Official Unofficial 8XX Discussion Thread - UPDATE SENNHEISER HAS BEEN SOLD!!! GT(heck)IH
Oct 30, 2021 at 11:32 PM Post #811 of 1,479
I doubt it'll sell for anything less than $900
They are just sold at $740 with free shipping on ebay.

Now it is very clear, for HD8XX, the real market value for HD8XX is $800 brand new unopened box. For open-box like new HD8XX, the value is around $700. Anyone who bought 8xx will get instant loss of $400 plus tax.
 
Oct 31, 2021 at 1:02 AM Post #812 of 1,479
They are just sold at $740 with free shipping on ebay.

Now it is very clear, for HD8XX, the real market value for HD8XX is $800 brand new unopened box. For open-box like new HD8XX, the value is around $700. Anyone who bought 8xx will get instant loss of $400 plus tax.
Ngl I should have bid 😅

For $750 it’s not a bad headphone at all
 
Nov 1, 2021 at 1:49 AM Post #815 of 1,479
Isn't Massdrop known for having much worse QC?
Did they have problems before or are you talking about the Focal Elex? I really don’t think they have QC issues.
 
Nov 2, 2021 at 2:25 PM Post #816 of 1,479
The other possibility could be that because listening impressions can be very easily influenced by preemptive bias, many people went into their first time listening to them expecting to hear the "awful" mid range dip and weird frequency response. Bias can be a very powerful thing in this hobby. People will swear up and down that they can hear huge improvements moving to better source gear, but time and again in blind listening tests it's shown that people can't really tell the difference beyond sources past a certain baseline bar of "good enough".

Perhaps the two initial reviews from Crin and DMS poisoned the well so to speak, so people are hearing what they are expecting to hear, where you went into your first listen "blind" so to speak and have come away impressed and actually enjoying them.

Thats why you really have to listen to a headphone yourself and try to remain as open minded as you can. Easier said than done unfortunately. People will instead look at a fr graph and decide a headphone is good or sucks before even listening to it.
Also, people have declared they made purchase decisions based off the recording "demos." Inherently flawed, listening to a real HD 8xx is significantly different from listening to an HD 8xx that has been distorted by the "ears" on a microphone head (remember, this will impart a change to the sound), AD conversion, YouTube compression, whatever DAC you use, whatever Amp you use, whatever headphone or speaker you use, the FR altering effects of your own ears (on top of the measurement microphone's "ears"), etc etc. It's a really deep rabbit hole of how many things are distorted in a recording demo.

Listening to my HD 8XX, with HDV 820, stock cable and an inexpensive Belkin Gold USB cable to my Mac Mini, playing Mr Blue Sky in Apple Music, I think this track is actually nice on the headphone, with nice bass and electric guitar strings and not too much shouty mids (Mr Blue Sky is a well mastered song, but the percussive sting of the track is somewhat in your face).

Listening to one of those YouTube demos, Mr Blue Sky sounds much more tinny and fatiguing than just listening to the HD 8XX straight through Apple Music Lossless, or even just AAC. What stands out the most are that the highs are much more emphasized, so the clapping and piano dominate in the YouTube video, the drums are more distorted, the soundstage is smaller... the YouTube demo honestly sounds like a smartphone speaker played from inside a cardboard box. And yet, people make purchase decisions after listening to these demos for 30 seconds. Some people claim to be using these recordings purely for comparison between the HD 800S and HD 8XX recordings... here, differences would be exaggerated due to double-dipping on how the outer ear reflections and resonances affect certain frequencies to a greater extent and others to a lesser extent.

Just to drop another HD 8XX impression, "Pressure" by Muse stood out to me with the reverberant kick drum that begins around 29 seconds in having a really nice, tight texture that I can feel tickling the hairs just inside my ear canal, and "Kiss Me More" (and other Doja Cat tracks) vocals are easier on the ears on the HD 8XX than my HD 800. I still wouldn't reach for the HD 8XX when I want big bass drops... I would actually reach for a lower end headphone with looser bass for that. I will say, taking a DAC entirely out of the equation and listening to my HD 800 with vinyl has taken a certain glare off, without blunting the punch and piercing quality needed in some songs, but lately the HD 8XX has been my go-to all day streaming companion while working from home.

I went to an audio shop yesterday to get some comparison impressions with the hd800s before the 8xx return window closes.

And I think it convinced me to keep the 8xx.

1. Yes 800s is much more clear and realistic sounding. But it gets very loud in the upper mids. Really uncomfortable for even the short session I had with it. As you may know, the 8xx does not have that issue, and as a result I'm able to crank the volume more on the 8xx without causing pain.

2. I felt like the recording conditions and skill levels of the engineers are much more apparent on the 800s. Which is really cool and a great resource for engineers but not so great for enjoyment. The 8xx smooths out the harshness while keeping the detail. Though tonality is off, and a bit unnatural, I'd still prefer the 8xx for a nice listening session, and 800s for audio work. (I did try some audio mixing on the 8xx and the results, as expected, were not good.)

3. Classical music is absolutely perfect on the 800s. If that's what you're into, I can't recommend the 800s enough. But I don't listen to much classical, so not really a factor for me.

4. Treble is also more tiring on the 800s. It sounds amazing too, but can get really abrasive.

5. If I'm planning on listening to music, I want to forget the headphone is even there. And the 800s doesn't let you forget for very long. One track will sound perfect, like its performed right in the room with you, and then another track will have you reaching for that skip button or eq dial. The 8xx doesn't have that issue. Everything kinda sounds good and detailed and pleasant. And the frequency flaws of the 8xx (such as the lower mid swell) er on the side of incorrect but not painful.

In summation:
The 800s is more impressive. And as an audio tool, more useful.
The 8xx is a better rounded headphone, more enjoyable more of the time.

There is a trade off either way. Neither is perfect. I think the 8xx is a great headphone, especially at the price. And I think I'll be happier with the 8xx over the 800s in the long run.
Hear Hear! While tuned differently, the HD 800(S) vs HD 8XX compliment each other in a similar way as the HD 600 and HD 650 compliment each other... the HD 8XX and HD 650 are high performing but easier to listen to long-term than their more studio-tool focused siblings.

I don't know if I shared it here, but I think these songs fit the HD 8XX well, showcasing the strengths and highlighting the difference to the HD 800S:
 
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Nov 2, 2021 at 4:53 PM Post #817 of 1,479
Or maybe...no one knows who to believe...the reviewers that generally are just giving their singular opinion on something they didn't buy....the youtuber who helped tune them and gushes over everything that comes out like they are a shill for every brand because they need free stuff for content...the forum guy who is sponsored by Sennheiser and for the most part only seem to participate in Sennheiser threads :eyes:...general people who bought them but there is no way of knowing if they are or aren't critical listeners...owners who maybe want to justify their purchases...the list goes on.

Soooo...Maybe people...like me....just wanted to avoid all those questions and just get the HD800s because it's a known quality and it was strangely on sale through all of this for almost the same price. It's delightful by the way. OR...maybe people also didn't like being sold something only to find that the company changed the tuning right before shipping. Let's be real...a Drop page with the sales number removed = there are problems. They should have left it alone.
 
Nov 2, 2021 at 7:00 PM Post #818 of 1,479
forum guy who is sponsored by Sennheiser and for the most part only seem to participate in Sennheiser threads :eyes:

I’m glad you are enjoying your HD 800S, nothing wrong with that.

I consult for Sennheiser as a Community Manager. I try to not comment opinions on other companies products, and anyway it’s against Head-Fi policy to do so here. I do like to look at and try out the other products in the field, and I tend to take a stance of “a tide raises all ships.”
 
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Nov 2, 2021 at 7:17 PM Post #819 of 1,479
Hi Sense,
Yes, I don’t participate in other brand’s threads to give impressions, because A.) it is a conflict of interest or at least frowned on to “review” and give subjective impressions of a competitor’s product (I don’t want to do that… I’m more of a “tide raises all ships” kind of guy), and B.) it is against Head-Fi’s policies to do so. I keep opinions out of other brand’s threads on Drop too, though I like to see what’s going on in the industry.

In general, it can sometimes be difficult to guess what a headphone’s sound signature and tuning is like from a manufacturer’s marketing materials. I’ve even joked about it in the past… what are mellifluous mids anyway? So, as a community manager for Sennheiser (that’s why I have the sponsor tags), I took it upon myself to try to describe it a bit more in detail in the video I posted on YouTube and in this thread, with listening notes and songs I’ve listened to with it. I personally make no claims in having a hand in tuning this 😅

I am allowed to do so, though I think it’s only valuable if I share my honest impressions. I don’t want someone to buy a headphone that isn’t suited to their tastes. I do think it’s proper to keep in mind I am coming from the perspective of a consultant for Sennheiser.

I’m glad you are enjoying your HD 800S, nothing wrong with that.
I think Head-Fi needs to update their labels…you should be labeled as “Sennheiser Community Manager”. Honestly…I thought you were just a reviewer who really liked Sennheiser and only Sennheiser.

Anyway…I stand by my point: It became way too hard to figure out if they were good or not and felt like a risk. In the end I think Sennheiser still got the sales (HD800s) Drop just dropped the ball (lol I had to) on pretty much everything related to to HD8XX…especially their hyperbolic marketing claims.
 
Nov 2, 2021 at 7:25 PM Post #820 of 1,479
I used to be a reviewer before consulting for Sennheiser, and I do try to be transparent about being community manager. I am marked “Sponsor” and I have the Sennheiser footer at the bottom of all my posts, but perhaps I can add a mention in my signature. Can’t do that on Drop, unfortunately.

Edit: I’m on mobile right now, I’ll edit my signature later/soon.
 
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Nov 2, 2021 at 11:56 PM Post #821 of 1,479
If 8XX is so good, how do you explain this?
1. the real market value for HD8XX is $800 brand new unopened box. For open-box like new HD8XX, the value is around $700. Anyone who bought 8xx will get instant loss of $400 plus tax.
2. The famous 'Joshua Valour' mentioned he thought 8XX should list at $600. Search '8xx review' on youtube, all you can see is, 8XX has huge problems.
 
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Nov 3, 2021 at 12:42 AM Post #822 of 1,479
If 8XX is so good, how do you explain this?
1. the real market value for HD8XX is $800 brand new unopened box. For open-box like new HD8XX, the value is around $700. Anyone who bought 8xx will get instant loss of $400 plus tax.
2. The famous 'Joshua Valour' mentioned he thought 8XX should list at $600. Search '8xx review' on youtube, all you can see is, 8XX has huge problems.
What’s there to explain? How did you value the HD8XX at $700? Was it from the recent eBay sales? The market right now is inundated with negative reviews by online reviewers from YouTube which can affect the current sales price in the second hand market. That’s not for him to explain.

I have the 800s and I listened to the 8XX recently. I actually enjoyed it. I don’t really understand all the hate. I wish I could keep it for fun listening. It’s different enough but still has the Sennheiser soundstage, precise imaging and amazing comfort. I can see it as something I can use for everyday use.
 
Nov 3, 2021 at 12:42 AM Post #823 of 1,479
If 8XX is so good, how do you explain this?
1. the real market value for HD8XX is $800 brand new unopened box. For open-box like new HD8XX, the value is around $700. Anyone who bought 8xx will get instant loss of $400 plus tax.
2. The famous 'Joshua Valour' mentioned he thought 8XX should list at $600. Search '8xx review' on youtube, all you can see is, 8XX has huge problems.
I think that’s pretty unfair…I don’t know where you’re getting $800, feels like you made that up. Also…all headphones on the second hand market lose value vs. retail price. Look at the classified here…you’ll see everything is being sold hundreds and sometimes thousands of dollars below retail. Joshua Valour is a fan of the Arya and pushes that headphone every chance he gets over the HD800 series. He’s not famous…the headphone hobby isn’t big enough to consider any of these YouTube dopes as famous.

If I sold my HD800s today I would lose $400 at least. If I sold my Aryas today I would lose $500. My friend is going to be selling his LCD-5 at a $700 loss. That’s how the second hand market works.
 
Nov 3, 2021 at 12:53 PM Post #824 of 1,479
If 8XX is so good, how do you explain this?
1. the real market value for HD8XX is $800 brand new unopened box. For open-box like new HD8XX, the value is around $700. Anyone who bought 8xx will get instant loss of $400 plus tax.
2. The famous 'Joshua Valour' mentioned he thought 8XX should list at $600. Search '8xx review' on youtube, all you can see is, 8XX has huge problems.
Basing a “market value” around a single sale is not a proper valuation at all… especially off of eBay/second hand market.

There are lots of things that sell for way cheaper or way more than their value on eBay.
 
Nov 3, 2021 at 1:00 PM Post #825 of 1,479
Basing a “market value” around a single sale is not a proper valuation at all… especially off of eBay/second hand market.

There are lots of things that sell for way cheaper or way more than their value on eBay.

There are 2 data points now:

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