the extremes compared to the other two tubes, but it is a not a huge difference.
RCA: The RCAs have a larger bottle than the NUs, with a bottom getter and round top and bottom mica. They have more extended highs and lows than the NUs, with fuller bass and a little more detail on top. Not quite as smooth as the NUs, and not quite as warm in the midrange.
Ken-Rad: The biggest bottle of the three, slightly larger than the RCA, with bottom getter and non-round top and bottom mica (looks like a round mica with a section cut out in each quadrant). The best bass of the three - the impact of kick drums is sensational, and bass lines can be felt and heard in great detail. The highs are nice and airy, with very good detail, and the midrange is very sweet as well.
So overall, in my opinion, I would rank the 7193s as follows:
Ken-Rad: best overall - it has everything
National Union: smoothest and warmest sounding, but a little less top and bottom than the others
RCA: Similar to the Ken-Rad, but not quite as smooth in the highs.»

«The ultimate 6SN7 for me wasn't a 6SN7 at all. I replaced the 6SN7s in my Supratek Chenin preamp with CCS loaded 2C22 single triodes, biased to 3.4V using (4) Cree SiC Schottky Diodes on the cathode. To say they were MUCH MUCH better is an understatement. The 2C22 is roughly equivalent to 1/2 of a 6SN7, but the anode and grid are taken out via top caps.
Bass is clearer and more defined, mids are to die for, treble is sparkling without being grating. Using the CCS I am able to replace both sections of the 6SN7 with a single 2C22 and still have plenty of gain.
What is magic is the 2C22/7193, but that's 6.6k Rp and two top caps. Mind, that's where the magic is if that's what you want and you have a high input impedence on your amp. I thank my lucky stars i came across that tube.»

«I converted my 6SN7 preamp to 2C22 and there's no going back - better high, lows, spatial rendition, tone, etc. I run them at 14.6mA, 175V, CCS on plate, Cree SiC Shottky diodes for bias,
I couldn't believe my ears when I heard the 2C22 a few years ago - it made all 6SN7s sound boring».


«I know the 2C22 stage sounds excellent - almost DHT.»

«In my experience, the 7193 is sonically superior to any 6sn7 regardless of manufacture... nos or otherwise.
Comparatively speaking: the 7193's sonic signature is a combination of the best of the 6sn7 family.
Combine the bass power and depth of the Kenrad black, the 3 dimentional midrange of the old tungsol round plate,the bloom of the Rca grey glass with the treble extention of the best nos sylvania's.
Although a little more difficult to find these days, they generally sell for a fraction of the cost of the nos 6sn7's.»

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hello, can i ask something? it is possible to run 7193 tubes on little dot mkII? I HAVE 2 PAIRS OF POWER TUBES AND 2 DRIVER TUBES MULLARDS... THANKS
 
May 13, 2017 at 6:14 PM Post #2,964 of 3,354
<snip>

I also purchased a Sylvania 6sn7 GT Black Base Green Letters, Top Getter and Stepped Plates on eBay for like $15 today as well, it had a small crack on the base. Buyer was pretty upfront about it, and because of that fault it was as cheap as it was, so I figured I'd get it to try as well!

If you find you like the Sylvania it would be worth trying the 6SN7W. They are much like the one you bought, just better. Improved bass extension and detail, a bit sweeter mids, clearer highs, and wider, more open highs with a excellent sense of air.
 
May 13, 2017 at 9:21 PM Post #2,965 of 3,354
The 7193 'Franken Tubes' may be really, REALLY good, I can't say.

I have more than enough 6 volt, 12 volt and single plate dual tubes to not be tempted to go down another adapter / tube type rabbit hole.................at least not TODAY! :thinking:
 
May 13, 2017 at 11:19 PM Post #2,966 of 3,354
hello, can i ask something? it is possible to run 7193 tubes on little dot mkII? I HAVE 2 PAIRS OF POWER TUBES AND 2 DRIVER TUBES MULLARDS... THANKS

I have a Little Dot MKIII and the power tubes are compatible with Project Ember but the driver tubes are NOT. Not to mention that the Little Dot amps are not nearly as tube roller friendly as the Project amps. I would highly advise against trying tubes that the amp is not explicitly designed for with LD amps. At the very least, please check with David at Little Dot before buying any tubes that may not be compatible.

There, I've done my good deed for today.
 
May 13, 2017 at 11:43 PM Post #2,967 of 3,354
If you find you like the Sylvania it would be worth trying the 6SN7W. They are much like the one you bought, just better. Improved bass extension and detail, a bit sweeter mids, clearer highs, and wider, more open highs with a excellent sense of air.

I'll do you one better, I'm going to compare the... 1950 6sn7 arriving on Thursday, to a 1945 6sn7w Chrome Dome AND I'll compare that to a 1950s 6sn7w vt 231... and let you guys know what I think.
 
May 14, 2017 at 12:13 PM Post #2,969 of 3,354
I recall reading old posts that connieflyer, and some of the old regulars that have moved on to better amps, were quite taken with the 7193 tubes. Then dual 6J5G, 6C5G, 6L5G, 6P5G seemed to be the 'hot tubes' and in favor. I see that richard51 is still a big fan of the Franken Tubes. Do other Ember owners still use their dual Franken Tube setup and find it be their top tube choice?
 
May 14, 2017 at 12:22 PM Post #2,970 of 3,354
I have the Franken setup with my Ember. It is really good in some aspects, especially with the Ken-Rads. I am terrible describing audio, and I normally find that changing tubes has a minor but noticeable change in sound. But here it goes, if I was going to mention something that is very good with the Franken Ember is the BIG sound and huge stage. I don't think that the Visseaux 6J5 with my setup give as good stage. With the FrankenEmber drums are impressive, and they provide a bit of a fun factor in that respect. The V's are more "correct" and neutral.

They sound certainly different than the Raytheon 6SN7 that I have been using lately. The latter emphasises deep-bass and a very clean mid-range, but the stage is a bit less layered than with the FrankenEmber. The advantage of the FrankenEmber is that it is relatively inexpensive, especially if you live in Europe because there are some Italian sellers with very competitive prices.

The down side is that you have 4 wires that may be exposed to EMI, I normally need the cage (aka, a metal cutlery container from IKEA).

I hope this helps!
 
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