[SirMarc]

Someone posted in the 4xx thread that they trigger high gain mode with the V30. I joined this drop, so I guess I'll find out...

 

[scottm18]

Someone posted in the 4xx thread that they trigger high gain mode with the V30. I joined this drop, so I guess I'll find out...

I have these headphones and with like every power-hungry planar I've tried, the V30 just does not supply them enough power in ANY mode--especially this particular model just is not driven enough. The HEXv2 at higher sensitivity gets closer to the goal, but still not enough. There's no comparison to a dynamic set like Final Audio Pandora VI that will blow your head off in volume (it's at least double the volume and I'm not exaggerating). YMMV, but I'm sticking strictly to dynamic models to use with this source as there's plenty of good ones of those to choose from--and leaving the planars to true headphones amps.

Also, for the person looking into the impedance adapter...the easiest method is just remove an earpiece connector and plug in the headphones to the source which will trigger high-volume AUX mode. Re-connect the earpiece and voila...you will still be in that aux mode--but no extraneous dongles and wires to worry about.

 

[SirMarc]

I have these headphones and with like every power-hungry planar I've tried, the V30 just does not supply them enough power in ANY mode--especially this particular model just is not driven enough. The HEXv2 at higher sensitivity gets closer to the goal, but still not enough. There's no comparison to a dynamic set like Final Audio Pandora VI that will blow your head off in volume (it's at least double the volume and I'm not exaggerating). YMMV, but I'm sticking strictly to dynamic models to use with this source as there's plenty of good ones of those to choose from--and leaving the planars to true headphones amps.

Also, for the person looking into the impedance adapter...the easiest method is just remove an earpiece connector and plug in the headphones to the source which will trigger high-volume AUX mode. Re-connect the earpiece and voila...you will still be in that aux mode--but no extraneous dongles and wires to worry about.

Thanks, Asgard 2 or Sansui vintage amp for these I guess

 

[Dannemand]

@csglinux or others: I am very sorry to be back harping on about UAPP settings, but something is just not right about UAPP's use of the ESS DAC -- at least on my phone. And I wonder if others are seeing the same: In short, there is no combination of "HiRes driver flags" or other settings that will make UAPP consistently use the ESS DAC for all types of files (44k/16, various hi-res PCM, SDS, MQA). No matter which settings, there will always be some files where UAPP "forgets" to use the ESS DAC or doesn't use it fully. Specifically:

1) If all flags are left clear under "Settings"->"HiRes Audio"->"HiRes driver flags" (as recommended by the app Dev on the UAPP help page), all PCM files (44k/16 as well as hi-res) will use the ESS DAC as intended (evidenced by the clear difference when toggling the DAC on/off or changing presets on the "Hi-Fi Quad DAC" QuickSettings screen). MQA files will also use the DAC for analog conversion, but not for MQA decoding (evidenced by the "Hi-Fi Quad DAC" QuickSettings screen allowing me to change Presets, instead of giving me the "Cannot apply sound presets to DSD or MQA files" message.) DSD files will fully use the ESS DAC for both decoding and analog conversion (toggling the DAC on/off is audible, and attempts to change Presets gives the "Cannot apply sound presets to DSD or MQA files" message).

2) If the "MQA (V30)" flag is toggled on under "Settings"->"HiRes Audio"->"HiRes driver flags" (and the phone rebooted, as required for UAPP to update its HiRes driver mode), MQA and DSD files will correctly use the ESS DAC for both decoding and analog conversion (giving me the "Cannot apply sound presets to DSD or MQA files" message). Hi-res PCM files (anything beyond 44k/16) will not use the ESS DAC at all. 44k/16 PCM files will use the ESS DAC, but strangely also trigger the "Cannot apply sound presets to DSD or MQA files" message, leading me to believe UAPP may be using the DAC for 16-to-24 bit padding instead of the CPU. If so, that saves battery drain, but prevents DAC presets on 44k/16 files.

3) Toggling on the "Direct PCM" flag in addition to "MQA (V30)" under "Settings"->"HiRes Audio"->"HiRes driver flags" (as recommended in the Opening Post of this thread, again phone rebooted for UAPP to update its HiRes driver mode) causes no change in behavior that I could observe compared to (2) above (i.e. only "MQA (V30)" being on). It is of course entirely possible that it has other effects in audio processing that I have not detected.

4) I tried combining the above with different settings under "Settings"->"HiRes Audio"->"Bit perfect mode" ("Off", "On", "When possible") but saw no change in the above behavior.

5) I also tried (A) wiping app data for UAPP and (B) completely uninstalling/re-installing it from the Play Store (deleting the "Internal Storage/UAPP" directory in between), and again saw no change in the above behavior.

I mean to email the UAPP developer for clarification on these flags, but I really would love to know if other UAPP users are seeing the same on their V30. If others are not seeing the same, I may try to Factory Reset my phone and see if that helps. BTW, I have the T-Mobile V30+ (H932) and am on Nougat 7.1.2. (Oreo 8.0 for T-Mobile just hit the LG Bridge servers, but I am sitting on my hands until I know if it affects possible rootability.)

Being such a newb here, I much apologize if this was discussed somewhere and I missed it. I certainly didn't see it when reading through this thread. I am working my way through the Main V30 thread and am currently on page 57, so admittedly, it could be in there somewhere.

Thank you in advance.

Edit: After yet another test run, I had to update the above list of findings already. So many combinations of settings and files, and sometimes changes don't "take" without reboot, sometimes they do: With default settings (after app wipe or re-install, all HiRes driver flags clear) both PCM and DSD files do use the ESS DAC. It's only MQA files that don't use it for decoding, but does use it for analog conversion. This would indicate that leaving the "MQA (V30)" flag disabled is the most versatile setting. But I suspect that it is also this flag that makes UAPP pad 44k/16-bit files to 44k/24-bit and thus prevents the re-sampling and interpolation that we're trying to avoid. Anyways, this update doesn't change the fact that it's a mess, and no setting plays all file types correctly.

 

[Mhog55]

I have these headphones and with like every power-hungry planar I've tried, the V30 just does not supply them enough power in ANY mode--especially this particular model just is not driven enough. The HEXv2 at higher sensitivity gets closer to the goal, but still not enough. There's no comparison to a dynamic set like Final Audio Pandora VI that will blow your head off in volume (it's at least double the volume and I'm not exaggerating). YMMV, but I'm sticking strictly to dynamic models to use with this source as there's plenty of good ones of those to choose from--and leaving the planars to true headphones amps.

Also, for the person looking into the impedance adapter...the easiest method is just remove an earpiece connector and plug in the headphones to the source which will trigger high-volume AUX mode. Re-connect the earpiece and voila...you will still be in that aux mode--but no extraneous dongles and wires to worry about.

Would you be so kind to list some of your favorite higher impedance, dynamic cans with a removable cable, for use with the V30?

 

[alota]

Perfect. Thank you to everyone for your help. Can someone direct me to one of the better impedance adaptors? I see some on ebay that come in various ohm ratings. I reckon it doesn't matter which ohm I get, just so long as I trip high impedance. I kinda like the orange set up the OP posted in the original post. Just don't want anything cheap that may cause damage to my phone if that's even possible. I definitely will not be leaving it plugged in.

i bought this: https://www.ebay.es/itm/DUNU-3-5mm-...e=STRK:MEBIDX:IT&_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649

 

[scottm18]

m

Would you be so kind to list some of your favorite higher impedance, dynamic cans with a removable cable, for use with the V30?

Any Sennheiser model (even 200-300ohm models) is easily driven with the V30. I have the Massdrop 6xx (650) and they sound great, if not 'Sennheiser polite'. I'm sure the same would be true with the similar impedance Beyer line like the Amiron. I also have Massdrop's TFZ King Pro iem...but can't get a proper fit of yet. They are 55ohms to perfect for triggering high-ohm mode, which they do.

My best pairing so far has to be the Final Audio Pandora VI, which sound amazing but have a (Japanese quirky) tempermental headband adjust system and a mini-tweeter driver that may be noticeable against the ear. They are LOW ohms at only 8ohm...so tons of power.

I was going to try the Campire Cascades next (which should be a good match)...but went another route as i think my ears would be too big for them...

 

[csglinux]

@csglinux or others: I am very sorry to be back harping on about UAPP settings, but something is just not right about UAPP's use of the ESS DAC -- at least on my phone. And I wonder if others are seeing the same: In short, there is no combination of "HiRes driver flags" or other settings that will make UAPP consistently use the ESS DAC for all types of files (44k/16, various hi-res PCM, SDS, MQA). No matter which settings, there will always be some files where UAPP "forgets" to use the ESS DAC or doesn't use it fully. Specifically:

1) If all flags are left clear under "Settings"->"HiRes Audio"->"HiRes driver flags" (as recommended by the app Dev on the UAPP help page), all PCM files (44k/16 as well as hi-res) will use the ESS DAC as intended (evidenced by the clear difference when toggling the DAC on/off or changing presets on the "Hi-Fi Quad DAC" QuickSettings screen). MQA files will also use the DAC for analog conversion, but not for MQA decoding (evidenced by the "Hi-Fi Quad DAC" QuickSettings screen allowing me to change Presets, instead of giving me the "Cannot apply sound presets to DSD or MQA files" message.) DSD files will fully use the ESS DAC for both decoding and analog conversion (toggling the DAC on/off is audible, and attempts to change Presets gives the "Cannot apply sound presets to DSD or MQA files" message).

2) If the "MQA (V30)" flag is toggled on under "Settings"->"HiRes Audio"->"HiRes driver flags" (and the phone rebooted, as required for UAPP to update its HiRes driver mode), MQA and DSD files will correctly use the ESS DAC for both decoding and analog conversion (giving me the "Cannot apply sound presets to DSD or MQA files" message). Hi-res PCM files (anything beyond 44k/16) will not use the ESS DAC at all. 44k/16 PCM files will use the ESS DAC, but strangely also trigger the "Cannot apply sound presets to DSD or MQA files" message, leading me to believe UAPP may be using the DAC for 16-to-24 bit padding instead of the CPU. If so, that saves battery drain, but prevents DAC presets on 44k/16 files.

3) Toggling on the "Direct PCM" flag in addition to "MQA (V30)" under "Settings"->"HiRes Audio"->"HiRes driver flags" (as recommended in the Opening Post of this thread, again phone rebooted for UAPP to update its HiRes driver mode) causes no change in behavior that I could observe compared to (2) above (i.e. only "MQA (V30)" being on). It is of course entirely possible that it has other effects in audio processing that I have not detected.

4) I tried combining the above with different settings under "Settings"->"HiRes Audio"->"Bit perfect mode" ("Off", "On", "When possible") but saw no change in the above behavior.

5) I also tried (A) wiping app data for UAPP and (B) completely uninstalling/re-installing it from the Play Store (deleting the "Internal Storage/UAPP" directory in between), and again saw no change in the above behavior.

I mean to email the UAPP developer for clarification on these flags, but I really would love to know if other UAPP users are seeing the same on their V30. If others are not seeing the same, I may try to Factory Reset my phone and see if that helps. BTW, I have the T-Mobile V30+ (H932) and am on Nougat 7.1.2. (Oreo 8.0 for T-Mobile just hit the LG Bridge servers, but I am sitting on my hands until I know if it affects possible rootability.)

Being such a newb here, I much apologize if this was discussed somewhere and I missed it. I certainly didn't see it when reading through this thread. I am working my way through the Main V30 thread and am currently on page 57, so admittedly, it could be in there somewhere.

Thank you in advance.

Edit: After yet another test run, I had to update the above list of findings already. So many combinations of settings and files, and sometimes changes don't "take" without reboot, sometimes they do: With default settings (after app wipe or re-install, all HiRes driver flags clear) both PCM and DSD files do use the ESS DAC. It's only MQA files that don't use it for decoding, but does use it for analog conversion. This would indicate that leaving the "MQA (V30)" flag disabled is the most versatile setting. But I suspect that it is also this flag that makes UAPP pad 44k/16-bit files to 44k/24-bit and thus prevents the re-sampling and interpolation that we're trying to avoid. Anyways, this update doesn't change the fact that it's a mess, and no setting plays all file types correctly.

Thanks for the detailed feedback!

Well, things changed significantly from Android 7->8, and, unfortunately, I don't have easy access to test Android 7 anymore. But using only option 2) - just the MQA flag - everything (DSD64, DSD128, PCM 44/16, 96/24, 192/24, 352/24) plays back correctly through my V30's ESS DAC. (BTW, the bit-padding is achieved within the DAC chip via API flags specified in the OS.) Using Android Nougat, I used to have to re-boot my V30 fairly regularly in order to get both Neutron and UAPP to function properly with the ESS DAC after using other music apps. I've barely had to do that at all using the latest Neutron/UAPP versions under Oreo, but there are still some glitches, so if you find any issues, please do report them here and/or send Dmitry or Davy the relevant bug reports and log files.

 

[Dannemand]

Thanks for the detailed feedback!

Well, things changed significantly from Android 7->8, and, unfortunately, I don't have easy access to test Android 7 anymore. But using only option 2) - just the MQA flag - everything (DSD64, DSD128, PCM 44/16, 96/24, 192/24, 352/24) plays back correctly through my V30's ESS DAC. (BTW, the bit-padding is achieved within the DAC chip via API flags specified in the OS.) Using Android Nougat, I used to have to re-boot my V30 fairly regularly in order to get both Neutron and UAPP to function properly with the ESS DAC after using other music apps. I've barely had to do that at all using the latest Neutron/UAPP versions under Oreo, but there are still some glitches, so if you find any issues, please do report them here and/or send Dmitry or Davy the relevant bug reports and log files.

Thank you, as always, for your willingness to respond and help!

If anybody is still on Android 7.x Nougat (I imagine T-Mobile V30 users like myself, since the OTA isn't out yet) I would appreciate tremendously if you could test how UAPP performs on your phone with different audio formats. Specifically: Whether hi-res PCM files still play through the ESS DAC when the "MQA (V30)" flag is set under "Settings"->"HiRes Audio"->"HiRes driver flags".

I analyzed some audio_flinger dumpsys files after making my last post, and I was happy to find that 44k/16 files always play as 44k/24, regardless of HiRes flags and Bit-perfect settings. That matches perfectly with you saying it's done in the DAC, triggered by an API flag. But if not related to the bit-padding, that makes it even more puzzling why I get "Cannot apply sound presets to DSD or MQA files" when playing PCM 44k/16 with the MQA flag on. Do you also get that on Oreo?

Thanks again!

 

[csglinux]

Thank you, as always, for your willingness to respond and help!

If anybody is still on Android 7.x Nougat (I imagine T-Mobile V30 users like myself, since the OTA isn't out yet) I would appreciate tremendously if you could test how UAPP performs on your phone with different audio formats. Specifically: Whether hi-res PCM files still play through the ESS DAC when the "MQA (V30)" flag is set under "Settings"->"HiRes Audio"->"HiRes driver flags".

I analyzed some audio_flinger dumpsys files after making my last post, and I was happy to find that 44k/16 files always play as 44k/24, regardless of HiRes flags and Bit-perfect settings. That matches perfectly with you saying it's done in the DAC, triggered by an API flag. But if not related to the bit-padding, that makes it even more puzzling why I get "Cannot apply sound presets to DSD or MQA files" when playing PCM 44k/16 with the MQA flag on. Do you also get that on Oreo?

Thanks again!

I think you've won the prize for finding a little bug in UAPP I have the same issues in Oreo with the sound presets bring unavailable for 44/16 playback. I've sent an email to Davy. I'm sure this will be fixed shortly.

 

[Dannemand]

I think you've won the prize for finding a little bug in UAPP I have the same issues in Oreo with the sound presets bring unavailable for 44/16 playback. I've sent an email to Davy. I'm sure this will be fixed shortly.

Thank you for checking. Yeah, yeah, I get the wink

But I am not really much concerned about being unable to change Presets, just wondering why PCM 44k/16 triggers DSD/MQA mode in the DAC. And my real problem is obviously that I cannot play hi-res PCM files (beyond 44k/16) through the ESS DAC when the MQA flag is set. That's why I would love to hear from others if they see the same -- before I go the long route of Factory Resetting my phone.

Thanks again.

 

[alota]

Strange. I have oreo and a 16/44 file is still 16/44 at the output

 

[csglinux]

Strange. I have oreo and a 16/44 file is still 16/44 at the output

You're using UAPP with the hi-res direct driver flag set?

 

[Dannemand]

Strange. I have oreo and a 16/44 file is still 16/44 at the output

If you mean on the UAPP Now Playing screen it says Direct: 44100Hz - File: 44100Hz 16bit, then yes, it won't display the fact that it is actually playing it as 44/24. It doesn't display the bit-depth at which it plays ("Direct: ...") only the sampling rate.

But at least on my phone, I saw clearly in the audio_flinger dumpsys files that it does indeed play as 44/24, regardless of my HiRes driver flag settings -- as long as I use the HiRes driver.

Spoiler: UAPP playing PCM 44/16 - notice the bolded lines

Output thread 0xeb8f9000 type 1 (DIRECT):
Thread name: AudioOut_6D
I/O handle: 109
TID: 13667
Standby: no
Sample rate: 44100 Hz
HAL frame count: 1792
HAL format: 0x6 (pcm24)
HAL buffer size: 10752 bytes
Channel count: 2
Channel mask: 0x00000003 (front-left, front-right)
Processing format: 0x6 (pcm24)
Processing frame size: 6 bytes
Pending config events: none
Output device: 0x8 (WIRED_HEADPHONE)
Input device: 0 (NONE)
Audio source: 0 (default)
Normal frame count: 1792
Last write occurred (msecs): 36
Total writes: 2708
Delayed writes: 0
Blocked in write: yes
Suspend count: 0
Sink buffer : 0xea2a7000
Mixer buffer: 0xea2cc000
Effect buffer: 0xeb173800
Fast track availMask=0xfe
Standby delay ns=1000000000
AudioStreamOut: 0xec983348 flags 0x2001 (DIRECT|0x2000)
Frames written: 4852736
Suspended frames: 0

Spoiler: LG Music app playing PCM 44/16 - notice the bolded lines

Output thread 0xf4303700 type 0 (MIXER):
Thread name: AudioOut_1D
I/O handle: 29
TID: 1550
Standby: yes
Sample rate: 48000 Hz
HAL frame count: 768
HAL format: 0x1 (pcm16)
HAL buffer size: 3072 bytes
Channel count: 2
Channel mask: 0x00000003 (front-left, front-right)
Processing format: 0x5 (pcmfloat)
Processing frame size: 8 bytes
Pending config events: none
Output device: 0 (NONE)
Input device: 0 (NONE)
Audio source: 0 (default)
Normal frame count: 1152
Last write occurred (msecs): 520843
Total writes: 0
Delayed writes: 0
Blocked in write: no
Suspend count: 0
Sink buffer : 0xf4965800
Mixer buffer: 0xf4963000
Effect buffer: 0xf51dc400
Fast track availMask=0xfe
Standby delay ns=3000000000
AudioStreamOut: 0xf5ba5688 flags 0 (NONE)

 

[alota]

If you mean on the UAPP Now Playing screen it says Direct: 44100Hz - File: 44100Hz 16bit, then yes, it won't display the fact that it is actually playing it as 44/24. It doesn't display the bit-depth at which it plays ("Direct: ...") only the sampling rate.

But at least on my phone, I saw clearly in the audio_flinger dumpsys files that it does indeed play as 44/24, regardless of my HiRes driver flag settings -- as long as I use the HiRes driver.

Spoiler: UAPP playing PCM 44/16 - notice the bolded lines

Output thread 0xeb8f9000 type 1 (DIRECT):
Thread name: AudioOut_6D
I/O handle: 109
TID: 13667
Standby: no
Sample rate: 44100 Hz
HAL frame count: 1792
HAL format: 0x6 (pcm24)
HAL buffer size: 10752 bytes
Channel count: 2
Channel mask: 0x00000003 (front-left, front-right)
Processing format: 0x6 (pcm24)
Processing frame size: 6 bytes
Pending config events: none
Output device: 0x8 (WIRED_HEADPHONE)
Input device: 0 (NONE)
Audio source: 0 (default)
Normal frame count: 1792
Last write occurred (msecs): 36
Total writes: 2708
Delayed writes: 0
Blocked in write: yes
Suspend count: 0
Sink buffer : 0xea2a7000
Mixer buffer: 0xea2cc000
Effect buffer: 0xeb173800
Fast track availMask=0xfe
Standby delay ns=1000000000
AudioStreamOut: 0xec983348 flags 0x2001 (DIRECT|0x2000)
Frames written: 4852736
Suspended frames: 0

Spoiler: LG Music app playing PCM 44/16 - notice the bolded lines

Output thread 0xf4303700 type 0 (MIXER):
Thread name: AudioOut_1D
I/O handle: 29
TID: 1550
Standby: yes
Sample rate: 48000 Hz
HAL frame count: 768
HAL format: 0x1 (pcm16)
HAL buffer size: 3072 bytes
Channel count: 2
Channel mask: 0x00000003 (front-left, front-right)
Processing format: 0x5 (pcmfloat)
Processing frame size: 8 bytes
Pending config events: none
Output device: 0 (NONE)
Input device: 0 (NONE)
Audio source: 0 (default)
Normal frame count: 1152
Last write occurred (msecs): 520843
Total writes: 0
Delayed writes: 0
Blocked in write: no
Suspend count: 0
Sink buffer : 0xf4965800
Mixer buffer: 0xf4963000
Effect buffer: 0xf51dc400
Fast track availMask=0xfe
Standby delay ns=3000000000
AudioStreamOut: 0xf5ba5688 flags 0 (NONE)

really thanks. in my ignorance i thought that the file arrived original to the dac