New Audeze LCD3
Oct 23, 2011 at 1:06 PM Post #796 of 11,521
I wish Senheisser would make affordable electrostats.  The best stat I heard was the HE60 at Winks place, I liked it better than the other square cup Staxes.  It even has mids I liked better than on the champaign colored O2 with brown pads.  Outside of orthodynamics, it's Senheisser mids that always works for me as well.
 
To say that stats have significantly better transparency than the LCD2 and the HD800 also would be a massive overstatement, its not like either dynamics are missing anything in the transient capability, and both will easily surpass the attack of any instrument when heard from a reasonable distance.  A true live performance is not as detailed as some recordings on these dynamics would have you believe.
 
Both these headphones seriously diminished the gap that electrostats had over previous dynamic flagships.  That gap now IMO is in fact very small, but that is why we pay the bigger prices, right? 
 
Oct 23, 2011 at 1:32 PM Post #797 of 11,521
I had the Stax Omega / 007t combo for many years, and I like my LCD2/Rev2 much better (more liquid, better image density, better bass, better staging(deeper)).
'never tried the Staxes with any other amp, though.
 
Oct 23, 2011 at 11:57 PM Post #799 of 11,521
I have placed an order of a pair of LCD-2, and canceled it because of LCD-3.  Waiting for a while, however, I hesitate to order LCD-3.  One of the main issues is price.  I can afford the price of LCD-3, but I don't want to pay for what it may not deserve.
 
The reviews of LCD-3 by some people are mixed.  I also sent a private message to Jude regarding LCD-3's price justification, and have not received any response.  He may be too busy, or he may not be sure.
 
Sooner or later, people will get LCD-3, and I really want to hear about their reviews.
 
Oct 24, 2011 at 12:11 AM Post #802 of 11,521
Much of the price problem is because manufacturing cost is probably the same or less as lcd2 yet they arent charging 250 or 300 more... But a thousand. It seems wrong to me. Headphone upgrades used to be more reasonably priced. Companies get away with it because of people who say "who cares". Well  two thousand is probably nothing to you. To 99% of people, it is huge, and taking advantage of those who are passionate on this hobby but arent rich. 
 
Oct 24, 2011 at 12:22 AM Post #803 of 11,521
There's no sense commenting on price increase "because they can" when you have absolutely no clue how much the new manufacturing process and R&D cost (let alone SQ differences only handful of people have even heard yet).
 
Looking forward to hearing what the Irvine crew has to say about these.  And more pics!
 
Oct 24, 2011 at 12:25 AM Post #804 of 11,521


Quote:
Much of the price problem is because manufacturing cost is probably the same or less as lcd2 yet they arent charging 250 or 300 more... But a thousand. It seems wrong to me. Headphone upgrades used to be more reasonably priced. Companies get away with it because of people who say "who cares". Well  two thousand is probably nothing to you. To 99% of people, it is huge, and taking advantage of those who are passionate on this hobby but arent rich. 



I agree.  Usually a company improves a current product, and provides next versions with better quality and sometimes with lower price.
 
Nonetheless, if they did it real good with LCD-3, they may deserve the price.  In appearance, however, I don't see it.  With the design mostly unchanged from LCD-2, I doubt it unless the internal components are really superior to LCD-2's.
 
I am just waiting for others' reviews...
 
Oct 24, 2011 at 12:26 AM Post #805 of 11,521

Copied from the Irvine thread 
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Quote:

Smackdown: LCD3 vs SR009

The very notion of this is dumb. It's like comparing apples and oranges. Those who prefer or appreciate electrostatics will like the SR009. Those who prefer or appreciate the strengths of the LCD2 will like the LCD3 even more. If we really want to get down to it: the LCD3 will not be replacing the SR009. The SR009, properly powered, is simply on another level in terms on clarify, speed, and transient response. At this rate, it won't be until the LCD6 or 7 until Audeze gets close. The LCD3 has it's own strengths however, particularly with low bass volume. I'm going to focus more on the LCD3 because it seems to be of interest to more people.
 

SR009:

This SR009 needs to be properly powered. My initial assessment was that it does OK with inferior amplification such as the SRM323. This is true for low volume levels. Once you turn the volume up, the 009 struggles on inferior amps. The BHSE and to a slightly lesser extent, the KGSS hold their own in power the 009. I didn't not find the 009 to be thin or bright sounding from n3rdling's Accuphase/BHSE or dougquaid's PWD/KGSS. The sound signature out of these rigs reminded me of a properly sourced and powered UERM IEM: neutral, not thin, not bright, not cold, but neutral.
 

LCD3: 

I actually like the LCD3. This is indeed special because readers of my pre-measurement impressions in the CSD thread will note that I pretty much dislike 80% of what's out there. I heard the LCD3 out of several rigs; and also out of my PWD/BA. I tried out a few different driver tubes too get a good match. The tonal balance is similar to the LCDr2, but with a much more linear frequency response. Whereas the LCD2r2 is still a little rough in the treble, the LCD3 is smooth and relaxed. The big question for me is still whether it can better extract low level information. I got a sense of that indeed it would toward the end of the meet when things started to quiet down. Because the LCD3 is similar in tonal balance to the HD650, it does require a quieter background environment than say an HD800 to ascertain this attribute. I wish I had it longer because the Audeze guys had to leave a bit early.
 
Now I'm not about the proclaim the LCD3 as the best dynamic headphone ever. I would prefer to be conservative and take some time to first tweak my setup around it. Some people know that I really like the HD800 (at least the modded version that drops the treble down 3db) and built my setup around it. Even then, the HD800 can only be "tolerable" (in terms of brightness) with certain material; so I feel the LCD3 would be an excellent complement to the HD800 where I could just relax with it. I didn't note any soundstage issues with the LCD3. The soundstage thing is not a priority for me, and it's more a matter of icing-on-the-cake then necessity. It could also be a matter that the BA goes some ways to make the soundstage issue moot.
 
I feel the LCD3 as an incremental step from the LCD2r2, which was itself an incremental step from the LCD2r1. The LCD3 is slightly faster, slightly clearer, slightly more extended and much more linear and smooth in the treble region. The improved linearity is the one I most welcome. I also feel that the bass is more coherent. Do I want to pay $1945 for it? No. I want to pay $1445 for it. But I also want to pay $3200 for the SR009 and $1200 for the HD800. So I guess it sucks to be me. 
 
BTW I'm on the list to get one.
 
 
P.S. The LCD3 has thicker more squishy pads. The headphone feels comfortable for me. The issues I had with the LCD2r1 with too much force clamping on the side of my head are no longer there. The LCD3 also seems lighter, although I don't know if it's because of better distribution of weight.



 
 
Oct 24, 2011 at 12:34 AM Post #808 of 11,521


Quote:
Copied from the Irvine thread 
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Thanks for the information.  I feel the price of 1445 seems right for me.  In fact, I got my HD 800 at around $1200 of a new pair.
 
It may also be possible for Audeze to provide a pair of LCD-3 and a cable (not two) in a cheap box.  This way, they may be able to cut the price significantly.
 
Oct 24, 2011 at 1:10 AM Post #809 of 11,521


Quote:
 
Thanks for the information.  I feel the price of 1445 seems right for me.  In fact, I got my HD 800 at around $1200 of a new pair.
 
It may also be possible for Audeze to provide a pair of LCD-3 and a cable (not two) in a cheap box.  This way, they may be able to cut the price significantly.



How about no cable, no box, no headband, no housing, just the drivers pls.
 
Oct 24, 2011 at 1:14 AM Post #810 of 11,521
 
Quote:
And not to start a war, but I preferred the LCD3's over the Stax 009's at the Canfest. The LCD3's have the magic that I do not hear with the 009"s.


I'm still on the fence on both of these. I own the 009s and am seriously considering also purchasing the LCD3s.
 
I'm still waiting for a good full tube to power the STAX. The best electrostatic amp I heard was not the BHSE, but Frank Cooter's beastly creation at the Norcal meet earlier this year. We never got a chance to plug in the O2 into it, but the SR507s were like "BAMM!" in terms of dynamics on it. It was just explosive.
 

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