[rickcr42]

Quote:

The fact remains that the side of the planet which has the most wealth is predominently Christian whereas the side which has the least is Muslim or rapidly converting to Islam.

Again , I consider "oil wealth" to be wealth also . as far as converts to Islam - pissed off people looking for an excuse to kill ?

I happen to be white but a large percentage of my good friends are black . Just worked out that way , nothing planned .
A few have become Muslim in recent years and have at the same time become angrier , more militant . Nothing violent or in any way threatening just a general angry outlook and mistrust of the gov.
If you were in the same room with us during one of our "philosophical" discussions you would think we hated each other !

Nothing could be further from the truth , we remain buds , even after SHOUTING our point of view . We throw some food on the grill (NO PORK , That WOULD get me whacked upside the head)

What bothers me then as now is the blame others first mindset .

You don't like something ?

TOO DAMN BAD ! DO SOMETHING ABOUT IT !

But that "something" should not be murder , murder as in attacking civilians on purpose .

And that is what N. Korea is about , they will if they think they can survive attack the south . And the scary part is , if losing use the nukes . They are not a rational nation . The country is starving ?

HOW ? WHY ?

The south seems to be doing OK . Plus the military looks to be fit and armed to the teeth .
Priorities man . They chose thier own path .


Saddam has a track record , and it is not pretty . He has proven to the world that using biological/chemical weapons don't mean squat . Ask the Iranians . Ask the Kurds . Ask the Shiite . Hell , ask our own GIs who still suffer side effects and who were denied by our gov for a time.

Last time we hit Saddam his troops fled like a bunch of pansies . You know why ?
Because they did not fight for a rightgeous cause . They were forced into the fray and wanted out . The "elite" Republican Guard did little fighting . They were there at the backs of the front line troops to shoot them if they fled.

Yeah . Nice folks we are dealing with here .

And since ole saddam could do **** he threw a few scuds the way of Israel , just for the FCK of it . Again . Nice folks here .

11Bravo

 

[chadbang]

Before it slips to far behind, that picture of John Goodman was a scream.

However, I am totally behind rickcr42 on his points. N Korea? Yeah, that's happy place. Just like the last perverted, failed version of a communist state. People in prison, people tortured, kidnapping Japanese civilians from beaches and keeping them under prisoners for 20+ years to teach their spies English. A year ago, one of the leader's bodyguards made it out of N Korea and broke stories of orgies, karaoke and drunken parties among the leaders fuelled by "gasp" decadent Western booze while the people starve. Oh, god, please let me come to the defense of that fine country, a classic example of ****ed up dictatorship.

I just want to say why does everyone from England love trashing the US? Yeah, we're the ****ing bad guys. Ever been to the US? Met the people who live there? I've lived an number of places and Americans - well, I really like Aussies, too - are the friendliest people in the world. We have managed to live side by side with each other - Asians, African Americans, Mexicans, Irish, Italians, Muslim and Hindus - for generations. Yeah, there have been problems (but racism I would hardly say is exclusive the the US), but I've never seen slaughters and genocide break among those "Americans" as I do in every other corner of the world. Why? Because Americans have learned to live with each other. Whether the rest of the world wants to admit it or not, "Americans" are Asians, Africans Americans, Irish... they're not the Bush family. The world love to blame Americans for being ignorant about foreign cultures, but they are equally ignorant about who "Americans" are. I'm half Chinese, my wife is a Thai and we're Americans. My best friend is an African American. My sister is married to the coolest Lebanese guy who grew up an "American". I never knew a person who harboured a single ill feeling against a Muslim - until one mad man decided to begin a holy war. And to I see that millionaire strapping himself with a bomb? Doubtful. But now American's are the monsters. It really pisses me off.

And I really think it's funny when people from Britain get their shorts bundled up about American policy abroad. I seem to sense Britain still being somewhat proud of its heyday as the "the raj", out to colonialize every peice of the world and convince the natives to be their boot polishers.

 

[gloco]

Quote:

Originally posted by Peddler The fact remains that the side of the planet which has the most wealth is predominently Christian whereas the side which has the least is Muslim or rapidly converting to Islam.

Nonsense. Look at all those oil shieks with their billions upon billions of dollars (Saddam is a rich ass mofo...his people? Dirt poor? You figure it out). If they give two bits for their countrymen they can get off their arses and start helping out the needy...wait they do already, everytime some aninal blows himself up the family gets a reward! How sweet is that?

 

[gloco]

Quote:

Originally posted by joe dick why do americans presume that when people from other countries question their leaders and leadership they are attacking americans?

Which Americans? The ones on tv? Or the average joe who works for a living? It doesn't bother me one bit when there's constructive criticism, but when you call a leader of a country a moron or an idiot it's not gonna win you any points with the American public.

 

[kelly]

Quote:

Originally posted by joe dick another possibly thought provoking thread shot down in flames. why do americans presume that when people from other countries question their leaders and leadership they are attacking americans? why this attitude of fer us or agin' us? are we not allowed as sovereign nations and sovereign people to have our own policies and agendas?

I know not all Canadians are like you. Deep down I know it to be true and yet, the type that make statements like this are quite vocal so it's easy to develop the anti-Canadian attitude I have.

"why do americans..." The only response to this is "Why do Candians..." Not all Americans do anything and your constant use of hyperbole and stereotype is the reason no one takes you seriously. You're an internet troll.

So anyway...

We'll be at war with Iraq as soon as the inspectors are out whether any American or Canadian approves or not.

I do not understand North Korea's motives. If someone could explain them to me, I'd appreciate it.

 

[ServinginEcuador]

War with N Korea - not probable, but possible. It will be much, much harder to convince the world that attacking them would be preemptive and prevent the use of WMDs.

Iraq, OTOH, is willing to use WMDs and is not the most popular place on earth. Their leader is insane, and unpredictable, thereby making him an easier sell to go to war against.

 

[rickcr42]

didn't call YOUR leader a "psyco" . Unless you happen to live in NK of course then yes , he is . So happens was not democratically elected either.

And not that I give a rats ass what someone in another country thinks anout our president . Same old **** ,different direction . Old news .
But !
The American people spoke loudly in the mid term election and they are who count .

I DO have a problem with appeasers and the blame the victim crew .
Same crew that wants to rehab criminals , it is not their fault but societies fault ,"we must not punish but figure out why johnny is so angry" .
Until it is someone close that is attacked and then they want the death penalty for jaywalking !
Kill the SOB , if not give'em life without parole !
sheesh .

No nation is bloodless but if the US is so bad what is the "shining light" that I am missing ? Where ? Where is this perfect society ?

It is my humble opinion that we are attacked physically/verbally because of the The 'ole "green eyed monster" .
Hate those that have it good just because .
It is irrational to say "well a bazillion years ago , my ancester the friggin fungoid , before he evolved of course , was dissed by an american fungoid so I MUST hate them forever . Only fair thing to do" , where's my bomb .

GIMME A FRIGGIN' BREAK !

These are not adults acting rational but sulking
children with very dangerous toys .

And what do you do with an out of control child ?

Someone needs a damn spanking !

 

[rickcr42]

Quote:

War with N Korea - not probable, but possible. It will be much, much harder to convince the world that attacking them would be preemptive and prevent the use of WMDs.

Plus it is a whole lot easier to whip Iraqs ass too

, always a plus

 

[Wodgy]

Kelly, Joe Dick is saying something valid. When we start to equate criticism of the policies of the executive branch of government with criticism of the people is the moment we become no longer free. "America" as an idea is worthless. The constitution is what's worth dying for. The founders of the constitution realized that sometimes the executive would go astray (as would the legislative branch, and the judiciary), which is why they tried to establish a balance of powers. Perhaps the executive has gone astray this time, perhaps not, but criticism should be dealt with logically, not through some blind faith in only one branch of government.

 

[rickcr42]

Gotta go with kelly on this one . Post #4

Quote:

The real problem in the US is the totally diminishing economy this holiday season.

Post #5
Quote:

War is also a great way to kickstart a lagging economy...

Began this **** to begin with . We attacking your leaders ?


The topic was "North korea or Iraq " not who thinks bush is an ******* , which i would also pounce on . Or the "americans are rich lets call them warmongers"

Wanna talk about ending discussion and starting an argument ?

BRING IT ON GUYS

 

[kelly]

Quote:

Originally posted by Wodgy Kelly, Joe Dick is saying something valid. When we start to equate criticism of the policies of the executive branch of government with criticism of the people is the moment we become no longer free. "America" as an idea is worthless. The constitution is what's worth dying for. The founders of the constitution realized that sometimes the executive would go astray (as would the legislative branch, and the judiciary), which is why they tried to establish a balance of powers. Perhaps the executive has gone astray this time, perhaps not, but criticism should be dealt with logically, not through some blind faith in only one branch of government.

Wodgy
I agree with you, but I don't think calling a leader an "idiot" is useful and I don't think questions that begin "why are americans..." are remotely constructive.

 

[smokey]

Kelly - I do not understand North Korea's motives. If someone could explain them to me, I'd appreciate it.
==============================================

I'm not an expert, but here goes. NK's people are starving to death. According to what I've read they'll lose 1/3 of their population this year. I've heard that sort of thing called famine before. Why is this happening? I'm sure its a lot more complicated than this, and I may be wrong, but ...
Before President Bush's last State of the Union address NK was receiving humanitarian aid that was keeping its people alive. During the address the President called NK an "Axis of Evil" and therefore a terrorist state. That effectively ended humanitarian aid through the UN, by international law. Since it has worked for them in the past, NK then "admitted" to a covert nuclear weapons program. They were hoping to trade this program for being taken off the terrorist state list. Unfortunately for them, this President doesn't work that way. He instead cut off oil shipments. Now NK sees its people freezing, unless they starve to death first. NK is now playing the only card they have, hoping to scare the bejeezus out of SK, so that they'll convince the US to back off, and allow them food and oil. If anyone remembers their history, one of the precipitating events to Pearl Harbor was the oil embargo instituted on Japan, by the US. History may well repeat.

This is all presupposing that the NK leader is rational. He could just be insane.

 

[rickcr42]

guess you forgot about japan being such a good neighbor at the time .
Ask China how they felt

Humanitarian aid ? I can hardly stop laughing man !

So how DOES one manage to supply a million man army with enough ordanance to fight a war but can't come up with food ?

Maybe they should plant some damn crops or raise some friggin' cattle !

What ?

Again , they FCK up but it is the fault of the american pres .

 

[kelly]

smokey
Thank you for that concise explanation. That does explain a bit. I do take issue with blaming a single individual ("the president") for the whole of our government's responses but if I sub in "the administration", then it all works for me.

One would think North Korea would not find playing hardball with the United States to be a wise tactic. My guess is that because we've decided to throw China a bone (WTO, etc) to get them off our backs while we deal with the middle east that North Korea felt we'd show them similar treatment.

My belief is that North Korea's "threats" are seen as hollow since despite their admission of having active programs, I don't know that anyone believes they have nuclear war capabilities. Instead, we find them selling scuds to terrorist groups in Yemen. This doesn't leave me with much hope for them and unfortunately for them, the rest of Asia isn't very fond of the Koreans either.

In a sense, their situation is more dire than that of the middle eastern countries. Whereas we have motive to go to war in the way of spoils of war (oils is spoils) and our occupation (or whatever politically correct word they use for that these days) guarantees us certain controls of that market, the North Koreans have nothing we or the rest of the western world want. So, with nothing we want, there's no reason to send Marines. No Marines, no food. It's ironic that the general population of the countries we go to war with so often are the greater benefactors than the ones we don't war with.

 

[rickcr42]

Quote:

My belief is that North Korea's "threats" are seen as hollow since despite their admission of having active programs, I don't know that anyone believes they have nuclear war capabilities.

I beleive the exact opposite . The people of N. Korea are in bad shape , but being a closed society they get no information other than what the "government line" is .

So folks that would normally think about overthrowing their own government get a face to put to their hunger . The United States.

That makes going to war easy due to the backing of the population which ses us as the cause of all misery . And this is in the end a nation with not much to lose . And that makes them doubly dangerous .

With North Korea being outside the normal world they not only can control all information but at the same time do not move forward with other nations . In the blindness they do not see (the leaders) that becoming part of the world is the way out.

Instead they think to conquer the south . The twisted thinking is if they take the south the 20th century comes with it . the wealth , the food , the lifestyle . Never realising the very think they seek to attain they would ,if they conquered ,destroy the south and what they want in the process .

instead of just the north in misery it would be the entirety of the Korean people . Dictators do not suffer the free .
But even there ,there are those that would rather appease the tyrant than go to war to defend what is theirs .

When the majority in THIS country begin to feel that surrender is better than getting bloody my ass is moving .

I would live on a three foot patch of **** in freedom than live in a castle in slavery