Project 1.2 vs. Technics 1200?

[Mr. X]

For those who have experience with Project turntables:

Do you think the Project 1.2 would be a worthy upgrade from a Technics 1200? I've noticed that the 1.2 has a speed changer, which is convenient. If I were to go for the upgrade, I wouldn't want to spend more than $500 (so I hope that would include a 1.2 and a decent tone arm + cartridge).......

...anyway, worth the upgrade?

 

[Jose Garcia]

I have a friend who owns a 1200 and it is a 1200 defender all the way. He has dealed with Kevin, from www.kabusa.com and they offer some interesting upgrades to these units. The external power supply upgrades sounds like a worth investment. You should try calling Kevin and asking him personally about the options he offer.

I'm not related to Kabusa in any way, just by the comments on other Forums and my friends.

Jose.

 

[BlindTiger]

The pro ject speed changer is a little key like dohickey that you use to raise the belt to another notch on the pulley.
It's a very solid, simple TT. I've showed it to people and they in turn recomment it to people looking for a simple TT.
And, it's true when they say the platter is balance by little dimples made on the underside of the platter.

 

[eyeteeth]

I have a Pro-Ject 1.2 Xpression.
I also have no other turntable experience.
I decided upon it due to rave reviews in U.K. magazines that can be tough on equipment. HiFi+ and HiFi Choice. Also the Canadian mag The Inner Ear.
I'm happy with it and believe what I've read that it is solidly engineered for sound quality alone. No bells or whistles. I can't remember the below reviews well enough to recall if they rave about the carbon fiber arm the way the Brits did.
Even with my limited knowledge, I'm sure it outperforms the automatic Technics which looks like it has different priorities than home audio.

http://www.audioenz.co.nz/2004/project_1xpression.shtml
http://www.enjoythemusic.com/magazin...ctspeedbox.htm
http://www.6moons.com/audioreviews/project/project.html

 

[Mr. X]

Thanks, guys. I now have to eat MAJOR crow:

YOU HEAD-FI VINYL ENTHUSIASTS WERE RIGHT!! Man, was I ever wrong. I just brought home my new Pro-ject 1.2 and am COMPLETELY blown away. I have enjoyed vinyl all my life without realizing how much I was missing out on.

Technics 1200 = Total Garbage. That table is strictly for clubbing. I was too closed minded to believe that you can't get audiophile-quality sound out of it. (Mainly because I didn't want to know that I threw $400 away on it) For $350 I got a turntable and cartridge that blows away anything I have ever heard in my life.

The Sumiko Oyster cartridge that came with the table is an amazing match for my Rotel and B&W system. I just can't get over how good it sounds!

My Rotel CD Deck can't touch it...

The sound is so perfect that I many not even want to DeClick (remove the minor pops & clicks) from vinyl-->CD-R recordings.

Question: Will the brush that came with my Ortofon cartridge do any damage to the Sumiko cartridge? I used it once (from back to front) to get a little dirt off of the stylus...no damage done so far...

 

[lini]

Well, if you compare these tables with such different cartridges, I'm not really surprised about the results. Paired with a better cartridge, the Technics does a way better job than with your dj series Ortofon, though...

Greetings from Hannover!

Manfred / lini

 

[eyeteeth]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr. X YOU HEAD-FI VINYL ENTHUSIASTS WERE RIGHT!! Man, was I ever wrong. I just brought home my new Pro-ject 1.2 and am COMPLETELY blown away. I have enjoyed vinyl all my life without realizing how much I was missing out on.

That was my expectation.

I'm never overly convinced by guys who overly praise gear they own and so I didn't want to do the same thing. Although I've heard some suggest the Xpression is even a tad better than the much more expensive Rega P3. Again and again the U.K. reviewers stressed that this table can easily handle a cartidge more expensive than the table itself, which was a positive consideration in my making my choice.

I don't know about the brush. In Canada the Xpression came with an Audio Technica cartridge which I did upgrade to a very lively and dynamic Dynavector. I ended up with a rather pricey stylus cleaner the Onzow Zerodust but honestly I don't know how much better or worse it is from another. I may have been suckered (by myself) into equating more expensive with better.

Congatulations Mr. X

 

[Mr. X]

Thank you! Even if I could have made the 1200 sound better with a better cartridge...I ended up with a better table, tone arm AND cartridge for only $350! I had no idea that you could get amazing vinyl playback for such a low price.

The Sumiko Oyster may not be the best out there, but it sure sounds great matched with my system. I'm going to be happy for a long time. When I'm ready to upgrade, I'll have to decide if I'd rather upgrade the whole turntable or just the cartridge.

I am VERY satisfied with my hi-fi now...

 

[eyeteeth]

I'd enjoy it as it is for awhile.
I believe I jumped the gun on upgrading my cartridge too soon.
It wasn't necessary really.

 

[bln]

Eyeteeth (or anyone else), do you use the $100 Speed Box often reviewed with the turntable?

 

[eyeteeth]

I do have the speedbox.
I know the reviewers praise the speedbox for sonic improvements.
I don't recall hearing any really noticable improvement with it added to the chain. It may have been there with really careful listening but I considered it to be more a device of convenience for switching from 33 1/3 to 45 rpms. As I have one 45 rpm LP I came to regret spending the money. Personally, unless I can hear a difference without too much effort, I don't consider it worthwhile. That's just me.

I also have the Pro-Ject phono box SE .

 

[bln]

Eyeteeth, is there a difference between the 1.2 and the 1 Xpression? I asked over at Audio asylum someone linked me to a Sumiko product page for the 1.2, which isn't on their site now. The 1 Xpression is on the webpage, and it specifies "carbon fiber arm," but I got the impression that the 1.2 arm was aluminum.

 

[eyeteeth]

I think the 1.2 is a previous model that may have been discontinued without the web site updated?
The US distributer doesn't list the 1.2, only the 1 Xpression.

http://www.sumikoaudio.net/project/index.htm

 

[lini]

bln: If the arm tube is metal, then it's the regular 1.2 (or 1.2c, if it turns off at the end of the record) - if it's a carbon tube, it's the Xpression.

Mr.X: I'd not even claim the 1.2 to be the better table with the better arm, actually - but I really depends very much on the choice of cartridge. All in all, you seem to have made a very nice deal, though...

Greetings from Hannover!

Manfred / lini

 

[bln]

http://www.sumikoaudio.net/project/products/1_2.htm

It doesn't specify a carbon-fiber arm. I'm considering a Project table but have questions about the quality of their arms, compared to a Rega P2 or one of the OEM versions of that table (Goldring GR-1, NAD 533).