Planars: Ok, I finally get it.

[stimuz]

Planar bass is more sub-bass though. HD 650 has more midbass kick than most planars I've heard, at the cost of absolutely no subbass so its very genre dependent.

 

[WildStyle-R11]

Planar bass is more sub-bass though. HD 650 has more midbass kick than most planars I've heard, at the cost of absolutely no subbass so its very genre dependent.

See this is why I stick with X2's It has this very satisfying rumble. VS something like the LCD 2C, technically superior headphone. BUT Once you get to a certain point in a song you know the kind that makes you want to go "UGH!" For the bass. And it just ends up being soo good that it just does not involve you emotionally. I'm just being dramatic, but that is how I sometimes feel. I don't want to feel every texture of the bass, like planars always tend to make it sound. I feel like I can lick the bass with planars. So my personal preference is dirty rumble of X2, simple, easy to understand.

 

[The Third]

What was really odd is that I found the sound texturing really attributed to the pads. When I swapped to ZMF Auteur pads, there became more present texturing (not in a great way), but the stock pads seems more proper sounding, and it did provide the perception of more detail without the separation, and it's because of the silky like textural characteristics if you can understand what I mean. I was taken back by how the pads can change the sound that much, but it was obvious the sound was not open, and enclosed like, but the decay characteristics happens to die in a way people would perceive it to have 'sound stage,' although not wide. If the sound was airy it will attack in decay in a different manner and will have a holographic effect.

But, pads changing sounds is nothing new in the headphone world, especially with Planars. Classic Hifmans didn't come with proper pads I tell you that.

Look at the measurements here. Sometimes Oratory stuff are good referenced ones, but there are times he has not proper measurements. Just check out how the pads changes the response. I haven't played around enough with the pads.

https://www.reddit.com/r/oratory1990/wiki/index/list_of_presets

All interesting stuff. Pads do change plenty of characteristics. I totally agree that texture is one of those changes. The Hifiman velour pads on the HE-400 just really don't work out because of that, they become too dry and even more peaky. Then there is the issue with the stock pleather pads their material becoming thinner as you wear them over time, which changes the positioning of your ears more towards the driver which changes the sound. Any recommendations for padding out my HE-400, or pads I can use for the HE-500 down the line?

 

[The Third]

There are some great mods for it:

reversible: back screen off, new pads (Mr Speakers Ether Flow Open), despite the nattering, the stock cables are rotten, any OFC copper cord of decent construction will be better, dynamat on the rear around the outer lip.

reversible with effort: fuzzor mod

Main 500 thread has a pile of info on all that.

Wait so these are mod recommendations for the HE-500 or the Verum 1? I already own a toxic cables for the HE-400 namely the Hybrid OCC cryo SPC/copper one which sounded a tad bit more articulate in the highs somehow, but I never had a problem with the stock HE-400 canare cables. Also I performed the grill removal mod on the HE-400 and while they sounded more open I think it got rid too much of the genesis of the sound, like it's bass impact and texture or it's engagement. I just read upon the Fuzzor mod, and it seems quite interesting to do on one of my HE-400. Lastly, are these the pads you recommend for the HE-500? : https://www.widescreenaudio.be/product/mr-speakers-ether-flow-angled-ear-pads/

Many thanks, cheers.

 

[bagwell359]

Wait so these are mod recommendations for the HE-500 or the Verum 1? I already own a toxic cables for the HE-400 namely the Hybrid OCC cryo SPC/copper one which sounded a tad bit more articulate in the highs somehow, but I never had a problem with the stock HE-400 canare cables. Also I performed the grill removal mod on the HE-400 and while they sounded more open I think it got rid too much of the genesis of the sound, like it's bass impact and texture or it's engagement. I just read upon the Fuzzor mod, and it seems quite interesting to do on one of my HE-400. Lastly, are these the pads you recommend for the HE-500? : https://www.widescreenaudio.be/product/mr-speakers-ether-flow-angled-ear-pads/

Many thanks, cheers.

Oops, sorry - HE-500. I've build Canare cables, they are fine. The HE-500 comes with a thin microphonic silver plate number that's got to be the worst cable on any headphone that retailed over $99 - just ghastly. I replaced it with an old audiophile cable (Black Dragon original) I got in a deal for the 5LE. Bass impact got better, reached lower down, the 500 has a notable very long cymbal decay, that got muted.

I have owned these round form HFM cans: HE-500, HE-400i, MD-4XX, HE-5LE, HE-5se, and for whatever reason it made the best effect on the 500 - in particular at the same time I changed pads.

fuzzor mod doesn't work on the 400. Because of the way they are built it works on the 500 and the 6. There is far more metal surface area facing the ear where its needed. That's only on the two sided HFM's and there is less even on the 5LE than the 6 and 500.

Yes, that's the pads. Nasty expensive over there. They test out as the flattest, and they also seem to have the widest headstage of any of the 7-8 pads I've tested by a score.

The back screen does decrease bass a bit, but there is a whole slew of crusty reverb stuff which at first seems like a nice back wall reverb in a good listening room, but eventually you realize its not only out of time sync, but that what it also does is decrease from the purity of the initial part of the sound. I use a very sparse metal mesh to protect the drivers it has no audible effect. In the main 500 thread I put in pics twice about 12 and 16 months ago.

Iechyd da

 

[ThanatosVI]

All interesting stuff. Pads do change plenty of characteristics. I totally agree that texture is one of those changes. The Hifiman velour pads on the HE-400 just really don't work out because of that, they become too dry and even more peaky. Then there is the issue with the stock pleather pads their material becoming thinner as you wear them over time, which changes the positioning of your ears more towards the driver which changes the sound. Any recommendations for padding out my HE-400, or pads I can use for the HE-500 down the line?

I personally really like the hifiman focus pads which were released with the 400s I believe.

They work great on the 400.
When you talk about peaky, do you really mean the original 400 and not the 400i?

 

[The Third]

I personally really like the hifiman focus pads which were released with the 400s I believe.

They work great on the 400.
When you talk about peaky, do you really mean the original 400 and not the 400i?

I meant the original HE-400, those have razor blades built in to them if you are not careful with the source, but they shine on some tracks and movies and games which make them special.

 

[340519]

Personally the one difference that I have noticed with every planar I have heard (Which isn't many) is this texture to the sound, no dynamic headphone I know of can recreate this. Granted I haven't heard many headphones, but that usually is the first thing that stands out to me when it comes to planar headphones.

Yes, the bass textures with the LCD 4 is outstanding. There is bass texture in tracks that I had never heard before these cans. It has been a revelatory experience with these planars.

 

[340519]

In speakers you don't see them (AMT) doing bass work. ribbons likewise are pretty much mid and highs too, with the Apogee exception (needed a lot of space).

Planars which I like do tend to have the most problem with ringing. The HE-6 and HE-500 we both know have it. It just goes to show that the first impulse in a note if its reproduced well is what the ear really locks on. With the 6 and 500 you also get the back wave. In a room with well placed Magnepans that really helps with "coupling". Try cupping your 500 or 6 sometime - ouch - it would be murder coming up with a closed version that didn't make it sound like a blizzard of early reflections - a pernicious issue with speakers/rooms where there are reflective objects close to the speakers/listener - it helps blur the first wave.

The golden ear reference speakers I use have folded ribbon tweeters and sound fantastic, but bass is still produced by traditional powered subs in the cabinets.

 

[Bassic Needs]

I couldnt live without planar Bass.
So there is no other option for me.

Which headphones were you thinking of when you made this comment? I haven't heard a planar yet but I've got a HE4XX ordered but I'm already concerned based on frequency response charts I may want to find a planar with more bass.

 

[ThanatosVI]

Which headphones were you thinking of when you made this comment? I haven't heard a planar yet but I've got a HE4XX ordered but I'm already concerned based on frequency response charts I may want to find a planar with more bass.

In particular the hifiman Arya, Edition Xv2 and LCD-2C.
Those are my personal top cans.
I also still own the original He400.

However this trait counts for the majority of planar magnetics.

They don't have Boosted Bass, but it goes flat down, all the way to 20 Hz which dynamics can't.
Same goes for the 4XX, so they might lack in quantity for your taste at first.

Usually they also respond excellent to EQ, meaning a planar paired with a Schiit Loki slays 90% of other headphones in the Bass Department.

 

[Bassic Needs]

In particular the hifiman Arya, Edition Xv2 and LCD-2C.
Those are my personal top cans.
I also still own the original
Same goes for the 4XX, so they might black in quantity for your taste at first.

Usually they also respond excellent to EQ, meaning a planar paired with a Schiit Loki slays 90% of other headphones in the Bass Department.

The LCD-2C are within my budget - would there be any point to owning the 4XX if I can go straight to the LCD-2C?

I'm still learning - what does the phrase "black in quantity" mean?

 

[ThanatosVI]

The LCD-2C are within my budget - would there be any point to owning the 4XX if I can go straight to the LCD-2C?

I'm still learning - what does the phrase "black in quantity" mean?

Imo, there would be no point in owning the 4XX if you can afford the LCD-2C. They are a Killer in their price range and an significant improvement over the 4XX.

That was a typo and meant "lack of quantity"
Auto correction...

 

[xRaptorxPunisher]

True, but still in 2020 even the LCD-X slaughters the Utopia when it comes to bass performance only. This is due to the physical limitations of dynamic and planar drivers. Yes, the Utopia is a better headphone than the LCD-X in many regards, but the 106mm transducer of the X will always give much better bass than the 40mm miracle beryllium drivers of the Focal flagship.

You can also argue that the larger sized planars can't produce a lot of the lingering decay that lives in the mid bass area. I found a lot of headphones like the Aeolus, HD650, even the HD800, the lingering decay that some of the tracks have are not present in the larger planars due to them having much quick "stop" ability.

That said I do prefer the way a large Audeze delivers those low notes that a big planar can only deliver in a clean, decisive fashion so to speak so I kind of get what you're saying, I can see the argument from both sides.

 

[Bassic Needs]

Usually they also respond excellent to EQ, meaning a planar paired with a Schiit Loki slays 90% of other headphones in the Bass Department.

Do you find yourself using the Loki on the upper tier planars you cited, or just the lower tier stuff like the 4XX?

Can the Loki reduce as well as boost?