[devilboy]

Care to elaborate in the slightest?

Ok.
It sounded unfocused...blurry. Bass wasn't tight or articulate. It was flabby and loose.
Highs didn't seem extended enough and overall just sounded generic.
Judging by the overwhelmingly positive opinions on the headphone I'm assuming it was the amplification.

 

[sahmen]

I heard the Tungsten at the Florida Audio Expo last weekend. It was driven by a Black Ice Audio headphone amp (Aries?) and also Black Ice loudspeaker integrated amplifier from it's binding posts. I wasn't impressed at all. Mediocre at best.

Were you able to determine whether that mediocrity was being produced by the tungsten itself or by some weak link in the chain that was driving it, say the amp, for example? I ask because it is now well known that the Tungsten cannot shine if it is not properly driven.

 

[sahmen]

Ok.
It sounded unfocused...blurry. Bass wasn't tight or articulate. It was flabby and loose.
Highs didn't seem extended enough and overall just sounded generic.
Judging by the overwhelmingly positive opinions on the headphone I'm assuming it was the amplification.

Sounds like you read my mind, as you answered my question as I was typing it.

 

[psy472]

At this point, I’d figured we just use any amp that can drive the Susvara as benchmark for the Tungsten. Anything less seems to be inadequate. My MJ3 will be fine where it is.

I tried preamping my MJ3 to my Jot2 (due to the high Watt output on Jot2) and the bass slam almost blew my ears off. The sound was a bit more veiled but the details were much better than the Jot2 by itself.

 

[goldwerger]

Ok.
It sounded unfocused...blurry. Bass wasn't tight or articulate. It was flabby and loose.
Highs didn't seem extended enough and overall just sounded generic.
Judging by the overwhelmingly positive opinions on the headphone I'm assuming it was the amplification.

If this is the amp you used - https://blackiceaudio.com/headphone-amplifiers/p/black-ice-glassfx-headphoneamp - its specs suggest it produces 80 mW @ 32 ohm

That’s perhaps one of the weakest amps on the market, and would be suitable only for very sensitive headphones (or IEMs if it has low noise floor).

I’m surprised anyone would use this amp to demo the Tungsten, or any headphone in show conditions - there is no way you heard anything except distortion.. sorry man

 

[Blejzeros]

I think it's this one.
https://blackiceaudio.com/aries/p/ariesaxpona

 

[goldwerger]

I think it's this one.
https://blackiceaudio.com/aries/p/ariesaxpona

No power specs, I guess it’s new or undisclosed(?). Unusual to see an amp listed for sale without power specs, don’t know them so can’t offer insight perhaps someone else here does

 

[BeardSplinter]

I had the pleasure of enjoying two different DS Tungsten setups last weekend.
Wandla - Galion TS120
Bi-frost 2/64 - Violectric v280

I also got to play around and try one pair on:

• Woo Tube Mini - loud enough volume wise to enjoy maxed out, but rather flat staging and flat dynamics.
• Questyle M15 - same as above. Also really hard to even tell the coloration differences from Woo mini
• Hiby RS8 > Topping A90D - High Gain at 77-81 on volume I was good with the exception of LFE think 808 or Timpany/Organ range low frequencies. It would start to choke, although, distortion wasn't super apparent I know it was happening.

I think the thing people need to keep in mind about the amp discussion is not all music is recorded at the same levels, dynamics and average level within your own preferences/library will play a big role in what you need. Just know that when you need that hit your amp will need that voltage.

Also does anyone know if planar like Tungsten can have an inductance curve similar to dynamics?
Likewise, is it possible that amp output resistance can magnify the voltage needs if the above is or isnt true?

 

[c34webb]

Zoes was asked if the Aries powers the Tungsten and he said "it gets damn close". I take that as a no. Either it powers them to full dynamics or it doesn't, all amps will make noise.

 

[staticosaur]

I would like to share why I am not going to order the Tungstens after months of personally being hyped and wanting to own them. The key reason is that I cannot hear them at a dealer in Europe to see if they are worth buying.

The background for changing my mind:
I am listening to metal and rock music and have been on the hobby for about 5 years.
I went to an auditioning event at a local shop and heard a wide range of HPs- some I have heard before, but overall this was a more extensive experience at good listening conditions. Coming from LCD-X and Audio-GD D28.38, I expected to hear significant improvements from flagship models. I did not… This makes me both happy as I do not have to break the bank and disappointed at the same time, as it feels like it will be some time until I find something else worth buying, while I actually really want that.

Susvara was mediocre out of Viva Egoista 845. Tried it out of Violectric V590. Sounded similar. It drove it without issues and I listened around 1-2 o’clock. Cannot understand why it costs so much.

Preferred LCD-3 way more out of V590.
LCD-3 sounded better on Trafomatic Head 2. 20% more texture, bass, lush mids and soundstage.
Empyrean 2 sounded way better than Susvara out of V590. Empyrean 2 sounded about 10% better in most aspects compared to LCD-3, perhaps without mids. Not sure whether I prefer Empyrean 2 or LCD3 overall.
LCD-3 was just a notch better than my LCD-X out of Trafomatic Head 2.
LCD-X had no meaningful difference out of Audio-GD, Trafomatic Head 2 or Feliks Euforia.
Empyrean 2 had about 20% more detail, especially in the highs out of Nimbus in comparison to V590.
Empyrean 2 sounded a bit better overall than Elite- 10% or so.
Final D8000 Pro out of Nimbus was interesting in the mids, but not impressive overall and lacking clarity in bass.
HE1000se was slightly under Empyrean 2 across the board, about 10%.
MM-500 sounded similar to LCD-X with a bit annoying peak around 3k in comparison.
LCD-2 was clearly lower end compared to the other LCDs mentioned here- 25% or so.
LCD-5 was clearly faster than LCD-X, but I disliked everything else about it.
Focal Utopia (previous version) - I preferred it less than LCD-X / LCD-3.
DAVE and rest of the insanely priced DACs did not offer anything I could hear in comparison to Audio-GD D28.38 or NFB11.38.

Corina and CNBR were my first electrostats experience. They were very boring sounding in comparison with all headphones above.

I will not spend money on anything currently available that I have heard, because compared to what I already have, all this gear provides very little difference that I can hear to my music preference even when recordings are done very well. I have still not heard a lot, e.g Abyss, Stax and ZMF. I remain hopeful that Tungsten will change my perspective, by providing new and significantly better experience and I look forward to trying it in the local market.

Hope this helps others. My recommendation is to try and decide for yourselves before buying.

Happy listening.

 

[Slackaveli]

At this point, I’d figured we just use any amp that can drive the Susvara as benchmark for the Tungsten. Anything less seems to be inadequate. My MJ3 will be fine where it is.

I tried preamping my MJ3 to my Jot2 (due to the high Watt output on Jot2) and the bass slam almost blew my ears off. The sound was a bit more veiled but the details were much better than the Jot2 by itself.

Have you tried it the other way around with the Jot2 pre-amping the Mjolnir3? Bc if that works you'd still get that sweetness from the Mjolnir3 that Ive heard people say is kind of lost when you pre-amp with the MJ3.
Although maybe Jot2 retains that better than whatever amp dude was using. idr.

 

[Slackaveli]

I think it's this one.
https://blackiceaudio.com/aries/p/ariesaxpona

maybe the 'sub bass' dial was turned down or something lol.

 

[Slackaveli]

I would like to share why I am not going to order the Tungstens after months of personally being hyped and wanting to own them. The key reason is that I cannot hear them at a dealer in Europe to see if they are worth buying.

The background for changing my mind:
I am listening to metal and rock music and have been on the hobby for about 5 years.
I went to an auditioning event at a local shop and heard a wide range of HPs- some I have heard before, but overall this was a more extensive experience at good listening conditions. Coming from LCD-X and Audio-GD D28.38, I expected to hear significant improvements from flagship models. I did not… This makes me both happy as I do not have to break the bank and disappointed at the same time, as it feels like it will be some time until I find something else worth buying, while I actually really want that.

Susvara was mediocre out of Viva Egoista 845. Tried it out of Violectric V590. Sounded similar. It drove it without issues and I listened around 1-2 o’clock. Cannot understand why it costs so much.

Preferred LCD-3 way more out of V590.
LCD-3 sounded better on Trafomatic Head 2. 20% more texture, bass, lush mids and soundstage.
Empyrean 2 sounded way better than Susvara out of V590. Empyrean 2 sounded about 10% better in most aspects compared to LCD-3, perhaps without mids. Not sure whether I prefer Empyrean 2 or LCD3 overall.
LCD-3 was just a notch better than my LCD-X out of Trafomatic Head 2.
LCD-X had no meaningful difference out of Audio-GD, Trafomatic Head 2 or Feliks Euforia.
Empyrean 2 had about 20% more detail, especially in the highs out of Nimbus in comparison to V590.
Empyrean 2 sounded a bit better overall than Elite- 10% or so.
Final D8000 Pro out of Nimbus was interesting in the mids, but not impressive overall and lacking clarity in bass.
HE1000se was slightly under Empyrean 2 across the board, about 10%.
MM-500 sounded similar to LCD-X with a bit annoying peak around 3k in comparison.
LCD-2 was clearly lower end compared to the other LCDs mentioned here- 25% or so.
LCD-5 was clearly faster than LCD-X, but I disliked everything else about it.
Focal Utopia (previous version) - I preferred it less than LCD-X / LCD-3.
DAVE and rest of the insanely priced DACs did not offer anything I could hear in comparison to Audio-GD D28.38 or NFB11.38.

Corina and CNBR were my first electrostats experience. They were very boring sounding in comparison with all headphones above.

I will not spend money on anything currently available that I have heard, because compared to what I already have, all this gear provides very little difference that I can hear to my music preference even when recordings are done very well. I have still not heard a lot, e.g Abyss, Stax and ZMF. I remain hopeful that Tungsten will change my perspective, by providing new and significantly better experience and I look forward to trying it in the local market.

Hope this helps others. My recommendation is to try and decide for yourselves before buying.

Happy listening.

Im pretty sure if anything is going to impress you at this point it'd have to be the 1266. Also- your Audio-GD D28 is a beast of a class A amp so Im not surprised you didnt hear much better there- maybe Nimbus.

And, yeah, LCD-X is a great headphone for the money. Probably tops in the <$500 segment.

 

[betula]

I would like to share why I am not going to order the Tungstens after months of personally being hyped and wanting to own them. The key reason is that I cannot hear them at a dealer in Europe to see if they are worth buying.

The background for changing my mind:
I am listening to metal and rock music and have been on the hobby for about 5 years.
I went to an auditioning event at a local shop and heard a wide range of HPs- some I have heard before, but overall this was a more extensive experience at good listening conditions. Coming from LCD-X and Audio-GD D28.38, I expected to hear significant improvements from flagship models. I did not… This makes me both happy as I do not have to break the bank and disappointed at the same time, as it feels like it will be some time until I find something else worth buying, while I actually really want that.

Susvara was mediocre out of Viva Egoista 845. Tried it out of Violectric V590. Sounded similar. It drove it without issues and I listened around 1-2 o’clock. Cannot understand why it costs so much.

Preferred LCD-3 way more out of V590.
LCD-3 sounded better on Trafomatic Head 2. 20% more texture, bass, lush mids and soundstage.
Empyrean 2 sounded way better than Susvara out of V590. Empyrean 2 sounded about 10% better in most aspects compared to LCD-3, perhaps without mids. Not sure whether I prefer Empyrean 2 or LCD3 overall.
LCD-3 was just a notch better than my LCD-X out of Trafomatic Head 2.
LCD-X had no meaningful difference out of Audio-GD, Trafomatic Head 2 or Feliks Euforia.
Empyrean 2 had about 20% more detail, especially in the highs out of Nimbus in comparison to V590.
Empyrean 2 sounded a bit better overall than Elite- 10% or so.
Final D8000 Pro out of Nimbus was interesting in the mids, but not impressive overall and lacking clarity in bass.
HE1000se was slightly under Empyrean 2 across the board, about 10%.
MM-500 sounded similar to LCD-X with a bit annoying peak around 3k in comparison.
LCD-2 was clearly lower end compared to the other LCDs mentioned here- 25% or so.
LCD-5 was clearly faster than LCD-X, but I disliked everything else about it.
Focal Utopia (previous version) - I preferred it less than LCD-X / LCD-3.
DAVE and rest of the insanely priced DACs did not offer anything I could hear in comparison to Audio-GD D28.38 or NFB11.38.

Corina and CNBR were my first electrostats experience. They were very boring sounding in comparison with all headphones above.

I will not spend money on anything currently available that I have heard, because compared to what I already have, all this gear provides very little difference that I can hear to my music preference even when recordings are done very well. I have still not heard a lot, e.g Abyss, Stax and ZMF. I remain hopeful that Tungsten will change my perspective, by providing new and significantly better experience and I look forward to trying it in the local market.

Hope this helps others. My recommendation is to try and decide for yourselves before buying.

Happy listening.

Two thoughts:
1, you might just be lucky/unlucky (depending on the perspective) and saved a lot of money for yourself.
2, it is often nearly impossible to get a good sense of how some new gear sounds on crowded/busy auditioning events, where you spend a few minutes with this and a few minutes with that trying dozens of things after one another. You often need to spend at least a couple of hours (if not days) with new stuff to fully appreciate what they are capable of doing, and then when you go back to your old gear, you suddenly hear them inferior.

 

[goldwerger]

I would like to share why I am not going to order the Tungstens after months of personally being hyped and wanting to own them. The key reason is that I cannot hear them at a dealer in Europe to see if they are worth buying.

The background for changing my mind:
I am listening to metal and rock music and have been on the hobby for about 5 years.
I went to an auditioning event at a local shop and heard a wide range of HPs- some I have heard before, but overall this was a more extensive experience at good listening conditions. Coming from LCD-X and Audio-GD D28.38, I expected to hear significant improvements from flagship models. I did not… This makes me both happy as I do not have to break the bank and disappointed at the same time, as it feels like it will be some time until I find something else worth buying, while I actually really want that.

Susvara was mediocre out of Viva Egoista 845. Tried it out of Violectric V590. Sounded similar. It drove it without issues and I listened around 1-2 o’clock. Cannot understand why it costs so much.

Preferred LCD-3 way more out of V590.
LCD-3 sounded better on Trafomatic Head 2. 20% more texture, bass, lush mids and soundstage.
Empyrean 2 sounded way better than Susvara out of V590. Empyrean 2 sounded about 10% better in most aspects compared to LCD-3, perhaps without mids. Not sure whether I prefer Empyrean 2 or LCD3 overall.
LCD-3 was just a notch better than my LCD-X out of Trafomatic Head 2.
LCD-X had no meaningful difference out of Audio-GD, Trafomatic Head 2 or Feliks Euforia.
Empyrean 2 had about 20% more detail, especially in the highs out of Nimbus in comparison to V590.
Empyrean 2 sounded a bit better overall than Elite- 10% or so.
Final D8000 Pro out of Nimbus was interesting in the mids, but not impressive overall and lacking clarity in bass.
HE1000se was slightly under Empyrean 2 across the board, about 10%.
MM-500 sounded similar to LCD-X with a bit annoying peak around 3k in comparison.
LCD-2 was clearly lower end compared to the other LCDs mentioned here- 25% or so.
LCD-5 was clearly faster than LCD-X, but I disliked everything else about it.
Focal Utopia (previous version) - I preferred it less than LCD-X / LCD-3.
DAVE and rest of the insanely priced DACs did not offer anything I could hear in comparison to Audio-GD D28.38 or NFB11.38.

Corina and CNBR were my first electrostats experience. They were very boring sounding in comparison with all headphones above.

I will not spend money on anything currently available that I have heard, because compared to what I already have, all this gear provides very little difference that I can hear to my music preference even when recordings are done very well. I have still not heard a lot, e.g Abyss, Stax and ZMF. I remain hopeful that Tungsten will change my perspective, by providing new and significantly better experience and I look forward to trying it in the local market.

Hope this helps others. My recommendation is to try and decide for yourselves before buying.

Happy listening.

At the end of the day, trust your ears. Your taste is quite different than mine, but it’s yours. If you find something that gives you joy, that’s all that matters.. this hobby is about enjoying music

Ordering without a demo is always a leap of faith. I ordered my first ZMF before ever getting to demo them at a CanJam. Sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn’t (for those brands, luckily, resale is easy).

Keep having fun!