[kool bubba ice]

The DT48e soundstage is average to above average, but very left to right orientated. But the sound stage is very coherent with natural/neutral timbre. If you are sensitive to fit issues, I'd avoid the DT48e.. Personally, I have no problem with fit, minus the DT48s. The DT48e does excel at acoustics, but that alone won't be enough for you IMO.. I'd go with the W5000..

 

[jpelg]

What do you think of your Ultrasone Pro 900's?

Imo, the top Ultrasones have the best, natural, textured bass available. Strings sound so palpable! Soundstage is the most speaker-like I've heard from headphones. Low-level (spl) listening is quite nice too.

Mids could use a little bit of help. But the Prolines do so much else right, they are worth trying some tweaking. I suggest experimenting with some of the recabling options - silver, silver/copper, possibly balanced (never heard them balanced though), etc., plus some of the well-known modifications - Kee's mod, in particular.

 

[Andrew_WOT]

Out of everything on the list, none is the ideal candidate for classical with W5000 being the closest. I would suggest to look at HD650 may be even K701/702 if you are after brighter and leaner presentation.

 

[JayG]

Andrew: I already own both the HD650 and K702.

jpelg: I like my PRO900s quite a bit. But the reason I got them is because I needed closed, semi-portable, quality cans and they seemed like the best option. They succeed in fulfilling these requirements, and therefore I am satisfied with the purchase, but to be honest, I rarely ever reach for them instead of one of my pairs of open phones at home, especially with classical. I like the quality of the bass even though it's a little much at times, and they are very detailed. However, I find the midrange to be slightly recessed, and the timbre isn't the best. Strings sound too metallic to me. Also, I guess my ears aren't very receptive to the S-Logic because my main complaint is they sound very claustrophobic and constricted.

 

[JayG]

Jerome:

I agree with you that the GS1000 bass is forward. However, I love it. I rarely find it to be too much, and I think if the mids weren't so recessed, the bass would sound much more well balanced. Certainly in comparison with the highs, the bass isn't too forward. My problem is the super tipped-up highs and sucked out mids.

I have heard that the W5000s are a "bright" can, but the GS1000s, K702s, and DT880s are all considered bright around here, and to me, they all have very different levels of brightness. Do you think you could listen to a couple treble-heavy spots in classical recordings with the GS1000s and W5000s and tell me how they compare? For me, the treble problems with the GS1000s generally raise their heads in full-orchestra pieces, during brass-heavy and crash-cymbal heavy spots. Think the opening of the 4th movement of Beethoven's 5th, climaxes in Shostakovitch and Mahler symphonies etc. If I turn the volume down enough so that the highs don't hurt my ears, the mids are so low in level comparatively that the music just dies.

 

[Gradofan2]

Quote:

Originally Posted by JayG /img/forum/go_quote.gif Jerome: I agree with you that the GS1000 bass is forward. However, I love it. I rarely find it to be too much, and I think if the mids weren't so recessed, the bass would sound much more well balanced. Certainly in comparison with the highs, the bass isn't too forward. My problem is the super tipped-up highs and sucked out mids. ... If I turn the volume down enough so that the highs don't hurt my ears, the mids are so low in level comparatively that the music just dies.

Just for "giggles and grins" try using your fingers to press the GS1Ks a bit closer to your ears (if you haven't done that previously), being careful not to block the flow of the air from the chambers.

Do you notice how much the bass and mids improve - even the highs?

At least they did when I tried it - great sound really.

But... whose going to sit around doing that?!?

Not me!

 

[jsaliga]

Quote:

Originally Posted by JayG /img/forum/go_quote.gif Jerome: Do you think you could listen to a couple treble-heavy spots in classical recordings with the GS1000s and W5000s and tell me how they compare? For me, the treble problems with the GS1000s generally raise their heads in full-orchestra pieces, during brass-heavy and crash-cymbal heavy spots

I did as you asked and actually posted a comparison (though I admittedly threw it together in a hurry). But rather than take my word for it I think you would be better off judging the W5000 for yourself.

You have a PM.

--Jerome

 

[scytheavatar]

Quote:

Originally Posted by JayG /img/forum/go_quote.gif AmanGeorge: I like my K702s very much, and they are one of my most-used cans. I think that even people who don't care for them are willing to admit that they beat most other phones on the market as far as presenting a neutral sound. However, they have a couple big issues that prevent me from considering them as ideal. First, the bass is too recessed. It just is. Yes, it's tight, and tuneful, and natural, and textured, and extended, but it needs about 3 more dB in relation to the mids and highs. The other problem is the strange upper-mid response that causes strings instruments especially to sound slightly nasal. I don't think it's as extreme as some others do, but it is there, and if you listen to them in comparison the the DT880s, which have a closer overall signature to the K702s than anything else I have, you can clearly hear it. If these two problems weren't present, the K702s, in my opinion, would be incredible.

Those 2 problems can be solved easily with the correct source, i.e anything but that useless DAC1. I think that without going into the electrostats the K702 is probably the best classical music phone you can get.

 

[vcoheda]

Quote:

Originally Posted by JayG /img/forum/go_quote.gif I already own both the HD650 and K702.

for classical, i think you are good. out of all my dynamics, the 650/701 are my two favorites. and i would take them over a denon, GS1000, or ATH. you should give the 600 a try or if strings is your thing, then maybe the K340, although i don't think it excels at much else.

 

[Acix]

The K-702 are great, maybe you can try some old AKG models...Like K-240DF or the K-400.

 

[hifidk]

I guess I better send the K501 out to you fast, although I don't know if they are going to be an upgrade from your current headphones

 

[catscratch]

K501 is very good for tone, and so is the K1000, though it does have a tendency to sound lean in certain systems. Neither will do well with bass extension so if you have a lot of organ works that you want to replicate with full sub-bass information, look elsewhere, probably at speakers.

I like the HD600 for tone a lot more than the HD650. The HD600 is much more accurate, while the HD650 is more colored and euphonic. The HD600 is pretty slow though and large-scale orchestral works will not be replicated with full detail and spatial cues on every single instrument. The HD650, while not really fast, is definitely faster with better imaging and detail.

Elecrostatics are certainly the way to go but not every electrostat will have good tone. They vary just as much as dynamics do on average. The SR-303 and 404 specifically do not have a good tone to my ears, since there is a pretty large peak in the upper mids that makes certain instruments sound colder and more brittle. I also don't like the O2 Mk2 for tone, since it has a similar coloration though it's much more subtle than in the SR-404.

The O2 Mk1 though is the tone champ and off a headphone amp that can drive it will give you as phenomenally realistic tone as your source allows. Stax amps will struggle with this headphone (with the exception of the 717 and the T2 if you can ever find one), so you will probably want a KGSS, Blue Hawaii, or that new Woo Audio amp that's coming out soon (not the standard Woo GES).

Also electrostatics are insanely revealing, and you will hear exactly how much digital glare the DAC1 has should you go that way. A source upgrade will be in order.

 

[Baimi]

Of the cans you listed, I have had the pleasure of auditioning the AD2000, RS1 (buttonless) and DT48e. I must admit that classical is not my favorite genre of music, so take my opinion with a grain of salt.

First off, I would scratch RS1 off the list if I were to listen to classical music, especially symphonies. The lack of soundstage really make RS1 ill-suited for full emsembles. RS1 can handle solo string/percusion music fine but it really isn't the best phones for this genre.

The AD2000 is a nice pair of cans but I don't really like its presentation. It is incredibly forward (pardon me for not being able to describe it better) and a little similar to the RS1 in that aspect, but not in a way that agrees with my preferences. The sound is crisp from the AD2000 but a little unnatural.

I think the DT48e is actually a great choice, if you could tolerate its less-than-comfortable fit and its closed design. However, the DT48e delivers a very peculiar bass that is not for everyone.

Just my 2 cents.

 

[Aimless1]

I have two of the cans on your list and the K501.

For full orchestral works you may as well eliminate the RS-1. Narrow soundstage, both width and depth. Forward mids can also be problematic for classical.

The K501 is nice for classical and accoustic but it is slow (compared to other cans on your list) and will make your DT880s seem like bass monsters.

Currently listening to Beethoven's 1st and instinctively I reached for the W5000. This is a newer headphone for me that I've only had for a month or so. The sound is colored, but to my liking. The fit issue is well known and almost scared me off from acquiring them. In my case they fit out of the box. They have detail and imaging I'm not used to. In my setup I have not had the sibilance issues Jerome refers to. Can't really add more to what you have already researched or has already been said here.

 

[ting.mike]

Quote:

Originally Posted by padam /img/forum/go_quote.gif You should go to a meet and try a Stax.

I did. I didn't find them that special..



Quote:

Originally Posted by JayG /img/forum/go_quote.gif Yes, I am excited to receive the K501s and try them for myself. I have been interested in them for years since they have such a reputation around here for classical, and I will be be happy to see for myself. Also, as has been said, they are very affordable, so if I love them, they'll be a real bargain, if not, I can easily resell them or keep them for a pretty small loss. ting.mike: Like I said, The GS1000 does a lot right, and has a lot of strengths when it comes to classical music. But it's a fact it has a canyon shaped frequency response. I don't know how you can say they are neutral. Because of this, with many recordings (mostly full orchestral), the timbre is very off, with thin mids and piercing highs. They are superb for chamber music, string quartet, small-scale vocal music, but to me, they are not well suited to symphonic music because the full orchestra uses the entire frequency spectrum all at once and clearly reveals the GS1000s' weird response curve. It's a shame too, because the soundstage, clarity, and imaging can do wonders for symphonic music, but the sucked out mids usually kill it for me. AmanGeorge: I like my K702s very much, and they are one of my most-used cans. I think that even people who don't care for them are willing to admit that they beat most other phones on the market as far as presenting a neutral sound. However, they have a couple big issues that prevent me from considering them as ideal. First, the bass is too recessed. It just is. Yes, it's tight, and tuneful, and natural, and textured, and extended, but it needs about 3 more dB in relation to the mids and highs. The other problem is the strange upper-mid response that causes strings instruments especially to sound slightly nasal. I don't think it's as extreme as some others do, but it is there, and if you listen to them in comparison the the DT880s, which have a closer overall signature to the K702s than anything else I have, you can clearly hear it. If these two problems weren't present, the K702s, in my opinion, would be incredible.

I really should listen to a stock GS1000, as the "i" that I had didn't have that weird curve you're talking about.

The K702/K701 is not transparent enough to me, once you're used to the GS1000i.