anyone here upgraded to W4? curious if its worth it to go from w2-131
Luxury & Precision (LP) Portable USB DAC/AMP W1 and W2 (The new W2-131 Version is Available, Related Info on Post #1)
- Thread starter bluestorm1992
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I had W2 from the begging and upgraded to w4 when it came out. Definitely worth it for me. Everything sound is 7-10% improved, and then is the extra power on balance and very little power consumption. I am happy with it.
Andrew_WOT
Headphoneus Supremus
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W4 is smoother and more delicate, W2 sounds harsher and more "digital" in comparison. The difference is rather nuanced though, not night and day.
have placed an order for hiby R4.. we ll do A/B testing compared to W2 and may just use it as a DAP and a Desktop DAC. a lot of value at just $249
LP has just posted an announcement of what appears to be a new dongle, the W2 Ultra:
https://weibo.com/5819639917/5051990926951950#repost
[translation] Can push big headphones, why is it a "brick machine" -- W2 Ultra, light and new.
Please look forward to more information on this Friday!
https://weibo.com/5819639917/5051990926951950#repost
[translation] Can push big headphones, why is it a "brick machine" -- W2 Ultra, light and new.
Please look forward to more information on this Friday!
Wondering if is the same ALPS volume wheel used in other dongles and if is still made of aluminium or titanium this time. Pretty looking anyway.
LP has just posted an announcement of what appears to be a new dongle, the W2 Ultra:
https://weibo.com/5819639917/5051990926951950#repost
[translation] Can push big headphones, why is it a "brick machine" -- W2 Ultra, light and new.
Please look forward to more information on this Friday!
LP has posted the follow up post on weibo:
https://weibo.com/5819639917/505271...trans=5819639917_5052715652612114&s_channel=4
[translation} # Little Tail or Big Tail? "800mW virtual not virtual standard?" "Can only push the big ears, uncomfortable with ear plugs?" "Pushing too much sound rough?" You care about, we have fully considered - W2 Ultra meaning deconstruction
@Uncle Wilson from Jaben Singapore is taking preorders.
https://www.facebook.com/share/f1aZ6cb56ngwFF5d/?mibextid=JOZb8W
I am sure other authorised dealers like MusicTeck are as well.
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We have received a couple FAQs about the new W2 Ultra and want to share some of the brief test results we asked the LP team for.
(If you have any questions about the new W2 Ultra, please PM us, or email us at info@musicteck.com.)
Q1. Will W2 Ultra drain a lot of battery life from the cellphones?
The power consumption is pretty normal. LP team tested IP15-> W2 Ultra -> HD800 and the battery consumption was 4% out of 1 hour of listening. I would say it is pretty reasonable.
Q2. Does W2 Ultra get hot under the HP power mode?
The new heatsink is definitely effective. The heat of W2 Ultra isn't much higher than the original W2 despite having almost 4x of output power.
(If you have any questions about the new W2 Ultra, please PM us, or email us at info@musicteck.com.)
Q1. Will W2 Ultra drain a lot of battery life from the cellphones?
The power consumption is pretty normal. LP team tested IP15-> W2 Ultra -> HD800 and the battery consumption was 4% out of 1 hour of listening. I would say it is pretty reasonable.
Q2. Does W2 Ultra get hot under the HP power mode?
The new heatsink is definitely effective. The heat of W2 Ultra isn't much higher than the original W2 despite having almost 4x of output power.
LP W2 Ultra is officially announced! Here are some of the details. We will start taking pre-orders now!
https://shop.musicteck.com/products...igh-output-dongle?_pos=1&_sid=92ab5530e&_ss=r
https://shop.musicteck.com/products...igh-output-dongle?_pos=1&_sid=92ab5530e&_ss=r
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The official reply to FAQ from LP:
Answering Audiophiles' Questions: Is the Max Output Power for real? Will there be High Power Consumption? Will it be Expensive? 9 Q&As About the W2 Ultra
Since the W2 Ultra was unveiled, many audiophiles have been curious about its 800mW@32Ω continuous output power, thinking it's unlikely for a battery-free dongle to achieve such high output power. We've also received some questions, such as "At what distortion level is the W2 Ultra's 800mW output measured?", "Won't the phone's power consumption be very high with such output power?", "With such high performance, the price must be very high!", etc. To present a more realistic picture of the W2 Ultra, we address these questions in detail. We hope you read through patiently. Thank you very much!
Q1: Is the W2 Ultra's 800mW output power measured at a high distortion level, such as THD+N at 10%?
A: (Chart) Please see the measurement results in the graph. The vertical axis is THD+N (Total Harmonic Distortion and Noise), and the horizontal axis is the output power. The load impedance during the measurement of the W2U is 32Ω. As shown, the distortion is around 0.0024% at 800mW, which means that the W2 Ultra ensures ultra-high power output with very low distortion. When driving high-impedance headphones like 300Ω, the distortion data will be even better. We also look forward to third-party tests and measurements of the W2 Ultra.
Q2: The L&P claims that the W2U can stably output up to 800mW for a long time. How long is it in actual conditions?
A: According to our tests, with sufficient power supply and the operational amplifier's supply voltage set to ±6V, the W2 Ultra can achieve more than 1 hour of stable 800mW output. When set to ±4.5V, it can provide over 1 hour of stable 620mW output. If only using cellphone as power supply, the cellphone's OTG output circuit might overheat and trigger protection when the output power is maximized. For further enhancement, you can use L&P's Ultimate Zone "Y Cable" — WY1 to connect an external power bank or a low-noised linear power supply for better performance. The range of W series accessories is now complete, offering diverse playability and expandability. We encourage users to try different combinations.
Q3: If the high and stable output power is true, won't it overdrive low-impedance earphones?
A: Part of the W2 Ultra's circuitry is inherited from our new flagship DAP, the E7. The headphone amp's supply voltage can be switched between two levels. For IEMs, we recommend using the ±4.5V supply for high current drive. For headphones or low-sensitivity IEMs, we suggest the ±6V supply for high voltage drive. Hence, the W2 Ultra is suitable for both in-ear monitors and headphones.
Q4: With such high driving power, won't the power consumption be very high?
A: When we launched the W4 series last year, we solved the inverse relation between high driving power and low power consumption. The new W2 Ultra enhances the effective output power to 800mW while keeping power consumption at a normal level. For reference, we conducted a small experiment: using an iPhone 15 Pro Max connected to the W2 Ultra driving Sennheiser HD800S at 80% volume, the phone's battery dropped by 4% in an hour. This means that high output power doesn't necessarily lead to high power consumption during normal music listening. We can compare the maximum output power to a water tank that fills and empties simultaneously; the larger the output power, the larger the tank's capacity and water flow. You can choose between a steady flow or a surge, but insufficient capacity and inflow won't achieve the surge effect.
Q5: The W2 Ultra has custom tuning for both the HD800 and the Focal Utopia, but one has low impedance and the other high. Can a little dongle drive both effectively?
A: Since the LP6Ti in 2018, we have developed customized tuning firmware for the Focal Utopia and HD800, optimized for their driving characteristics and sound tuning. The W2 Ultra also benefits from LP6Ti's R&D. After releasing the W2 Ultra's cutomized tuning firmware for the Utopia and HD800, we will also release more special tuning firmware for other headphones.
Q6: Given L&P's usual "luxury" style, the pricing must be high, right?
A: After reading this, feel free to reach out to your dealers to inquire and place your orders. Shipping starts on July 15th, and the retail price is $319。
Q7: It looks like the W4, so why is it still called the W2 Ultra?
A: The W2 Ultra uses the same design and volume knob as the W4. However, its core DAC chip, dual CS43131 DAC, is the same as the W2-131, so it continues the W2 series. Although the DAC is the same, the W2 Ultra's internal circuitry and other core materials have been completely redesigned and upgraded, resulting in an output power 2.8 times that of the W2-131. In a sense, it is the "ultimate version" of the W2 under our current technology, hence the name W2 Ultra.
Q8: Since it uses the same dual CS43131 chips as the W2-131, how does its sound different?
A: As the most powerful W2, besides significantly increasing the amp power, we have put a lot of effort into its sound quality. Both the W2-198 and W2-131's tunings are well-regarded by many audiophiles. On this basis, enhancing the W2 Ultra's sound was no easy task. To achieve this, we adjusted the circuit layout, redesigned the wiring, enhanced the power design, used copper cladding on the PCB, and carefully selected core components. This makes the ultimate version's sound more powerful and cohesive. In short, the W2 Ultra is a comprehensive upgrade of the W2-131. We welcome especially W2 users to compare and evaluate it.
Q9: Why haven't you released the distortion and power output for the low-frequency range? Are you afraid to do so?
A: We didn't specifically release the low-frequency THD+N results. As we mentioned before, this parameter is important for AC-coupled devices because they might have design flaws at low frequencies if the coupling capacitor capacity is insufficient and the next stage's input impedance is low. But since the W2 Ultra uses pure DC coupling, there's no need to focus on the low-frequency THD+N results. However, since some audiophiles have asked, we think we shuld share the low-frequency performance. Here is the 20Hz performance under load as shown in the test results.
Thank you all!
Answering Audiophiles' Questions: Is the Max Output Power for real? Will there be High Power Consumption? Will it be Expensive? 9 Q&As About the W2 Ultra
Since the W2 Ultra was unveiled, many audiophiles have been curious about its 800mW@32Ω continuous output power, thinking it's unlikely for a battery-free dongle to achieve such high output power. We've also received some questions, such as "At what distortion level is the W2 Ultra's 800mW output measured?", "Won't the phone's power consumption be very high with such output power?", "With such high performance, the price must be very high!", etc. To present a more realistic picture of the W2 Ultra, we address these questions in detail. We hope you read through patiently. Thank you very much!
Q1: Is the W2 Ultra's 800mW output power measured at a high distortion level, such as THD+N at 10%?
A: (Chart) Please see the measurement results in the graph. The vertical axis is THD+N (Total Harmonic Distortion and Noise), and the horizontal axis is the output power. The load impedance during the measurement of the W2U is 32Ω. As shown, the distortion is around 0.0024% at 800mW, which means that the W2 Ultra ensures ultra-high power output with very low distortion. When driving high-impedance headphones like 300Ω, the distortion data will be even better. We also look forward to third-party tests and measurements of the W2 Ultra.
Q2: The L&P claims that the W2U can stably output up to 800mW for a long time. How long is it in actual conditions?
A: According to our tests, with sufficient power supply and the operational amplifier's supply voltage set to ±6V, the W2 Ultra can achieve more than 1 hour of stable 800mW output. When set to ±4.5V, it can provide over 1 hour of stable 620mW output. If only using cellphone as power supply, the cellphone's OTG output circuit might overheat and trigger protection when the output power is maximized. For further enhancement, you can use L&P's Ultimate Zone "Y Cable" — WY1 to connect an external power bank or a low-noised linear power supply for better performance. The range of W series accessories is now complete, offering diverse playability and expandability. We encourage users to try different combinations.
Q3: If the high and stable output power is true, won't it overdrive low-impedance earphones?
A: Part of the W2 Ultra's circuitry is inherited from our new flagship DAP, the E7. The headphone amp's supply voltage can be switched between two levels. For IEMs, we recommend using the ±4.5V supply for high current drive. For headphones or low-sensitivity IEMs, we suggest the ±6V supply for high voltage drive. Hence, the W2 Ultra is suitable for both in-ear monitors and headphones.
Q4: With such high driving power, won't the power consumption be very high?
A: When we launched the W4 series last year, we solved the inverse relation between high driving power and low power consumption. The new W2 Ultra enhances the effective output power to 800mW while keeping power consumption at a normal level. For reference, we conducted a small experiment: using an iPhone 15 Pro Max connected to the W2 Ultra driving Sennheiser HD800S at 80% volume, the phone's battery dropped by 4% in an hour. This means that high output power doesn't necessarily lead to high power consumption during normal music listening. We can compare the maximum output power to a water tank that fills and empties simultaneously; the larger the output power, the larger the tank's capacity and water flow. You can choose between a steady flow or a surge, but insufficient capacity and inflow won't achieve the surge effect.
Q5: The W2 Ultra has custom tuning for both the HD800 and the Focal Utopia, but one has low impedance and the other high. Can a little dongle drive both effectively?
A: Since the LP6Ti in 2018, we have developed customized tuning firmware for the Focal Utopia and HD800, optimized for their driving characteristics and sound tuning. The W2 Ultra also benefits from LP6Ti's R&D. After releasing the W2 Ultra's cutomized tuning firmware for the Utopia and HD800, we will also release more special tuning firmware for other headphones.
Q6: Given L&P's usual "luxury" style, the pricing must be high, right?
A: After reading this, feel free to reach out to your dealers to inquire and place your orders. Shipping starts on July 15th, and the retail price is $319。
Q7: It looks like the W4, so why is it still called the W2 Ultra?
A: The W2 Ultra uses the same design and volume knob as the W4. However, its core DAC chip, dual CS43131 DAC, is the same as the W2-131, so it continues the W2 series. Although the DAC is the same, the W2 Ultra's internal circuitry and other core materials have been completely redesigned and upgraded, resulting in an output power 2.8 times that of the W2-131. In a sense, it is the "ultimate version" of the W2 under our current technology, hence the name W2 Ultra.
Q8: Since it uses the same dual CS43131 chips as the W2-131, how does its sound different?
A: As the most powerful W2, besides significantly increasing the amp power, we have put a lot of effort into its sound quality. Both the W2-198 and W2-131's tunings are well-regarded by many audiophiles. On this basis, enhancing the W2 Ultra's sound was no easy task. To achieve this, we adjusted the circuit layout, redesigned the wiring, enhanced the power design, used copper cladding on the PCB, and carefully selected core components. This makes the ultimate version's sound more powerful and cohesive. In short, the W2 Ultra is a comprehensive upgrade of the W2-131. We welcome especially W2 users to compare and evaluate it.
Q9: Why haven't you released the distortion and power output for the low-frequency range? Are you afraid to do so?
A: We didn't specifically release the low-frequency THD+N results. As we mentioned before, this parameter is important for AC-coupled devices because they might have design flaws at low frequencies if the coupling capacitor capacity is insufficient and the next stage's input impedance is low. But since the W2 Ultra uses pure DC coupling, there's no need to focus on the low-frequency THD+N results. However, since some audiophiles have asked, we think we shuld share the low-frequency performance. Here is the 20Hz performance under load as shown in the test results.
Thank you all!
Some simple unboxing photos.
hot off the mail!
Take this with a grain of salt, impression is done on U18S and HD800S.
In short, W2U is a slightly smoother W2-131 with more dynamics. The NOS mode is very noisy on U18S (EDIT: switching the USB cable from DDhifi TC09S to Furutech ADL lowers this noise), not audible on HD800S. The sound impression is kinda different with each of the transducer.
EDIT2: high noise floor on NOS seems to be quite specific to my U18S. I'll try to investigate why. (EDIT3: something to do with my 64 Audio cable, switching to a different cable lowered the noise floor to very low... I'm not sure why)
U18S:
- W4 is more neutral with more midrange texture and airier treble, while W2U is warmer, smoother texture overall
- W2U has more prominent dynamic swings, especially in orchestral pieces when it goes from near silent to big entrance
- W4 is still better in microdetails and texture
HD800S:
- The warmth of W2U isn't as pronounced with headphones
- The difference in dynamics is more obvious between W2U and W4
- Texture is more even in headphones between the two, but W4 still has a slight edge over W2U
Also, there's this a new setting in W2U to adjust the "PAV" (not sure what it stands for, not in the manual... but I suspect it is "peak amplitude voltage") that was also mentioned in the promotional materials. I tried switching them with U18S but I can't tell any difference. In HD800S, switching to 6V improved the bass extension and overall sense of dynamics. I think I enjoy W4 more with U18S, but W2U more with HD800S.
TL;DR: W2U seems to be a headphone specialist, but also a very capable IEM amp. I really enjoy it, but ask me again in a week after the honeymoon period ends.
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This is disappointing then.. i was hoping for good news.. the hiby r4 in dac mode does better (i’d say 20-30%) than the w2-131.. for a price tag of $250 it is definitely better desktop dac with optional dap capability compared to w2U.. lets wait for more reviews
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