[SabreToothBunny]

Now I want to discuss what magnetic Planar design has over dynamic. Any input. With these two in mind. Thanks.

Dynamic drivers work using a cone with a moving coil at one end which sits within a magnet and have a soft moving membrane at the edge of the cone. The current your source puts through the coil creates a magnetic field which moves with/against the driver magnet, causing the vibrations which reproduce sound. The issue is that the cone, by its nature, can distort with extreme frequencies/amplitudes... we're talking about non-linear distortion... so an extreme exaggeration of this is fart-bass but generally speaking with mid-fi headphones upwards, you shouldn't encounter this issue unless the headphones are of poor quality/have poor implementation or are simply being overdriven.
Planars use a membrane with the equivalent to the coil 'printed' on the back of the membrane. This then sits between two powerful magnets called 'statters' which is why they are generally heavier but again, the current running through the thin circuit on the back of the membrane creates a magnetic field which moves between the statters. As the whole membrane moves this technology is less prone to distortion.

If we assume that the drivers in dymanics are of a good quality, without wanting to oversiplify the way these technologies work or the 'house sound' a manufacturer tunes their designs with, generally dynamic headphones are more capable of producing a more punchy bass and a 'dynamic' sound. Planars, on the other hand, produce less distortion and generally have far faster transients. With good implementation they convey more instrumental accuracy and a more layered sound (so less punch, more texture). The downside is that they generally have a smaller soundstage.

There are a couple of things which haven't been discussed in this thread which are: weight and power requirements.
Generally speaking planars require more power and are of a lower sensitivity than dynamic headphones. That said, the Hifiman HE400s is probably one of the easiest to drive planars on the market but it still requires a little more power than average and certainly benefits from amping unless your source (DAP, tablet, phone) is more powerful than average. Also, it weighs 350g, so bear that in mind if you're considering long periods of listening. It's not so heavy but still substantial.
The Meze 99 Classics are nice dynamic headphones are far lighter but have more clamp force and this is main comfort issue with it. It is quite a bit easier to drive though. The Meze doesn't require an amplifier at all and is certainly the more portable option as well as being closed should you decide to take it out with you. Personally I don't like the design for use outside though.

Right... I have to head off. I'll finish what I was going to say when I get back tonight.

 

[Abbizle]

Thanks Sabre. Good I do there.

Just some additional considerations as Pl4y3r and Sabre pointed out.

Doesn't have to be isolation cans as using casually around the house.

Can't be open back, as usually watch whilst Mrs is sleeping next to me. I'm sure I'll find the open backs in the bin next morning lol

Fairly portable, but more emphasis on small, light weight and comfortable for hours of use (Music/Netflix binges). Not planning to take them out much, but would like the option to take out if I ever wanted to.

Amplification wise I'm ordering an Audioquest Dragonfly Black v1.5 with the chosen set, so that I can get the best out of them. So I'm guessing impedance becomes a moot point between these two when run on mobile/tablet.

What a shame on differences in the two techs (planar vs dynamic). I'd have definitely want the punchy and dynamic sound of the dynamics, along with the soundstage, yet also the fast, detailed , textured sound of the planar's.

Is there such a headphone that delivers all this? Otherwise I'm gravitating towards the Meze after what you described.

 

[SabreToothBunny]

Alright, well that negates what I was going to say then.
Isolation is generally associated with only closed headphones though I do own some semi-opens which don't leak so much and a closed headphones which does. The Hifiman HE-400s is open back and they do leak sound significantly and aren't what I would consider small, light weight or portable.
Between that and the Meze 99, you're not going to have a choice but try the 99s given your requirements.
The only closed Hifiman headphone I am aware of is the Edition S Closed and that isn't a planar nor as good as the Meze (in my opinion).

Without wanting to muddy the water, out of your original list, I was going to say the Audeze Sines are the ones which tick all the boxes for your preferred sound requirements and for me are the most accomplished out of all the headphones. I've had mine a year and they were what I considered against the Meze 99 a couple of months ago when looking to change up from the V-Moda M100 I've been using for about 3 years.
I would recommend you add them to your audition list along with the Meze 99s... and I certainly would not advocate investing in either until you've heard them.

 

[Abbizle]

Thanks again Sabre. This headphone choosing melarky is easy lol

I had the Audeze Sines in my original list, but no one was forthcoming with comparison or experience of them. I'd have thought more people would have had them amongst their cans.

As you pointed out and I found out today, the H400s are open back, so out of the runnings now.

And in its place please welcome the late comer Audeze Sine!

Sabre, just a quick query, how did you find the difference in sound quality when you upgraded from the M100s to the 99s? Cause I'm thinking if you upgraded to the Meze from the VModa, then surely the rest of the VModa clan doesn't require consideration.

Please can anyone comment on the Audeze Sine vs Meze 99 Classics? Or just their experience with the Sine in general?

Unfortunately, there are no local shops that stick these. I'd have to go on an hour long drive to London to catch them.

Almost there, all done in a day lol

 

[SabreToothBunny]

Thanks again Sabre. This headphone choosing melarky is easy lol

I had the Audeze Sines in my original list, but no one was forthcoming with comparison or experience of them. I'd have thought more people would have had them amongst their cans.

As you pointed out and I found out today, the H400s are open back, so out of the runnings now.

And in its place please welcome the late comer Audeze Sine!

Sabre, just a quick query, how did you find the difference in sound quality when you upgraded from the M100s to the 99s? Cause I'm thinking if you upgraded to the Meze from the VModa, then surely the rest of the VModa clan doesn't require consideration.

Please can anyone comment on the Audeze Sine vs Meze 99 Classics? Or just their experience with the Sine in general?

Unfortunately, there are no local shops that stick these. I'd have to go on an hour long drive to London to catch them.

Almost there, all done in a day lol

Right... well now I really do have to head off. I'll write some comparisons when I return.

Which side of London are you on? I'm also about an hour's drive from London and actually it's the derailment in Lewisham which has meant I'm still here. if you want to try the Sines and also the V-Moda M100 for a comparison, you're more than welcome for a meet somewhere.
You're also more than welcome to try some of my summit-fi gear if you want to know the differences between mid-fi and summit-fi cans.

 

[Abbizle]

Unfortunately I'm in Southampton. So quite far from you as well

 

[Abbizle]

I've read the Sines are bass neutral, which is probably not what I'm looking for, unless they have good depth and extension?

Unless someone comments on the Audeze Sines, I think the choice has wittled down to the Meze 99s.

So therefore, final question......How much better are the Meze 99s compared to the Sony 100aap? The Sony has a great following on Head-Fi. People who say it's the best headphones under £200. If so, then at £50 for the Sony, are the Meze 99s really £200 better than the Sony's or just marginal?

Thanks again.

 

[buke9]

I've read the Sines are bass neutral, which is probably not what I'm looking for, unless they have good depth and extension?

Unless someone comments on the Audeze Sines, I think the choice has wittled down to the Meze 99s.

So therefore, final question......How much better are the Meze 99s compared to the Sony 100aap? The Sony has a great following on Head-Fi. People who say it's the best headphones under £200. If so, then at £50 for the Sony, are the Meze 99s really £200 better than the Sony's or just marginal?

Thanks again.

I've heard the Sines an they aren't my cup of tea as I hate on ear headphones. They don't sound horrible and the Audeze app when used with a Lightning cable and iPhone was pretty good like the EL8 better with said setup. The Meze 99's would be my pick between the two. My ears touch the inside of the pad and on the material on top of the driver but I don't find it a problem unless your ears are real sensitive. I've heard Meze makes bigger pads but haven't seen them yet.

 

[PL4Y3R 0N3]

I've heard the Sines an they aren't my cup of tea as I hate on ear headphones. They don't sound horrible and the Audeze app when used with a Lightning cable and iPhone was pretty good like the EL8 better with said setup. The Meze 99's would be my pick between the two. My ears touch the inside of the pad and on the material on top of the driver but I don't find it a problem unless your ears are real sensitive. I've heard Meze makes bigger pads but haven't seen them yet.

Meze does in fact make bigger pads, and their new products are sold with them, except the maple and silver I believe.

 

[buke9]

Meze does in fact make bigger pads, and their new products are sold with them, except the maple and silver I believe.

Well there you go.

 

[Abbizle]

So looks like the Meze's are it.

Just to quantify it, if you can say such a thing of sound, the Sony 100aap were £200 when new. Only £50 less than the Meze. For me that's in the same price range. Therefore should be a similar level of quality.

They then went down to £150, and now holding at £100 new. However I picked them up for £50, customer return, within 7 days.

So if I end up spending £200 more and just get a minor upgrade in sound quality, I'll be left disappointed.

However, if the Meze punch above their weight and are miles better than the Sony's, then I'll definitely go for them.

Can anyone provide their views on this conundrum?

Thanks

 

[PL4Y3R 0N3]

Have you seen the innerfidelity review of the Meze? It seems to imply that they are the best closed back in the price range and above, but price and performance aren't always linear, and the further up in price you go the less linear the comparison gets.
Link:
http://www.innerfidelity.com/content/meze-99-classics-very-fun-very-tasty#EwQoDLILijUuiogY.97

 

[buke9]

So looks like the Meze's are it.

Just to quantify it, if you can say such a thing of sound, the Sony 100aap were £200 when new. Only £50 less than the Meze. For me that's in the same price range. Therefore should be a similar level of quality.

They then went down to £150, and now holding at £100 new. However I picked them up for £50, customer return, within 7 days.

So if I end up spending £200 more and just get a minor upgrade in sound quality, I'll be left disappointed.

However, if the Meze punch above their weight and are miles better than the Sony's, then I'll definitely go for them.

Can anyone provide their views on this conundrum?

Thanks

If you base everything on money spent you will likely be unhappy. The Meze as said above is a good closed back for the money. It tends to be a bit bass heavy and a bit on the neutral to warm side on the highs to me. Have not heard the Sony's so can't say about difference there. Just because something cost the same doesn't mean they sound the same. I love beets broccoli and Brussels sprouts and a lot hate them same with audio. No one can say what is going to sound good for you . You might think the Meze are the worst things ever who knows but you. It won't be the end of the world. I find them to be a fun little headphone. Do they sound as good as my Ether C's or AKG K872's for closed back phones nope are they something I don't mind listening to yep.

 

[Abbizle]

You are absolutely right Buke. It was the wrong question to ask Sony vs Meze.

What I should have asked was, I like the deep but tight bass on the Sonys, but am not enjoying the recessed mids and rolled off treble on them.

Am I right in thinking the Meze has more clearer and slightly north of neutral mids and treble that is crisper, but not too sparkly?

So basically I'm looking for slightly more forward mids and a few notches up on the treble sparkle.

From the various reviews on the Meze, it seems to fit the bill.

 

[PL4Y3R 0N3]

It should fit the bill. Definitely seems like what you would like, but that's up to you. If you get it, please share your thoughts on it.