[acud1985]

Hi, i need your help for my new setup. i Always listen jazz, rock and classic music with speakers ( a pair of thiel cs 2.1) but it's not Always possible late in the night. so i would buy a headphone setup.
 
i'd like a flat overear headphone ( maybe akg k702) but i don't know anything about desktop amp. i like warmer sound tipically for jazz and classic music.
 
please help me to choose a good setup and a good headphone for my favourites music.
 
thanks of all and sorry for my english
 
ps: budget around 350 euro for all.
Giovanni

 

[acud1985]

No one can help me?

 

[serman005]

No one can help me?

I would recommend that you look strongly at an HE400S. It is outstanding. You won't need an amp for it in all likelihood. What is your source for playing music? Your phone? A DAP?

 

[acud1985]

I would recommend that you look strongly at an HE400S. It is outstanding. You won't need an amp for it in all likelihood. What is your source for playing music? Your phone? A DAP?

Not my phone but a sandisk sansa clip rockboxed for now. So do YOU think that he400s IT'S a good choice? why They have a good medium "gamma" range?
Another setup?
Thanks

 

[serman005]

Not my phone but a sandisk sansa clip rockboxed for now. So do YOU think that he400s IT'S a good choice? why They have a good medium "gamma" range?
Another setup?
Thanks

It is just a really good sounding headphone. Smooth, very detailed, balanced and rather neutral down to about 80 Hz where it starts to roll off. It is just a beautiful sounding headphone. Great especially for jazz and classical. A terrific value. It's what I would go with if I were you. It is very efficient so no amp required.

 

[acud1985]

There is only a problem. I can't try he400s because IT'S Not Simple to find them in Italy. I would buy a desktop amp to drive Also a different kind of headphones too. I like a warmer sound.

 

[ProtegeManiac]

 
i'd like a flat overear headphone ( maybe akg k702) but i don't know anything about desktop amp. i like warmer sound tipically for jazz and classic music.
 
please help me to choose a good setup and a good headphone for my favourites music.

I would buy a desktop amp to drive Also a different kind of headphones too. I like a warmer sound.

 

First problem: there is no headphone with a flat sound. No transducer given current technology measures totally flat.

 

Second problem: do you want flat or do you want warm? Those aren't the same thing. Flat, whether it is by default (though currently impossible in totality), or "flattest given current technology," or "something I can more easily make as flat as possible with even simpler EQ apps" is not the same as "warmer." Let's go by one example: an example of flattest among current technology (though many are basically as close to flat just in different ways) is the HD600, but if you EQ that to flat, you just flatten the 3500hz peak. By contrast, if you wanted "warmer" than "flat," you'd have to not just flatten the 3500hz peak, you have to roll off everything above 2000hz, basically, the HD650.

 

Now if what you mean is "as flat as possible erring on slightly warm (instead of slightly bright)" then the K702 isn't automatically what I'd think of (though not totally disqualified), since that has peaks in the treble that are considerably taller than 1000hz. However for your total planned budget that doesn't leave a lot of room for an amp to drive the K702. Unless you've already heard that and like it (and hopefully not being driven by, say, a Meier or Violectric, which are way out of your budget), you might want to consider the Focal Spirit Classic instead.

 

[acud1985]

 

 

First problem: there is no headphone with a flat sound. No transducer given current technology measures totally flat.

 

Second problem: do you want flat or do you want warm? Those aren't the same thing. Flat, whether it is by default (though currently impossible in totality), or "flattest given current technology," or "something I can more easily make as flat as possible with even simpler EQ apps" is not the same as "warmer." Let's go by one example: an example of flattest among current technology (though many are basically as close to flat just in different ways) is the HD600, but if you EQ that to flat, you just flatten the 3500hz peak. By contrast, if you wanted "warmer" than "flat," you'd have to not just flatten the 3500hz peak, you have to roll off everything above 2000hz, basically, the HD650.

 

Now if what you mean is "as flat as possible erring on slightly warm (instead of slightly bright)" then the K702 isn't automatically what I'd think of (though not totally disqualified), since that has peaks in the treble that are considerably taller than 1000hz. However for your total planned budget that doesn't leave a lot of room for an amp to drive the K702. Unless you've already heard that and like it (and hopefully not being driven by, say, a Meier or Violectric, which are way out of your budget), you might want to consider the Focal Spirit Classic instead.

sorry, but i can't explain well... i like a warmer sound because i listen jazz music but i would a flat headphone or much as flat as possible. so you think that akg k702 it's not the right choice? which you think that i have to consider?
thanks a lot

 

[ProtegeManiac]

  sorry, but i can't explain well... i like a warmer sound because i listen jazz music but i would a flat headphone or much as flat as possible. so you think that akg k702 it's not the right choice? which you think that i have to consider?

 

well here's the thing...even if the headphone was totally flat, either some new technology makes that possible, or you use an EQ to make it as flat as possible, where do you get the warmer sound? The only way to get that from a flat headphone is to introduce distortion.

 

What I'd do is get a K702 with a solid state or hybrid amp that has a distortion pattern that doesn't make it harsh or bright, ie, when you push it it doesn't sound too harsh that will make a headphone with a treble peak even worse. Something like a Meier or Violectric, or even the Schiit Asgard. Then use EQ to trim the treble peak. That last part is crucial if by "neutral but warm" (even if it sounds contradictory) or better yet "overall system sound as neutral as possible but will rather err on warm than bright" if what you mean is "I just don't want the cymbals piercing my ear drums."

 

[acud1985]

well here's the thing...even if the headphone was totally flat, either some new technology makes that possible, or you use an EQ to make it as flat as possible, where do you get the warmer sound? The only way to get that from a flat headphone is to introduce distortion.

What I'd do is get a K702 with a solid state or hybrid amp that has a distortion pattern that doesn't make it harsh or bright, ie, when you push it it doesn't sound too harsh that will make a headphone with a treble peak even worse. Something like a Meier or Violectric, or even the Schiit Asgard. Then use EQ to trim the treble peak. That last part is crucial if by "neutral but warm" (even if it sounds contradictory) or better yet "overall system sound as neutral as possible but will rather err on warm than bright" if what you mean is "I just don't want the cymbals piercing my ear drums."

So i'm understanding that what i would IT'S quite impossible..so i ask you..which headphone i have to choose to listen my favourite Music?and which desktop amp? Not only for 350euro but more too. Thank you so much for your suggestion.

 

[Pharmaboy]

So i'm understanding that what i would IT'S quite impossible..so i ask you..which headphone i have to choose to listen my favourite Music?and which desktop amp? Not only for 350euro but more too. Thank you so much for your suggestion.

 
This whole topic is confusing. I'll try to help a little.
 
You started this thread with a question about headphone amps--but also about headphones. If your 350 euros has to cover both, then my advice would be:
 
1 - Start by buying a new headphone that appeals to you. You mentioned an AKG 702, which may be perfect (not to my taste, but this is not about my taste). However, that AKG new may eat up a lot of your 350 euros, unless AKGs are cheaper where you live. There are many AKG models. There are also other choices that may/may not be perfect (for example, the open-back Fidelio X2's--I own & really like them. They're perfect for jazz & classical. There are also many inexpensive but good closed back headphones. There is a thread 100% dedicated to inexpensive Chinese designs that sound really good (http://www.head-fi.org/t/822184/chinese-asian-brand-info-thread-on-or-over-ear-headphones)...some of the headphones mentioned there are the Status Audio CB-1; ISK MDH9000 and 4-5 different "clones" (same design w/different brand), including LyxPro HAS-30's and Marantz MPH-2's); and various headphones by Somic.
 
Main point here is that you should get new headphones, which may or may not prove to be "the perfect headphone"--but you have to start someplace. Your first pair of headphones could probably be driven by the computer or cellphone while you're looking for a new or used amp. And though running the headphones w/o an amp (at least in the beginning) may not sound as good with it would with an amp, that's OK--you're starting a new learning curve here. First priority is the learn everything the new headphones can do on your music. You may eventually think this 1st pair of headphones is "just ok," or you may think they're wonderful. Either way, you'll learn about what you like & don't like in headphones.
 
2 - In my opinion, the amp is a different challenge, and buying an amp should be your 2nd action. Why do I say that? Because you can get a very satisfying pair of headphones for less than $100, but to get a really satisfying/strong headphone amp for under (let's say) $200 new would be a real achievement. So my recommendation would be to try to purchase a used headphone amp locally (ie, in or near your country). Likely suspects would include:
 
-- Lake People G103 (new price = $290 USD) or G109S (new price = $525 USD). I have the very similar G109A--an extremely capable, good-sounding amp--all my headphones sound good on it
-- Lake People RS 02 (new price = $649 USD) ... well reviewed
-- iFi Micro iCan (new price = $349 USD). I bought and sold a used one last year: it's a very capable, flexible amp with pretty good power
-- Matrix M Stage HPA-1 (only available used/a little hard to find here)...a very good, "friendly" sounding headphone amp that can also be a preamp. I just upgraded mine w/new opamp and it sounds excellent. I've owned 2 used HPA-1s...gave the 1st away as a gift.
 
Or you could try the Matrix M Stage HPA-2, the update to the HPA-1. You actually buy this new on ebay for ~$190 USD. The reviews say this unit sounds is a little less warm and more accurate than the HPA-1. That makes it less interesting to me, but you may have different tastes.
 
I'll bet you can find at least one of the amps in this list available used (on Head-Fi or other sites) that's located somewhere in the euro zone.
 
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Matrix-M-stage-HPA-2-Headphone-Amplifier-AMP-black-/141685318697?hash=item20fd1a6429:g:Ft4AAMXQWzNSn~Dg
 
Note: I left tube amps off this list for just 1 reason: though some of them are said to be good but not very expensive (ie, LittleDot II, III, or IV; Darkvoice; etc), many users ending spending as much money on aftermarket tubes as they did on the amp (which defeats the budget!).
 
I really hope this helps.

 

[cskippy]

I recommend HD600 for the headphone.

 

[pbui44]

Sennheiser HD600 for 287 euros:

https://www.amazon.it/Sennheiser-Cuffia-Stereofonica-Hi-End-Dinamica/dp/B00004SY4H/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1488592101&sr=8-1&keywords=hd600

Bravo Ocean Amp for 90 euros:

https://www.amazon.it/Bravo-Audio-Ocean-Headphone-Amplifier/dp/B00A2QKSVI/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1488592038&sr=8-1&keywords=bravo+ocean+amp

27 euros over your budget, but well worth it.

When Christmas comes, look at this beast:

https://www.amazon.it/GUSTARD-A20H-AK4497EQ-Headphone-Amplifier/dp/B01M8N1HYY/ref=sr_1_4?s=electronics&ie=UTF8&qid=1488592748&sr=1-4&keywords=gustard

Of course, it's just a thought.

Edit: If you have a little bit of extra money, skip the bravo ocean amp and get the Audioquest Dragonfly Red for 189 euros:

https://www.amazon.it/Audioquest-A960-Dragonfly-Convertitore-ROSSO/dp/B01DFMV4NQ/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1488593055&sr=8-2&keywords=audioquest+dragonfly

Confirmed by several to drive the HD600 (Red version only). 126 euros over your budget, but well worth it for at least two years.

 

[cskippy]

Anything from Schiit that fits your budget will be great for the money.  Vali 2 or Valhalla 2 are excellent with HD600.
 
It looks like Pro Audio Italia is the official Schiit distributor for Italy:
 
http://www.proaudioitalia.it/pai_schiit_01.html

 

[ProtegeManiac]

So i'm understanding that what i would IT'S quite impossible..so i ask you..which headphone i have to choose to listen my favourite Music?and which desktop amp? Not only for 350euro but more too. Thank you so much for your suggestion.

 

Technically impossible (regardless of what others say about having "flat" or "neutral" headphones or speakers), but that doesn't mean you can't get close enough and enjoy what you have otherwise.

All I'm basically saying is, it's not going to be totally flat, manage your expectations and if you actually like any, don't join the people saying that any headphone is totally flat. 

 

You can look into the HE400i or HD600, or heck, the K702 isn't necessarily out of the running as long as you manage your expectations. The HE400i is close to flat in how flat it is from 1000hz down to 10hz, but it's weak between 1000hz and 3500hz, and there's a peak at the latter slightly higher than 1000hz followed by another peak higher up. HD600 has a short peak at 3500hz and one more higher, while it has a bass plateau from 60hz to 170hz (where it's louder than 1000hz). K702 has a treble peak but otherwise would be generally similar enough to the HD600.

 

There's also the HD650 and the LCD-2 (non-Fazor), but while they're smooth from 10hz to 1000hz and from 1000hz to 10000hz, that's kind of segmented as the first region is stronger than the other, although apart from that the curves are smooth, so no treble peaks nor valleys.

 

As for the amp, something like the Meier Jazz FF, Classic FF, or Violectric V200.