Meier Opera vs Eddie Current EC/SS?

[Blackmore]

I am not argue, just think its funny, playing with words/definitions

Basically when people saying: "Upgrade you source", they mean BUY GOOD QUALITY CD's and not DAC or CDP

Cos usually they mean other way around

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mindless /img/forum/go_quote.gif I have always been under the understanding that the CDP / transport relays the digital information, 1's and 0's, (thus is the source) to the DAC and then into your amplifier and finally out of your speakers / headphones. Indeed, you can't get music through your speakers / headphones unless you have a DAC that converts the digital signal to a analog signal. But, the source of the digital signal is in fact the CD, not the DAC. That's how it works physically and technically, but if someone has a better explanation do enlighten me. And yes Hi-Finthen, your answer was very diplomatic.

 

[finbad]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mindless /img/forum/go_quote.gif I have always been under the understanding that the CDP / transport relays the digital information, 1's and 0's, (thus is the source) to the DAC and then into your amplifier and finally out of your speakers / headphones. Indeed, you can't get music through your speakers / headphones unless you have a DAC that converts the digital signal to a analog signal. But, the source of the digital signal is in fact the CD, not the DAC. That's how it works physically and technically, but if someone has a better explanation do enlighten me. And yes Hi-Finthen, your answer was very diplomatic.

I'll enlighten you as ro my reasoning with my questions then.

You are saying DACs are not sources then, correct?

You are stating only the original holder of the information is the source as well as transport if an outboard DAC is used, correct? And you are saying a DAC is only a DAC even when the original holder of the information has a name change, to being called a transport when a DAC component is placed between the CDP(for instance), and the amplifier which(as we know), can only accept analog information. Correct?

Then why is the CDP then called a transport, as if it needs a new nomenclature if not that the DAC then becomes the analog source for the amplifier, rather than in the previous component implementation. Why change the CDPs nomenclature to that of a transport if not for the reason that it is no longer the source for the amplifier which needs an analog signal and therefore the DAC becomes its source?

I still would like to read your sources in proof of your claim, rather than simply telling eveyone they are wrong due to your understanding.

 

[Mindless]

I have no proof, which is why I said that I've always been under the understanding that the CDP is refered to as the source.

I had a good discussion about the topic after I made my post with a friend of mine and we came to the conclusion that both play an equal part. For example, are your eyes or your brain the source of seeing things? No matter how you twist and turn it, they are both equally responsible.

Anyway, lets not thread hi-jack anymore. I'm also curious in this comparison as I'm about to buy the Opera.

 

[chesebert]

Source is Vin and Amplified signal is Vo, and gain is Vo/Vi

see simple EECS 101.

 

[finbad]

I disagree with your statement and much of the following logic as well as the tone in which it was presented, which I see as being wrong!


Quote:

Originally Posted by Mindless /img/forum/go_quote.gif You got it all wrong (as many others here on Head-Fi). The source is what plays the music, not the DAC that decodes / converts the signal from the source from a analog / digital signal to a digital / analog signal. If you plug it into your computer, your computer is the source because that is where the music originates from. If you plug it into your CDP, that is your source. Even if your CDP / comp is just used as a transport, fact remains that it is still the source.

You are correct, however: When using an outboard digital to analog converter, the transport IS NOT playing music and therefore IS NOT the source of the music, the DAC IS the source of the music! That is why the CDP becomes the transport and the DAC becomes the source, it being in the analog signal form as music, which the amplifier needs for it to amplify! IMO!


I do believe these are expliciet terms which are not arbitrary in their designation and are to be used as such. I suspect you didn't open your "discussion" with your friend telling him he has it all wrong as many on Head-Fi here.

As I said, I don't mind being corrected if wrong but for you to conclude that the terms can be used interchangably in some abstract "shared responsibility" and "playing an equal part" spin, is laughable.

We have here an opportunity for clarity on the use of these terms, as surely there is a correct useage by definition, which I would like to know. If for no other reason so as not to be called "wrong" in the future.

And as for taking the thread off topic, which you did, I don't believe you are going to hear of very many comparisons and I do think my contribution to the thread was useful until I was told I got it all wrong.

Perhaps you are translating from your native language and that is why your tone comes off as being rude to me. Also, perhaps that is why the simple understanding of what is meant by source could also mean the CD itself to you or others perhaps. But to point out others as being "wrong" as well as many on Head-Fi seems arrogant and perhaps not well informed, if after a discussion with a friend you conclude differently somehow.

 

[slwiser]

Getting back to the OPs question, has anyone done a comparison other than Iron_Dreamer?

 

[snoxu]

I just got my Opera in the mail today and had a quick listen with my HD650. I'm using the DAC via USB.

So far I'm a bit disappointed. It's sounds dry. Wonder if the rest of the setup, burn in or maybe the Opera is not my cup of tea.

 

[scrypt]

Quote:

Originally Posted by snoxu /img/forum/go_quote.gif So far I'm a bit disappointed. It's sounds dry. Wonder if the rest of the setup, burn in or maybe the Opera is not my cup of tea.

From Jan M.'s official cob locus:

"The amp is DC-coupled and any capacitors found in the signal path are of the highest quality polypropylen and polystyrol."

This heartfelt utterance (please remove your felt-tipped antennae from Jan's aorta), coupled with posts in which specific burn-in periods were referenced (such as this-'un), suggest you orta allow for festive burn-in time, Peppermint Snox. Even iMods with itty bitty fetus caps need hundreds o' hours o' burn-in to reveal their special sound.

Have patience: You might find yourself savoring that posh Darjeeling yet.

==========================================

Here lies a response to our various definition enthusiasts:

Correct me if I'm dung, but aren't DACs considered sources due to their place in the audio chain, rather than ontological questions as to which came first, the chicken or the cluck? In my humble supplicating may-I-flog-myself-with-your-LOL-cat-whiskers opinion, a source is that from which audio information issues, not pre-audio data. (I've yet to hear a MIDI controller or hardware sequencer referred to as a source.)

In audio engineering, didn't source originally mean the point at which audio signal was first inputted and translated into magnet-speak (as cited from this typical glossary)?:
Quote:

Source -- Input mode on a tape machine where the meters and the output of the machine's electronics will be the signal arriving at the input connector.

(Pity about the unintentionally ambiguous wording. I was under the impression engineers in Detroit hadn't learned syntax in Upper Volta.)

In short (and I am), shouldn't we make a distinction between an audio source and source material (or a point of conceptual origination as Mindless understands it)? M's idea shows thought but seems a butterscotch trifle misleading.

 

[Mindless]

Quote:

Originally Posted by scrypt /img/forum/go_quote.gif In audio engineering, didn't source originally mean the point at which audio signal was first inputted and translated into magnet-speak (as cited from this typical glossary)?: (Pity about the unintentionally ambiguous wording. I was under the impression engineers in Detroit hadn't learned syntax in Upper Volta.) In short (and I am), shouldn't we make a distinction between an audio source and source material (or a point of conceptual origination as Mindless understands it)? M's idea shows thought but seems a butterscotch trifle misleading.

Good point. The definition of source here on Head-Fi seems very vague. I don't know if this is due to the fact that many seem to use computers as source rather than CD players or something else.

Both play equal parts (transport and DAC) in a CDP (or soundcard), but, as you worded it, the conceptual origin of the music is in fact the transport (or the CD if you want to go that far), not the DAC.

I don't think it's misleading, I just think the definition of a source should be made much more clear. Neither is a source by itself, but I would still say the transport is more so than the DAC, no matter how paradoxal or contradictive that may sound.

 

[tbonner1]

Any more comments for the Opera or ECSS?

 

[finbad]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mindless /img/forum/go_quote.gif Good point. The definition of source here on Head-Fi seems very vague. I don't know if this is due to the fact that many seem to use computers as source rather than CD players or something else. Both play equal parts (transport and DAC) in a CDP (or soundcard), but, as you worded it, the conceptual origin of the music is in fact the transport (or the CD if you want to go that far), not the DAC. I don't think it's misleading, I just think the definition of a source should be made much more clear. Neither is a source by itself, but I would still say the transport is more so than the DAC, no matter how paradoxal or contradictive that may sound.

Again, you're wrong!

There is no music on the CD just data 1 / 0 bitstream which only becomes music after the DAC transforms this data into an analogue signal as music, the component which does this is the source of the analogue signal needed for the amplifier to amplify! If an outboard DAC is used it is that source, and the components feeding it a digital bitstream signal is the transport!!!

You have confused the issue by calling each component by ambiguous terms as each being the source, other than the DAC, which you state, is only a DAC and NOT a source, at least in your first explaination. Perhaps "your friend" corrected you on this, or do you still hold this misunderstanding?



BTW, I asked before, are you as your profile states, from Sweden, and therefore perhaps translating your understanding and therefore perhaps that is part of the issue?

 

[Mindless]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hi-Finthen /img/forum/go_quote.gif BTW, I asked before, are you as your profile states, from Sweden, and therefore perhaps translating your understanding and therefore perhaps that is part of the issue?

Yes and I didn't answer because I don't feel the language barrier.

Of course there isn't music on the CD, neither did I say there was. If I did, by all means quote me.

Again, neither by itself is a source (in my opinion) but I would say that the CD is more source to the music than the DAC. Interpret that as you will. That is my perception (and understanding) of the process.

 

[velogreg]

....... still, I would like to know if anyone has compared the Corda Opera to the EC/SS? Anyone?

 

[The Burn Pt.2]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mindless /img/forum/go_quote.gif Yes and I didn't answer because I don't feel the language barrier. Of course there isn't music on the CD, neither did I say there was. If I did, by all means quote me. Again, neither by itself is a source (in my opinion) but I would say that the CD is more source to the music than the DAC. Interpret that as you will. That is my perception (and understanding) of the process.

If the transport is a source then what is a dac? What is a transport then? What is a cd then?

music is source material
transport is what outputs digital signal
dac is the source of the analog signal
which in turn is then amplified by the amplifier
which then is converted into sound by the headphone
which finally reverberates inside your mindless head.

lol just had to stick your nick in there somehow