PIMETA power supply question
Feb 24, 2005 at 8:22 PM Post #16 of 23
Quote:

Originally Posted by Edwood
So the velleman kit K1823 would be wired inline between the DC input jack and the power input on the Amp board?

-Ed



yes... that's the way i thought it. be careful to use an isolated dc-jack in metal cases. most likely it would be enough to fix the (isolated!) lm317 to the (metal) case to get a sufficient cooling (depending on opamps, the amount of difference between input- and output-voltage and the type of your case)
 
Feb 24, 2005 at 9:58 PM Post #17 of 23
Quote:

What's an appropriate voltage


Answered in full detail here: http://tangentsoft.net/audio/opamp-wv.html

I even use the AD843 in one of the examples.

Quote:

how much current does one need?


It's easy enough to add up the quiescent current of the major parts in your amp. In a PIMETA, you can probably get within 10% by adding the IC quiescents (don't forget to account for changes when using R11 on the buffers, or when stacking!). The final 10% is in any class A biasing, LED current, etc.

Once you know the Iq of your amp, multiply that by 1.2 to get the bare minimum supply current. (You'd multiply by a higher value if supply current went up much in operation, but it won't, with a PIMETA, unless you're using really inefficient phones.) I think you'll find that you can't buy a supply with current that low, so in fact the point is moot, for a PIMETA.

Quote:

Is 22 awg wire enough for the like, 12watts at most a PIMETA might use?


First, you're off by about an order of magnitude on the wattage.

And as for wire rating, I seem to recall that 22 gauge is good for up to about 1A. Do a Google search...there are lots of tables for current vs. wire gauge out there. You don't want to get anywhere near the limits, though, because the limits are effectively telling you where the resistance of the wire is causing significant voltage drops. In a headphone amp, that means ripple, which means you're losing power supply performance. I point this out because some have tried using 30 gauge wire and such with heapdhone amps. Yeah, it may technically work, but it isn't a good idea.

Quote:

Eh, not sure I want to mess around with yet another circuit.


The circuit BrokenEnglish mentioned really isn't that hard to construct, but even so it's overkill. All you absolutely have to have is a bare 78xx series regulator and an unregulated wall wart. You could even save yourself the protoboard cost by air-wiring the regulator to the inside of the DC input jack. Total cost, probably $6.

You aren't going to get "cheap AND good" without some effort, Emon.

Quote:

By the time you tack on a transformer, IEC, and a few other parts the cost [of a Velleman K1823] is about the same as the Elpac.


Yes, but the performance level is higher.

Quote:

So the velleman kit K1823 would be wired inline between the DC input jack and the power input on the Amp board?


You could use it that way by bypassing the bridge. (Even that isn't strictly necessary, but the bridge isn't doing you any good in this situation.) But if simple is your thing, I still recommend the unregulated wall wart plus 78xx route.
 
Feb 24, 2005 at 10:59 PM Post #18 of 23
Quote:

Originally Posted by tangent
All you absolutely have to have is a bare 78xx series regulator and an unregulated wall wart. You could even save yourself the protoboard cost by air-wiring the regulator to the inside of the DC input jack. Total cost, probably $6.

You aren't going to get "cheap AND good" without some effort, Emon.



Ooo. Oooo. Would make a great new addition to the Tutorials.
wink.gif


-Ed
 
Feb 24, 2005 at 11:12 PM Post #20 of 23
Quote:

Would make a great new addition to the Tutorials.


Hm, not sure it's worth the effort. I'll think about it.

Quote:

would using a regulated wallwart with a 78xx series regulator wired to the DC jack be redundant or beneficial?


Redundant, and possibly harmful. If better regulation is the goal, replacing the regulator with a better one is a smarter plan.
 
Feb 24, 2005 at 11:17 PM Post #21 of 23
Quote:

Originally Posted by Edwood
OH, and would using a regulated wallwart with a 78xx series regulator wired to the DC jack be redundant or beneficial?

-Ed



due to a certain voltage drop while regulating the 78xx requires a voltage on its input that is ~1,5v higher than the output. so... i think it is no good idea.

furthermore even some unregulated dc-supplies don't reach their spec'ed values: one of my unreg. 24v psus reads ~22v without load... i'd have to step down and use a 7818 to get regulated 18v...
 
Feb 25, 2005 at 10:37 PM Post #23 of 23
Quote:

Originally Posted by Emon
Oops, I used the wattage from the wall transformer. I meant what the guage I would need to equal the wall transformer you recommended.


Are you trying to use the smallest wire possible? Why? 22 ga. should suffice. Go too small and it's not just an issue of current capability but mechanical fortitude while fiddling with the amp before it's cased up.

Quote:

I'm gonna see if I can rework where I'm ordering from and try to get this cost down a little bit. I must have messed up somewhere, because yesterday I had the same parts and it didn't add up this high.


Be less picky on parts. You should be able to use only 2 or 3 vendors at most instead of 4. Shipping isn't THAT bad an overhead though, but Newark is worse than Digikey or Mouser, et al.

You're ordering all these parts anyway, and going to all the trouble of building your own amp, so it really isn't that much trouble to just buy an LM317, 3 caps and a few extra resistors to knock out a power source. Even a crude low-component-count linear will be FAR better than a huge computer power supply. Much is claimed about "good" power supplies but untimately you might not hear a difference between a super-deluxe $30 supply and what you can build in 10 minutes with $3 worth of parts plus some spare transformer. 24V is only a target, if you had a spare 15V or 12V 500mA wall-wart lying around you can figure a peak of around 17V out of it, dropped down to 15.5V after the linear regulator, maybe a couple volts less under load. 13.5V IS enough for decent sound from a Pimeta... going up to 24V is one of those "last 1%" kind of improvements. YOu might need higher voltage for maximum volume, but do you want to go deaf that badly?
 

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