[chesebert]

I dislike my local DCS dealer so it was easier to be less curious.

The owner of the dCS dealer I visited is Andreas’ next door neighbor

 

[DJJEZ]

Do you think Vivaldi would work in a more lively and dynamic sounding system with slight greater emphasis on mid like Grado (cans), Avantgarde or Pure Audio Project (2 channel)?

I can't say I just think it's extremely overpriced and I didn't even get to hear it with the clock or upsampler. I'm sure with those 2 it's way better but the price is ridiculous for all 3 when the dac alone is $48500. I obviously didn't pay full price I got around 25% discount but I'm sure the mpd8 smokes it based on friends that have heard both. The vivaldi apex did everything good but nothing amazing for me. Could also of been bad synergy with my wa33 elite and red october and needs a crazy 2 channel to really shine but based on what i heard just wasnt wowed. Another friend has one right now he's borrowing and is saying similar things as well. @Roasty

 

[F208Frank]

I can't say I just think it's extremely overpriced and I didn't even get to hear it with the clock or upsampler. I'm sure with those 2 it's way better but the price is ridiculous for all 3 when the dac alone is $48500. I obviously didn't pay full price I got around 25% discount but I'm sure the mpd8 smokes it based on friends that have heard both. The vivaldi apex did everything good but nothing amazing for me. Could also of been bad synergy with my wa33 elite and red october and needs a crazy 2 channel to really shine but based on what i heard just wasnt wowed. Another friend has one right now he's borrowing and is saying similar things as well. @Roasty

Roasty is the brotha, very friendly down to earth guy.

Yeah the first impression I got from DCS was that it catered to the uber wealthy. Their demos and their rooms are always done extremely well and I always respected that, but the thing that rubbed me the wrong way about the brand was that most, key word MOST of their dealers that carry the line have this snobby ish attitude from my own experiences.

When people are shopping in this price tier of gear, the very least you can do as a dealer is treat people with basic level respect and not give off "I know better than you" or "I only cater to the wealthy" vibes.

It also gave me the quick lesson that as a brand, dealers representing your brand play a pretty significant role.

 

[chesebert]

I can't say I just think it's extremely overpriced and I didn't even get to hear it with the clock or upsampler. I'm sure with those 2 it's way better but the price is ridiculous for all 3 when the dac alone is $48500. I obviously didn't pay full price I got around 25% discount but I'm sure the mpd8 smokes it based on friends that have heard both. The vivaldi apex did everything good but nothing amazing for me. Could also of been bad synergy with my wa33 elite and red october and needs a crazy 2 channel to really shine but based on what i heard just wasnt wowed. Another friend has one right now he's borrowing and is saying similar things as well. @Roasty

That’s fair. If I am not wowed and emotionally moved by the $90k stack after 4 hours it’s probably time to move on from the brand.

I don’t think the amp or the speakers held the stack back. Amp used was Ayre mono. I also have Ayre but stereo amp and they can absolutely wow you and draw you into the music. The speakers were Wilson Alexandria and I have heard those with different front end before and they were very impressive and I was certainly emotionally involved listening to that rig iirc.

 

[DJJEZ]

That’s fair. If I am not wowed and emotionally moved by the $90k stack after 4 hours it’s probably time to move on from the brand.

Agree

 

[RobertSM]

I felt the same way with Rossini apex & clock. Which is one level below. Technical but not emotional. But was very nice in its own way.

 

[DJJEZ]

I felt the same way with Rossini apex & clock. Which is one level below. Technical but not emotional. But was very nice in its own way.

When your paying this type of money it has to move you and make you feel otherwise what's the point

 

[IanB52]

I really hate to keep dogging on one brand, but I autditioned a Rossini+Clock (pre-Apex) into a high end D'Agostino Momentum preamp, and another D'Agostino stereo amp, and into $110k Wilson Alexx speakers, with Transparent Reference XL cabling in a treated room, and was not impressed. This room was probably well into the 200k range. I mean the imaging, left-right for panning sounds was very good, and overall control. But I was not inspired at all...

But I went ahead and bought a Bartok, and had it sold within 3 months at substantial loss.

I like my EMM Labs DA2 (and assume I'd like the MPD-8 as well), enjoyed an MSB Discrete on loan in my system, and loved an older Lampizator I heard at someone's house a few years back. If I can ever afford (or need) another DAC it would be one of these brands. I would take any over DCS. Even less high end like PS Audio and Mytek!

But, if you really like the Chord kind of digital sound, but wished it was both more refined and bigger scaling, but less energetic, and less dynamic, you might like it.

 

[chesebert]

I have been moved by these dac brands at one time or another:
Emm Labs
Playback Designs
Linn
Lampizator
Aries Cerat

 

[skids929]

I really hate to keep dogging on one brand, but I autditioned a Rossini+Clock (pre-Apex) into a high end D'Agostino Momentum preamp, and another D'Agostino stereo amp, and into $110k Wilson Alexx speakers, with Transparent Reference XL cabling in a treated room, and was not impressed. This room was probably well into the 200k range. I mean the imaging, left-right for panning sounds was very good, and overall control. But I was not inspired at all...

Generally speaking this can be said of alot of the Ultra hifi sound...I heard a $400k CH Precision set up and thought it was horrible..But then heard a $350k Audio Note system and it was sublime...In my experience (over 25+ years in this hobby) alot of the time the really high end gear just means more soundstage, dynamics and detail or resolution, not necessarily musicality..Musicality is what I am after and there are only a handful of brands that do it well.

Personally even if I had the means I would never buy DCS, CH, Wadax or even Aries Cerat..I recently had the Helene in my system and thought very little of it..Hugs soundstage and sounded hollow in the middle octaves.

 

[chesebert]

Generally speaking this can be said of alot of the Ultra hifi sound...I heard a $400k CH Precision set up and thought it was horrible..But then heard a $350k Audio Note system and it was sublime...In my experience (over 25+ years in this hobby) alot of the time the really high end gear just means more soundstage, dynamics and detail or resolution, not necessarily musicality..Musicality is what I am after and there are only a handful of brands that do it well.

Personally even if I had the means I would never buy DCS, CH, Wadax or even Aries Cerat..I recently had the Helene in my system and thought very little of it..Hugs soundstage and sounded hollow in the middle octaves.

Which dacs do you use now?

 

[IanB52]

Generally speaking this can be said of alot of the Ultra hifi sound...I heard a $400k CH Precision set up and thought it was horrible..But then heard a $350k Audio Note system and it was sublime...In my experience (over 25+ years in this hobby) alot of the time the really high end gear just means more soundstage, dynamics and detail or resolution, not necessarily musicality..Musicality is what I am after and there are only a handful of brands that do it well.

Personally even if I had the means I would never buy DCS, CH, Wadax or even Aries Cerat..I recently had the Helene in my system and thought very little of it..Hugs soundstage and sounded hollow in the middle octaves.

This always surprises me, originally coming from working in analog multitrack recording studios. I never thought we needed super hifi digital, as much as DACs (and ADCs) that sounded like the analog source, whether tape or microphone. I figured that would always be the goal.

 

[skids929]

Which dacs do you use now?

Audio Note and I might be adding a Bricasti M21.

 

[Spawn300Z]

I’m still waiting to find out more about the Grimm Audio MU2. Great reviews but don’t look like there are many in the wild.

 

[IanB52]

Audio Note and I might be adding a Bricasti M21.

I remember a video where the guy from Audio Note says their DAC measures like a "bag of nails" but sounds awesome for music. I respect that.