[matp86]

Has no one here yet heard the Oolong? I have a Havana and an older Orchid. I'm looking to possibly pick up another DAC and had heard good things about the Denafrips Aries II and Pontus II but it sounds like people here have tried them and come back to Mhdt. I actually like the new cabinet aesthetic of the Orchid but do notice it now natively use a 6922 tube. Has anyone here heard the original and current Orchids to compare. I do see the price has dropped from when the new case came out or is that because the tube or chip change? I see it specifies it comes with the S1 chip. did the earlier ones like mine come with the S2? Thanks. David

I have not heard the Oolong personally, but recently had a discussion with a user on here and the Oolong came up. A friend of his owns one and he summarized it as MHDT’s attempt to create something that measures well/ is technically impressive. It appears to be a divergence from the typical house sound. I also contacted Jiun about the characteristics vs. the Pagoda and he responded to say the Oolong has “a more balanced and detailed sound”.

My interpretation: If you are someone that enjoys Chord offerings/ are a detail head, but looking to dip a toe into R2R, this could be a good transition. Otherwise, the Pagoda or Orchid provide the proper MHDT introduction: the wonderfully organic and euphoric sound revered by all except for the clowns at ASR.

The Ares II is excellent. I am listening to one right now with a Pathos Aurium and TH900- extremely pleasing combination. BUT, I can’t help but miss the Pagoda SE and Pagoda Balanced I regretfully sold years ago. The Ares II is the most forward of the R2R DAC’s I have heard to date, but maintains the smoothness that has been converting audiophiles over the last several years.

 

[JerseyD]

Would like to buy an Orchid but worry about my use-case: the dac will live inside a closed cabinet. I know R2R dacs should remain powered on at all times. Is the tube "on" if the unit is powered on, or is it on a separate switch, such that I could leave the unit on, but switch off the tube when not in use. (I can open the cabinet door when unit is in use.). Thanks.

 

[cats4cans]

Would like to buy an Orchid but worry about my use-case: the dac will live inside a closed cabinet. I know R2R dacs should remain powered on at all times. Is the tube "on" if the unit is powered on, or is it on a separate switch, such that I could leave the unit on, but switch off the tube when not in use. (I can open the cabinet door when unit is in use.). Thanks.

I think the leaving it on all the time is more applicable to discrete resistor ladders than the older multibit chips. The Orchid doesn’t generate much heat (even with the tube always on) so inside a cabinet with a little ventilation room should be okay. Leaving it on all the time will definitely shorten tube life though. I only powered it on when using it. There’s a brief warmup cycle. I usually started with casual listening or TV for a half hour before any “critical” listening. Power button is on the front.

 

[David222]

I think the leaving it on all the time is more applicable to discrete resistor ladders than the older multibit chips. The Orchid doesn’t generate much heat (even with the tube always on) so inside a cabinet with a little ventilation room should be okay. Leaving it on all the time will definitely shorten tube life though. I only powered it on when using it. There’s a brief warmup cycle. I usually started with casual listening or TV for a half hour before any “critical” listening. Power button is on the front.

Agreed. Not good to leave Orchid on 24/7. A brief (~30min) warm-up is sufficient. Enjoy.

 

[davidbea]

Agreed. Not good to leave Orchid on 24/7. A brief (~30min) warm-up is sufficient. Enjoy.

I took the plunge and picked up one of the Orchid 69SE’s with the less expensive S1 chips. Initial impressions of a glassy sound and ever so slightly reduced output are mostly gone after some burnin. The specs do indicate a lower voltage output for the 69SE than the original: 2.6 volts vs 3 volts. I note some more detail and a little more natural sound from both the SE and the original compared to the the Havana which is a touch HiFi. All, however, musical and enjoyable. Splitting hairs. First impressions were from my Stax 404 set up.


I'm currently using a 2C51 Western Electric 396a Made in USA tube in the original Orchid. In the upstairs studio room where I have been doing the initial testing I have an iMac feeding the DAC's via USB into a Audio by Van Alstine FET Valve CFR preamplifier/Stax SRM-1/MKII or Stax SRM T-1 and then into Stax 404 ear speakers and Quad 303 into Falcon LS 3/5a speakers set up as desktop speakers. I'm awaiting stands for the Falcons. The Falcons so far have primarily confirmed my impressions of the striking similarity between the original and SE69 Orchid despite the tube difference. I’ve since moved things downstairs to the larger room for further testing.


After none of them standing out upstairs, I moved the DAC set up to the downstairs room: Harbeth M30.1's. Here for reasons I couldn't understand none of them sounded good. Something was missing. I had a cheap powered USB dock feeding three cheap USB cables to the DAC's and selected each in the sound control panel. This morning I thought maybe the set up was degrading the sound, pulled the SE's USB from the dock and plugged it directly into the MacBook Pro. Major improvement! Back to listening to music! Now all are plugged in directly to the Powerbook when listening.


Both Orchids offer increased soundstage depth and separation than the Havana with the edge going probably to the original with the 2C51 Western Electric 396a tube. Strangely the 69SE seems to give more venue information/ air otherwise. It still has the tube that came with it and I haven't yet raised the 'hood' to check. Suggestions for a tube to improve separation in the 69SE?


Thanks.

 

[David222]

I took the plunge and picked up one of the Orchid 69SE’s with the less expensive S1 chips. Initial impressions of a glassy sound and ever so slightly reduced output are mostly gone after some burnin. The specs do indicate a lower voltage output for the 69SE than the original: 2.6 volts vs 3 volts. I note some more detail and a little more natural sound from both the SE and the original compared to the the Havana which is a touch HiFi. All, however, musical and enjoyable. Splitting hairs. First impressions were from my Stax 404 set up.


I'm currently using a 2C51 Western Electric 396a Made in USA tube in the original Orchid. In the upstairs studio room where I have been doing the initial testing I have an iMac feeding the DAC's via USB into a Audio by Van Alstine FET Valve CFR preamplifier/Stax SRM-1/MKII or Stax SRM T-1 and then into Stax 404 ear speakers and Quad 303 into Falcon LS 3/5a speakers set up as desktop speakers. I'm awaiting stands for the Falcons. The Falcons so far have primarily confirmed my impressions of the striking similarity between the original and SE69 Orchid despite the tube difference. I’ve since moved things downstairs to the larger room for further testing.


After none of them standing out upstairs, I moved the DAC set up to the downstairs room: Harbeth M30.1's. Here for reasons I couldn't understand none of them sounded good. Something was missing. I had a cheap powered USB dock feeding three cheap USB cables to the DAC's and selected each in the sound control panel. This morning I thought maybe the set up was degrading the sound, pulled the SE's USB from the dock and plugged it directly into the MacBook Pro. Major improvement! Back to listening to music! Now all are plugged in directly to the Powerbook when listening.


Both Orchids offer increased soundstage depth and separation than the Havana with the edge going probably to the original with the 2C51 Western Electric 396a tube. Strangely the 69SE seems to give more venue information/ air otherwise. It still has the tube that came with it and I haven't yet raised the 'hood' to check. Suggestions for a tube to improve separation in the 69SE?


Thanks.

Glad to hear the Orchid is working for you!

Perhaps consider a DDC vs. going directly from your computer into the DAC. I use a Singxer SU-6 with a Farad Super 3 (LPS).

 

[Pharmaboy]

Glad to hear the Orchid is working for you!

Perhaps consider a DDC vs. going directly from your computer into the DAC. I use a Singxer SU-6 with a Farad Super 3 (LPS).

Exactly what I was going to say. I think a DDC is a good idea for 2 reasons:

• Depending on the DDC's output configuration, you may be able to use a digital coax cable from the DDC to the DAC. I switched to digital coax years ago with my first of 2 SPDIF converters, and the sonic advantage over USB was immediately apparent.
• When I first installed my DDC using the coax output, there was a significant sonic bump just from swapping the SPDIF unit for the DDC. That sold me on DDCs.

My DDC is the Matrix Audio X-SPDIf 2. This unit has the advantage of an IIS output, allowing use of an HDMI cable into a DAC that accepts it. Importantly, the Matrix allows configuration of the IIS pin-out; that gives the user a lot of flexibility for DAC matching.

 

[David222]

Exactly what I was going to say. I think a DDC is a good idea for 2 reasons:

• Depending on the DDC's output configuration, you may be able to use a digital coax cable from the DDC to the DAC. I switched to digital coax years ago with my first of 2 SPDIF converters, and the sonic advantage over USB was immediately apparent.
• When I first installed my DDC using the coax output, there was a significant sonic bump just from swapping the SPDIF unit for the DDC. That sold me on DDCs.

My DDC is the Matrix Audio X-SPDIf 2. This unit has the advantage of an IIS output, allowing use of an HDMI cable into a DAC that accepts it. Importantly, the Matrix allows configuration of the IIS pin-out; that gives the user a lot of flexibility for DAC matching.

Yes, exactly and agree. I do the same, but then utilize AES (out) to my DAC. All the more reason to consider the DDC - lot of optionality.

 

[Pharmaboy]

Yes, exactly and agree. I do the same, but then utilize AES (out) to my DAC. All the more reason to consider the DDC - lot of optionality.

I've never actually owned any component with an AES output or input. I know it exists & is one of the older I/O standards. But I've never heard it for myself.

In your opinion, how does AES cabling compare to digital coax or USB straight into the DAC?

 

[David222]

I've never actually owned any component with an AES output or input. I know it exists & is one of the older I/O standards. But I've never heard it for myself.

In your opinion, how does AES cabling compare to digital coax or USB straight into the DAC?

In my limited experience (with AES) - I find it to be superior (input) vs. coax. However, I would venture to guess the sound (improvement) varies from DAC to DAC.

To be more specific, on my DAC, I find AES noticeably enhances the resolution and instrument separation. The overall timbre seems relatively similar.

 

[Pharmaboy]

In my limited experience (with AES) - I find it to be superior (input) vs. coax. However, I would venture to guess the sound (improvement) varies from DAC to DAC.

To be more specific, on my DAC, I find AES noticeably enhances the resolution and instrument separation. The overall timbre seems relatively similar.

Those DACs listed in your profile are pretty good. If I ever get a DAC that accepts AES, I'll have to look into it.

 

[Loftprojection]

Exactly what I was going to say. I think a DDC is a good idea for 2 reasons:

• Depending on the DDC's output configuration, you may be able to use a digital coax cable from the DDC to the DAC. I switched to digital coax years ago with my first of 2 SPDIF converters, and the sonic advantage over USB was immediately apparent.
• When I first installed my DDC using the coax output, there was a significant sonic bump just from swapping the SPDIF unit for the DDC. That sold me on DDCs.

My DDC is the Matrix Audio X-SPDIf 2. This unit has the advantage of an IIS output, allowing use of an HDMI cable into a DAC that accepts it. Importantly, the Matrix allows configuration of the IIS pin-out; that gives the user a lot of flexibility for DAC matching.

I have the Orchid and usually feed it from a Node2i with optical but this discussion about DDC (didn't know it existed) is interesting because sometimes I feed it directly in USB from my Macbook. I notice a favorable difference when using the Node2i, not so bad but enough to always go back to Node2i as transport when I want ultimate enjoyment. It's better when I use Audirvana then the native Apple Music.

So I'm intrigued by this DDC gyzmo but it's not a few small pennies, this Matrix is $400usd. Maybe great but any of you tried a few different DDC to compare? For example I found the "SMSL PO100 Pro MQA DDC" at less then $100. Many thanks.

 

[JerseyD]

I have the Orchid and usually feed it from a Node2i with optical but this discussion about DDC (didn't know it existed) is interesting because sometimes I feed it directly in USB from my Macbook. I notice a favorable difference when using the Node2i, not so bad but enough to always go back to Node2i as transport when I want ultimate enjoyment. It's better when I use Audirvana then the native Apple Music.

Can't help you about the DDC, but I can say that I have tested optical vs coax digital out of my Node 2i to my DAC and found the coax sounded better. Could be the Node - could be the DAC.

 

[Pharmaboy]

I have the Orchid and usually feed it from a Node2i with optical but this discussion about DDC (didn't know it existed) is interesting because sometimes I feed it directly in USB from my Macbook. I notice a favorable difference when using the Node2i, not so bad but enough to always go back to Node2i as transport when I want ultimate enjoyment. It's better when I use Audirvana then the native Apple Music.

So I'm intrigued by this DDC gyzmo but it's not a few small pennies, this Matrix is $400usd. Maybe great but any of you tried a few different DDC to compare? For example I found the "SMSL PO100 Pro MQA DDC" at less then $100. Many thanks.

I don't know the Node2i, but I have a commonsense suggestion. If the Node allows coax digital output (I know the Orchid allows coax input), simply try a good coax cable between those 2 components w/o changing anything else. If my hunch is correct, you'll prefer coax (I certainly did).

Never heard of this DDC. If reviews on it are decent, worth a try.

 

[davidbea]

After eliminating the powered USB hub I was quite happy with the sound but have ordered a Gustard U16 as someone had suggested. I also have an Acme fuse ordered.