[dazzer1975]

Anyone use these, what equipment do you use alongside them, i.e. headphone amps etc.

How do you find the sound?

I have just ordered the mz-n910 used, goign to order the rh1 soon, but would like fellow md users experiences.

Cheers

 

[Beyerfan70]

Well Sq on mini disc has always been great,and the 910 is a smashing player indeed.
Ive been using md and hi-md for years and they have got better and better.
I have the rh1 myself and even though the 910 is brilliant,wait till you hear the rh1!
Very versatile machines with incredible sound quality.
They dont really need an amp to be honest,and any decent phone will make it shine.
I use a variety,ue super fi 3,shure e3c,e210,beyer 231,hd 202,marshmallows and it sounds heavenly.
Ive always preferred the atrac format,even though they play mp3 really nicely atrac just sounds fuller and more vibrant....pity they scrapped the format,shame on you sony.
Anyway you wont be disappointed,best portables out there!

 

[BIGHMW]

I'll also voucher for the RH1 as I have a ton of MiniDisc and Hi-MD units, and assorted accessories, and have been collecting them since I got into it in 1998.

Also, incase all of you may not know, there is another Hi-MD unit, it is basically the RH1 with an ECM-DS70P microphone included as part of the deal, it is known as the MZ-M200, and it is exactly identical to the RH1, the only difference is the model number.

If you want the whole scoop and history of MiniDisc and Hi-MD, as well as infor on the ATRAC format and its spinoffs, such as ATRAC3 and ATRAC3plus, you should go to MiniDisc.org at Minidisc Community Portal and they also have a forum, in which I am damn proud to be a member of (user ID: BIGHMW) at Minidisc Community Forums (Powered by Invision Power Board).

You won't be disappointed.

 

[synaesthetic]

It's a shame Sony squandered MiniDisc so badly. It was a great amateur recording format that Sony just murdered by treating it like a listening format.

 

[BIGHMW]

Quote:

Originally Posted by synaesthetic /img/forum/go_quote.gif It's a shame Sony squandered MiniDisc so badly. It was a great amateur recording format that Sony just murdered by treating it like a listening format.

You said that MiniDisc (and Hi-MD by extension) was a great amateur recording format???

WRONG, DUDE.

It still is a great recording format, and it even caught the eyes of some top pros out there too, as the MZ-M200, yes you can find it (and the blank media for them, both MD and Hi-MD, on eBay and at MiniDisco.com Minidisco: The MiniDisc Superstore, MiniDisc Recorders, Players, Headphones, Microphones and more! and other online retailers. You won't find them at Circuit City or Best Buy.

 

[synaesthetic]

I'm not saying it's not viable even after Sony officially uprooted and hacked the roots off the MD tree and tossed it into the compost heap. It's still impressive as hell for that purpose.

What I am saying is as a market force, it is dead as a doorknob. MiniDisc is a commercial failure, like Betamax before it (which as most nerds know, was and still is superior to VHS).

It wasn't until the advent of the RH1 that Sony finally wised up and removed all the painful restrictions placed upon the device. The RH1 is a clear case of "too little, too late." It had features and capabilities that should have been implemented years ago in the first Hi-MD devices!

Sony killed MiniDisc, because they tried to market it as a listening format and not as a recording format, strangled it to death with draconian rights management limitations and clung too fiercely to their proprietary codec, rather than acknowledging MP3 as the industry standard.

They finally realized this with the last line of MD devices, albeit far too late to save MD as a commercial venture.

 

[BIGHMW]

Quote:

Originally Posted by synaesthetic /img/forum/go_quote.gif What I am saying is as a market force, it is dead as a doorknob. MiniDisc is a commercial failure, like Betamax before it (which as most nerds know, was and still is superior to VHS). Sony killed MiniDisc, because they tried to market it as a listening format and not as a recording format, strangled it to death with draconian rights management limitations and clung too fiercely to their proprietary codec, rather than acknowledging MP3 as the industry standard.

But I am sure as are you that we both agree that ATRAC (3/3plus) was a superior sounding codec compared to MP3 in the same bit rate, but I think what killed it was the marketing of MP3 and the technology eventually catching up to that of ATRAC, where as Sony mis-marketed (typical of Sony of course) it and hardly ever advanced it to keep pace with MP3, except for ATRAC3, when MDLP was introduced in MD recorders around 2000, and also ATRAC3plus around 2003, but, it was too little, too late by then, as while MP3 may not be the best sounding standard codec, it was the most accepted standard codec, mainstream marketing wise, and Sony failed (once again) to keep pace.

That is what eventually killed both MiniDisc (and Hi-MD) and the ATRAC codec, but yet I continue to use it every single day, both with my lineup of MD/Hi-MD portable, car, pro, and home decks, as well as my arsenal of NW-HD5's (all three in silver, I am currently using the most used one first, then the newer used one when it dies, and then, my newly-purchsed deadstock one, if it ever goes that far), in which I bought on eBay.

As for the RH1, I currently own two of them, one I use as an MD/Hi-MD uploader/downloader on my PC, and one I have stored in my drawer as a replacement backup just in case it dies on me.

 

[dazzer1975]

Cool, I knew I could rely on head-fi'ers to have some info about these players.

I found that forum you mentioned and asked about amps et al but got no replies so I thought I'd ask here.

Thanks for replying, as a result I am excited about the md player arriving after hearing your enthusiasm about them.

I actually had a kenwood md player/recorder easily ten years ago but it was stolen 6 mths into ownership and I never bothered with md portables again... until now

As far as I am concerned, as long as you can get blank media then the format isn't dead, sure, there may not be future developments and as a commercial enterprise it may very well be dead, but there is always a future if you have the hardware and the media.

Lets face it, how long are portable players designed to work for anyway? I see no issue with longevity, manufacturer support and development maybe, but end user implementation, no.

Ok, I am gonna pull the trigger and order the rh1, apart from anything else it looks a beast.

thanks again for your comments, all of you, always nice to see a genuine discussion evolve.

p.s. care to elaborate about the distinction and implication of md as a listening or recording medium as opposed just being a medium good at both? What are the issues here?

 

[synaesthetic]

I would not bother with MiniDisc unless you intend to primarily record with it. The RH1 especially, as it's designed as a recorder first and foremost.

Otherwise all you've really got is a pretty good sounding portable that's size is all out of proportion with how much storage space it has.

If you're interested in a good Sony DAP, the A720 series is a great and far cheaper choice. I love my A728 to bits. But it doesn't play ATRAC at all; if you want ATRAC capability, try to pick up an HD5 or an A808.

 

[Beyerfan70]

On whether its better for recording or listening it excels at both,especially the rh1!
For recording either your band practice,demos,field recorder,etc its fantastic.
For listening you can connect it to your pc and put music on it from sonicstage,which despite most people complaining about was a fine music library,and not difficult to use at all.
I still use sonicstage cp for my hi-md's and also my atrac dap's and never have a problem.
On top of that If you use the optical out and record from your cd player,even on hi-sp mode,at atrac 256 the quality is absolutely jaw dropping,better than any dap!
Record on pcm and your jaw will drop off! yep its that good!
Ok you cannot fit as many songs on a 1gb disc as you can on a dap,but that has never bothered me at all.
I'd take quality over quantity every time.
Of course its all down to personal opinion but sound is what matters and for that it just cant be beat!

 

[BIGHMW]

...and, it also uploads all of your finished MDs and Hi-MD's (mic, digital optical-in or analog line-in, it doesn't matter) directly to SonicStage (it comes with 3.4, but I recommend you upgrade to 4.2 CP if you have XP as I do, or 4.3 CP if you have Vista, not recommended due to Vista issues.), so you can use it in tandem with your DAP, you can even convert it from ATRAC to the MP3 format if you wish for use with your DAP (some will work with SS 4.2CP). I uploaded my entire legacy MD collecton from years past (and if you have the [legacy MD only] record tab in "protect" mode, it "clones" to disc and uploads it with out erasing the master disc!) to SS and use it on my HD5 as my everyday player, and it is just great for all of your music. Combine that with its powerful recording capabilities, where the RH1/M200 really shines, and you have a 1GB recording and uploading powerhouse.

As for going to the MDCF about external amps, I can tell you as a veteran user on that board (MDCF user ID: BIGHMW), that the crew is more interested in the formats themselves rather than teaming them with custom IEM's or cans like you guys here on Head-Fi do, so that would not be their expertise.

 

[dazzer1975]

well the n910 arrived ten minutes ago.

Used off ebay, silver colour, came with remote, headphones, sonic stage cd, usb cable, optical cable, battery, carry case, charger and charging dock type stand thing.

I have an old hifi with an added minidisc deck which I used those ten long years ago with the kenwood md portable I had, and ten mini discs that I havent listened to since then.

I am sat here typing this going through these forgotten mini discs 4 so far were blank (74 mins discs), I am on the second one discovering music I haven't listened to in a decade, whether its nostalgia, placebo, new toy syndrome, or fact, I don't know, but it is clear the sound is phenomenal, I can't believe I ditched this format after my last portable was stolen, it is clear that these are very VERY serious playback machines, at the very least, on the portable front. The best of it is, is that I am using the stock sennheiser ear buds that came with my iriver h340 and I am simply astounded with the sound, it is fast, clear, airy with great imaging and vertical and horizontal soundstage. Clearly the player is creating this level of resolution, I cant wait to start playing about with it with my other earphones.

The rh1 should be here by 1pm tomorrow.

I took the plunge as I like new toys and gadgets and I am glad I did, sure, you don't have the capacity of hdd or flash based players, but, in my situation, I never use my portable equipment outside without having my backpack with me, and I have a couple of times taken my imod, vcap dock and amp on the go, so to use a md player and carry a few discs (not that a few would necessarily be needed, I mean I only have the opportunity to listen to music for 2 hrs at the most when out and about during any particular day so that is a non issue for me.

Recording will be nice for lectures, though not essential, but what I do like is the ability to hook it up to my hifi minidisc deck optically and record direct from my cd player onto mini disc. That is how these mini discs I am rediscovering were recorded onto and they do honestly sound better than the wav files I have on my hdd players.

Slightly tongue in cheek but mini disc is most definitely the future lol

I mean seriously, I dont think I have ever paid this little for a player aside from a sansa clip, and this is seriously right at the top of the tree, god knows how the rh1 is going to sound, and at the same price as the classic 160 too, if the n910 is anything to go by, its a no brainer.

 

[shigzeo]

i too am an md user of old (but only since 1999). i find it great for the time but... really the sq is not up to the same level as other hd or flash players of now. the reason it is considered amazing now is that it is out of vogue. it was so hugely in vogue in the late ninties and early 2000 that it was hard to say against it.

plus, sony put all sorts of absurd advertising farces on air and on paper for md. for instance, since 1996, they said it sounded better than dac and 1995 better than cd. that is impossible.

then, in 2002 or 2003, they said atrac3 was better than mp3 at 128 even when bitrate was at 64. the only test to confirm that a cd that sony burned that contained the converted atrac and converted mp3 files. that file was played 'blindly' to a sony brigade in europe.

the sony team found the atrac to be better overall than 128 kbps mp3. there has been such extravagant advertisements in md land since its advent so that sony could gain an edge.

what i love md for is editing capabilities on the unit itself such as random track placement and moving/deleting as well as title manipulation but as for sound quality: it is nothing better than anything else, just different. when md was big, sony were considered quite the ipod of the industry: just neutral sounding: now they are gods. so, when the ipod has faded, everyone even in headfi will look back on it with such love.

md is great but has been surpassed long ago. by the way, sony still use atrac. i have it on my sony 828 and 615.

 

[dazzer1975]

Quote:

Originally Posted by shigzeo /img/forum/go_quote.gif just neutral sounding: now they are gods. so, when the ipod has faded, everyone even in headfi will look back on it with such love.

wow man, get over it.

 

[BIGHMW]

Way to go!

I am glad you are getting back on the horse and riding it proudly like that. I can say on behalf of most of us that we are so pre-occupied with how many gigabytes we happen to have on our DAP's that we fail to realize that "old-school is still cool", that is why MiniDisc and Hi-MD will always appeal to even the cult crowds out there, in spite of Sony.

BTW, when Sony "pulled the plug" on MiniDisc, they failed to tell the retailers to stop carrying the many, many blank discs, remotes, remote-control-friendly phones/IEM's (SP or SL Series), cases, and other accessories that MiniDisc once had. Just like iPod has a ton of gear for it now, MiniDisc has always had, for over 10 years! You can find all of them if you search hard, but they are out there, sometimes, deadstock or in excellent used condition, and there are plenty of online stores that carry more, as well as there is always eBay.

When you get your RH1, have fun uploading all of those legacy MDs you are rediscovering to you PC, and don't forget to upload SS 3.4 first and then upgrade to SS 4.2CP for complete and unrestricted access and uploading/downloading. You will not be disappointed, I will (in the words of Vince McMahon or Jim Ross on WWE Monday Night RAW), "guaran-damn-tee" you that!