[betula]

Don't have your LP, but am using the LCD2C currently. I prefer them with warmer tubes. If you want some recommendations let me know.

Thanks, but I don't think another tube can solve my issues with the LP. Tubes are for fine tuning.

 

[betula]

I've heard them.

I prerfer the LP.

*shrug*

DAC matters a LOT. But at the end of the day we all have different preferences. Different music, different sound. What we share is the love of music and sound quality.

 

[sahmen]

I am not keeping the Liquid Platinum. Here is why.

I don't know too many budget amps (under $500), but I imagine the LP is better than most of them. I think it still is a great option for the US retail price, considering the potential of tube rolling.
Importing to Europe (£790) starts to seriously question the price/performance ratio especially if you look at the secondhand market.

I have tested the LP against my CMA600i and against the iFi Pro iCan. The truth in a nutshell is that both the CMA600i and the Pro iCan are in a different league compared to the LP. (DACs used are the 2Qute and the Pro iDSD)

LP has a nice, liquid sound. Very sophisticated, very delicate. Very detailed. Details are on pair with the two other amps. Vocals are as nice as they are on the 600i and better than on the Pro iCAN.

My biggest problem with the LP vs. these two other amps is that it just sounds thin. Too delicate, too polite. Nice, nuanced amp, but there is no meat on the bones. Perhaps the most neutral from the bunch and surprisingly the least tuby sounding. (Except iCAN in SS mode.) Even my CMA600i has a smoother and more rounded, richer sound. My other big problem with the LP apart from the relatively lean sound is the weakness of the bass. It is just not there, neither in quantity, nor in quality compared to the two other amps. The LP is definitely a mid-centric amp and while it does midrange beautifully, seriously lacks in the bass department. Treble is also less pronounced, however it is quite clear that helps with detail retrieval.

I know, it is somewhat unfair to compare the LP to more expensive amps. It is still quite a good option for US retail price, especially if someone is into acoustic, vocal or classical music. However I wouldn't recommend the LP for EDM at all due to the relatively anaemic bass compared to dynamic SS amps.

I was surprised, how much more tuby the CMA600i (current amplification) sounds. More rounded, richer, smoother, fuller, better texture. Keep in mind, the 600i's DAC is quite useless. You need to pair it with a good DAC. (See above.)

I don't want to trash the LP as it is indeed a nice, delicate, very refined amp for the price. But don't fool yourself that it offers a top shelf performance for the fraction of the price.

This is my 2 cents on the LP. It is a good amp for the price if you are into vocals and acoustic music, but won't replace your higher-end amps.

^^^Interesting impressions, but could you tell us a little more about the components deployed in each of the chains you have compared here? Without meaning to suggest that you are misrepresenting things as you personally experienced them, I wonder whether you can reveal more about the components in each of the chains (source==DAC==Amp==HP and even the cable used with the HP, and whether you were listening in "balanced" or "SE" mode in each case). I am asking, because what I find interesting in your impressions is just how much some aspects of them differ from my own experiences. I refer mostly to your complaint about what you are calling the "thinness" of the LP's sound, the lack of "meat" on the bones of its sound, and its "anaemic" bass etc etc.

Personally, I run two chains side by side, so to speak:

Chain #1 is :Metrum Ambre (Roon) ==>> Metrum Onyx DAC ==LP ==>> (hifiman he 1000, Audeze LCD-X, LCDi4, MX4, Sennheiser HD-800, and others, with Norne Draug v3 and Silvergarde aftermarket, and sometimes, stock cables)...

What I find in this particular chain, is not an LP which is one-sidedly thin or anaemic, but an amp which reacts quite sensitively to all its surrounding components, including even the type of cables one is using at a particular time (we could also go into the rabbit hole of tubes and tube rolling, but let's leave that aside for now)... So sometimes I get "polite" and "ethereal" (I wouldn't say thin or lean), and sometimes I get full thick mids, and big thumping low-ends, and various shades of "grey" in between. I find that it all depends on the source content and surrounding components... I guess the clichéd expression I am looking for is "System Synergy," and I do get a variety of sound sigs/flavors from that chain.

Full disclosure: I also have a system deployed in parallel to the above one, as I mentioned earlier:

Sonore Ultrarendu (Roon) ==>> Schiit Yggdrasil A2 ==>> Violectric V281 ==>> (+Any or all the headphones listed in chain #1 above). Sometimes, I enjoy going back and forth between the two chains and savoring the differences (subtle and not so subtle) and similarities I can monitor between the two... There are interesting differences between the two rigs, that i cannot go into here. Let me just say that I have not particularly noticed the difference between "thin mids/weak bass" and "full/meaty mids/non-anaemic bass", that you have pointed to in your impressions.

Of course YMMV, and I am not making any accusations here, in asking these questions... I am just looking for insight and enlightenment.,

 

[Rattle]

I'd like to hear those 2x as expensive amps with proper recordings that are non compressed and have analog origins

 

[betula]

^^^Interesting impressions, but could you tell us a little more about the components deployed in each of the chains you have compared here? Without meaning to suggest that you are misrepresenting things as you personally experienced them, I wonder whether you can reveal more about the components in each of the chains (source==DAC==Amp==HP and even the cable used with the HP, and whether you were listening in "balanced" or "SE" mode in each case). I am asking, because what I find interesting in your impressions is just how much some aspects of them differ from my own experiences. I refer mostly to your complaint about what your are calling the "thinness" of the LP's sound, the lack of "meat" on the bones of its sound, and its "anaemic" bass etc etc.

Personally, I run to chains side by side so to speak:

Chain #1 is :Metrum Ambre (Roon) ==>> Metrum Onyx DAC ==LP ==>> (hifiman he 1000, Audeze LCD-X, LCDi4, MX4, Sennheiser HD-800, and others, with Norne Draug v3 and Silvergarde aftermarket, and sometimes, stock cables)...

What I find in this particular chain, is not an LP which is one-sidedly thin or anaemic, but an amp which reacts quite sensitively to all its surrounding components, including even the type of cables one is using at a particular time... So sometimes I get "polite" and "ethereal" (I wouldn't say thin or lean), and sometimes I get full thick mids, and big thumping low-ends, and various shades of "grey" in between. I find that it all depends on the source content and surrounding components... I guess the clichéd word I am looking for is "Synergy," and I do get a variety of sound sigs/flavors from that chain.

Full disclosure: I also have a system deployed in parallel to the above one, as I mentioned earlier:

Sonore Ultrarendu (Roon) ==>> Schiit Yggdrasil A2 ==>> Violectric V281 ==>> (+Any or all the headphones listed in chain #1 above). Sometimes, I enjoy going back and forth between the two chains and savoring the differences (subtle and not so subtle) and similarities I can monitor between the two... There are interesting differences between the two rigs, that i cannot go into here. Let me just say that I have not particularly noticed the difference between "thin mids/weak bass" and "full/meaty mids/non-anaemic bass", that you have pointed to in your impressions.

Of course YMMV, and I am not making any accusations here, in asking these questions... I am just looking for insight and enlightenment.,

I happily go into such discussions as these can be beneficial for all.
As I said before most of my listening was done with my Audeze LCD2C. I used balanced mode with all amps, I have got a 4pin Toxic Silver Widow cable with my 2Cs.

LP is definitely a very transparent amp, meaning it won't add much personality to the sound. It lets other components of the hi-fi chain to shine through.

What I find obvious is the texture, thickness, body to the sound which was much leaner with the LP compared to the 600i or Pro iCan. And a more robust and layered bass response vs the LP's politeness.

 

[Wes S]

I dont think i could physically handle a more layered or robust bass response, than what i am getting with the LP. Damn, those amps must literally shake your brain!

 

[betula]

I dont think i could physically handle a more layered or robust bass response, than what i am getting with the LP. Damn, those amps must literally shake your brain!

They do, especially the iCAN. The 600i is somewhere half-way there. You never know there is higher up unless you try. This is the beauty and curse of this hobby. Don't try gear that you can't afford is my motto. Which I try to keep myself to with more or less success. Usually less than more success. Wallet suffers a lot these days.

 

[LCMusicLover]

Thanks, but I don't think another tube can solve my issues with the LP. Tubes are for fine tuning.

My ears think you are mistaken. I was unimpressed with LP w/ stock tubes which to my ears produced a somewhat thin, dry presentation. The minute I swapped in my Gold Lions, my opinion was reversed. Amperex PQ and Siemens NOS E88CC continued the progression to a sound somewhat on the meatier side of neutral. While not a huge difference, to my ears the changes were still transformative.

In addition, saying those amps are 'in a different league' suggests they are 'much better' (whatever that means). What I read from you post is more about 'different' rather than 'better'.

That said, if your ears are happy with your other amps, then good for you.

 

[Rattle]

I dont think i could physically handle a more layered or robust bass response, than what i am getting with the LP. Damn, those amps must literally shake your brain!

I guess that's what you'd want if you listened to EDM/brickwalled basshead recordings...

 

[betula]

My ears think you are mistaken. I was unimpressed with LP w/ stock tubes which to my ears produced a somewhat thin, dry presentation. The minute I swapped in my Gold Lions, my opinion was reversed. Amperex PQ and Siemens NOS E88CC continued the progression to a sound somewhat on the meatier side of neutral. While not a huge difference, to my ears the changes were still transformative.

In addition, saying those amps are 'in a different league' suggests they are 'much better' (whatever that means). What I read from you post is more about 'different' rather than 'better'.

That said, if your ears are happy with your other amps, then good for you.

Well, better for my ears. Much better.
More convincing, more authoritative sound with better extension both to low-end and treble. Better, more lifelike and thicker texture, overall more enjoyable.
I haven't tried the LP with other tubes but I believe an amp should give a good picture of its capabilities with stock tubes.
To my ears it was no contest between these three amps (using stock tubes with the LP).

 

[ls13coco]

They do, especially the iCAN. The 600i is somewhere half-way there. You never know there is higher up unless you try. This is the beauty and curse of this hobby. Don't try gear that you can't afford is my motto. Which I try to keep myself to with more or less success. Usually less than more success. Wallet suffers a lot these days.

Interesting read, the LP is the most expensive amp/dac component that I plan to buy so I do appreciate reading your views. I am wondering if you have thoughts of the LP having used with other headphones too?
I recently got the LCD-2c and I am very much impressed/in-love with it, and I find the bass to be even more impressive than with the x00 PurpleHeart (though the PH does seem punchier).
Does this mean you may have a LP for sale soon?? Lol

 

[betula]

Interesting read, the LP is the most expensive amp/dac component that I plan to buy so I do appreciate reading your views. I am wondering if you have thoughts of the LP having used with other headphones too?
I recently got the LCD-2c and I am very much impressed/in-love with it, and I find the bass to be even more impressive than with the x00 PurpleHeart (though the PH does seem punchier).
Does this mean you may have a LP for sale soon?? Lol

Returning to Amazon USA from UK. Unless you are in Europe it is not worth it for you. 2C kills X00 indeed.

 

[ls13coco]

Returning to Amazon USA from UK. Unless you are in Europe it is not worth it for you. 2C kills X00 indeed.

Fair, I just know I am not pulling the trigger at its current retail price as I watched it jump from 6-odd hundred to $769. Canadian dollar is too poor right now to be comfortable with that!

Did you find much useable adjustment of the volume paired with the 2c? (asking due to the complaints of high-gain)

 

[LCMusicLover]

...I believe an amp should give a good picture of its capabilities with stock tubes...

Don’t want to start a religious argument, but I believe the stock tubes are quite ‘vin ordinaire’, and do NOT give a good picture...

...To my ears it was no contest between these three amps (using stock tubes with the LP).

This

 

[betula]

Fair, I just know I am not pulling the trigger at its current retail price as I watched it jump from 6-odd hundred to $769. Canadian dollar is too poor right now to be comfortable with that!

Did you find much useable adjustment of the volume paired with the 2c? (asking due to the complaints of high-gain)

Funny enough regardless the different output power of the three amps I set the volume on all of them between 10-11 o'clock.
LP is said to output 3.6W, the iCan is a monster outputting 14W (yes, fourteen), the 600i offers just under 2W at 70Ω, all of them balanced. The 600i is a bit different though, as it has current amplification instead of voltage amplification which means its driving capabilities are much higher than the output power would suggest.
So yes, it was an interesting experiment and the conclusion is: numbers help only to some extent. The real try of a pie is eating.