[Bark Snarly]

How are your guys earpads holding up after all this time now?

Mine seem to be getting just a little bit warped although I can't really tell if it's permanent or not considering how much time the pm-3's are spending on my head...

 

[robm321]

Mine are holding up pretty good. I think the front part is getting more of a bend, so over time they might change, but that might be a good thing? 

 

[money4me247]

Hey, let's keep the discussion on topic and leave off the trash talking of people behind their backs.  Let's have a classy discussion for a classy headphone.  Thanks!

+1. agreed. or if you have questions for a specific member, at least "@" them so they can respond.

 

[413092]

  Hi BrianJohnes,
 
Check out Tyll's frequency response curves and compare HD 25 vs. PM-3. You will immediately see, that the HD 25 shows kind of a "V-curve" with a drop of up to 10 dB in the 400...500 Hz region. Compared to curve of the PM-3 (that shows an almost flat response up to 1'000 Hz), I would say that your ears got used to the "V response" of the HD 25 over time. It's all subjective when it comes to personal tastes. Tyll's and Hans030390 measurements are quite objective measures imho, and these correlate quite good to my "reference HD 800" quality that I am "attuned" to. Hope this helps.

 
I have to say, I always thought that burn-in was at the most, responsible for fairly nuanced changes in performance. After running pink noise through the PM-3s two nights in a row & blasting Shellac during my waking hours - I'm convinced they sound a lot more balanced. I'm still EQ'ing to get it where I like it but my curve is a lot closer to flat now.
 
Starting to really enjoy them - I'm rifling through my collection, eager to hear what the next track will sound like...
 
I imagine I'll be a full blown believer in a week.

 

[PerfectHiFi]

I have to say, I always thought that burn-in was at the most, responsible for fairly nuanced changes in performance. After running pink noise through the PM-3s two nights in a row & blasting Shellac during my waking hours - I'm convinced they sound a lot more balanced. I'm still EQ'ing to get it where I like it but my curve is a lot closer to flat now.

Starting to really enjoy them - I'm rifling through my collection, eager to hear what the next track will sound like...

I imagine I'll be a full blown believer in a week.

Thanks for your reply! Your experience sounds "mystic" for me. It would be very interesting to see from Tyll's or Hans030390 measurements, if these would show a difference in frequency response after several hours of "burn-in". Anyway, good to hear that you like and enjoy these cans more every day. I wouldn't be surprised when you start disliking your pair of HD 25 some day. Personally, I love my combination HA-1 + HD800 so much that I have a problem enjoying my Solo 2 when listening "on the road". I am going to buy a pair of PM-3 in a month or so, need to safe some bucks now... Can't wait to listen Porcupine Tree and Lacuna Coil on the PM-3! Maybe Pfillion and/or Hans030390 has experienced these .... . Enjoy and have fun!

 

[hans030390]

I took some measurements after several hours of listening just to peek and then again, this time for the set of measurements I posted, after a few days of burning in, and there was no real difference. I did not really hear changes subjectively from start to finish. Tyll has done experiments for other headphones on this a long while back.

 

[PerfectHiFi]

I took some measurements after several hours of listening just to peek and then again, this time for the set of measurements I posted, after a few days of burning in, and there was no real difference. I did not really hear changes subjectively from start to finish. Tyll has done experiments for other headphones on this a long while back.

...so, would you agree to my statement that "burn-in" is a "brain-matter" and has nothing to do with technical changes on specifications on the "device under test"? I mean, "burn-in" for a few hours or days, I am not talking about "aging" over years.

 

[YtseJamer]

Can't wait to listen Porcupine Tree and Lacuna Coil on the PM-3! Maybe Pfillion and/or Hans030390 has experienced these .... . Enjoy and have fun!

 
Unfortunately, I have still not received my PM-3's 

  (Next week probably)

 

[money4me247]

...so, would you agree to my statement that "burn-in" is a "brain-matter" and has nothing to do with technical changes on specifications on the "device under test"? I mean, "burn-in" for a few hours or days, I am not talking about "aging" over years.

ya usually that sort of thing happens for a lot of audio reated things that cant even burn in. its just our brain getting used to the new sound sig

 

[miceblue]

The earpads breaking in could make more of a difference than driver burn-in. The AKG K 701 in particular has really stiff earpads that don't conform to a normal human's head out of the box for example (because the pads are friggin gigantic), so for all of those impressions where some ridiculous number of hours of burn in is suggested (I've read all the way up to 500 hours), all that time likely allowed the earpads to mold to their head shape. People often state that the treble and the bass tighten up; bass is usually a function of how well the earpads seal, and the treble is dependent on the driver's position relative to your ear, which might change as the pads change.

The PM-3 on the other hand has extremely plush earpads that are much more pliable, so I don't really think pad break-in is a thing for it. Indeed, I haven't heard my PM-3 change at all over the last month-ish, and nor did I experience it during the beta testing phase.

 

[audiobot]

hey miceblue, can you briefly compare the Rockets to the PM-3? I have the Rockets and the PM-3 is on it's way. Just wondering how the two compare since I am hoping to just keep one and not the other. Do the Rockets hiss off use with the HA-2? Do the Rockets scale significantly when paired with the HA-2? My dilemma is that in-ear monitors are starting to become cumbersome for me. Would prefer a traditional around the ear option, especially if the bass is better for it. Any thoughts would be helpful. Thanks in advance.

 

[PerfectHiFi]

Unfortunately, I have still not received my PM-3's    (Next week probably)

Thanks Pfillion, can't wait to read your impressions! Please accept my personal compliments, you have the greatest Avatar I found so far, from Steve Wilson, the "god" of creative music. Greatest Artist since Pink Floyd!

 

[YtseJamer]

Thanks Pfillion, can't wait to read your impressions! Please accept my personal compliments, you have the greatest Avatar I found so far, from Steve Wilson, the "god" of creative music. Greatest Artist since Pink Floyd!

 
Yes I agree with you, greatest artist since Pink Floyd 

 

[miceblue]

hey miceblue, can you briefly compare the Rockets to the PM-3? I have the Rockets and the PM-3 is on it's way. Just wondering how the two compare since I am hoping to just keep one and not the other. Do the Rockets hiss off use with the HA-2? Do the Rockets scale significantly when paired with the HA-2? My dilemma is that in-ear monitors are starting to become cumbersome for me. Would prefer a traditional around the ear option, especially if the bass is better for it. Any thoughts would be helpful. Thanks in advance.

Hi there. I've only heard the Rockets as part of a touring unit, so my comparisons aren't totally accurate. I found the Rockets to have a 6 kHz boost in its frequency response though, which made the upper-midrange sound bright and metallic-sounding. Supposedly having a different tip can fix this, but I was evaluating the Rockets in their stock form. For an in-ear earphone, I found the Rockets to have a pretty large overall soundstage, and that surprised me.

The PM-3 to me has a more natural-sounding timbre overall, it's still a bit bright, but nothing out of my range for it to sound too unpleasant. The soundstage is much more congested, but the imaging is better than the Rockets. The bass of the PM-3 is also cleaner-sounding to me and doesn't creep into the midrange as much.

In terms of the HA-2, I can't say how the Rockets will perform. For my ears, and my experience with the in-ear earphones I have at hand, I'm guessing that yes the Rockets will pick up the hiss of the HA-2. Your mileage may vary for that though since not everyone notices it.

 

[jagwap]

I do not completely agree. I have witnessed burn in multiple times. Yes the mental burn in exists, but so does physical burn in. Just because a set of frequency sweeps doesn't show anything doesn't mean other characteristics do not alter. Transient response and ringing can be affected by the flexible points being worn in.

I have regularly heard early production units not sound as good as the r&d reference unit fresh off the line. Run them in for a while, and they can be heard to align after some time.

Transducers are physical and have moving parts. Of course their material behaviour changes as it flexes hundreds of times a second for days.

Phyisical and mental burn in exists. Not many customers get the chance to prove it as they rarely buy two units to hear how one changes as it gets played while one stays in the box.