[BlueMountain]

Hey there,


a family member did buy a new set of speakers the last month.

As my living room is not suitable for a set of speakers, I want to improve on the already owned HD600 and HD6XX. The new headphone should be suitable for all genres.


What I am looking for:

Natural tonality – especially for wooden instruments (e.g. strings) or brass instruments (e.g. trumpets).

More extension in frequency response

More resolution

More soundstage

Neutral response*


*If there is deviation and I would be forced to choose between a darker and a brighter headphone in the treble region, I would choose the brighter. However, I do not like extremes.



Maximum Budget

EUR 1800


Auditioned Headphones:

Audeze LCD- X

Sennheiser HD800 s

Hifiman Ananda

Hifiman Arya

Stax SR L300 with Srm-252s

Stax SR L500 with Srm-252s


AMP/Energizer:

Schiit Magni 3+ for Single Ended

SRM 252S for STAX


Findings:

Technically all auditioned headphones were superior in a technical sense to the HD600.

This manifested mainly in detail, resolution and soundstage.


However, all auditioned headphones, except for the STAX SRL 300, failed in the recreation of natural tonality. Some quite severely. This was easily heard with orchestral soundtracks and to some extend in vocals.


So why not go for the SR L300?

The SR L300 lacked low end extension and control. It was similar, maybe even slightly worse to the HD600 and much worse to planar bass in terms of extension, quality and quantity. Considering the asking price of EUR 1000,- (including the energizer) and the fact that I am looking for an allrounder this would have been a too much of a compromise and lack for bass heavy genres like RAP and EDM.


Question:

Is there a headphone which has a natural tonality of the Sennheiser HD600 or STAX SR L300 combined with planar like bass?



Bonus: Extended description of Listening Session:

The listening session was done with two people.

We both had extremely similar hearing impressions.

We do attend from time to time real orchestral concerts in a good symphony hall.


Please bear in mind that these impressions are relative to the headphones owned and auditioned and the experience gathered during live orchestra sessions. Vocabulary may not be 100% fitting as we are no journalists and no native speakers.


Please do not take any “cons” mentioned hereafter personally or as an insult to anybodies taste or buying decision made in the past.


Lastly and most importantly. Have fun!



Music:

Wild mix of genre and songs.


Auditioned songs/albums: Chris Jones Roadhouse Automobiles, John Williams (e.g. Star Wars Episode 9), Hans Zimmer (e.g. Interstellar), Madonna (Ray of light), Rap, Top50 etc.


LCD-X:

Comfort: Heavy and on the edge on being tolerable.

Build: Great


Sound: Very very dark and muffled for most genres!

Far away from neutral (if HD600 is).

Much(!) darker and more veiled than the HD6XX (HD6XX on its own is okay for me).

Due to the issue in tonality this headphone was quickly put aside.


Pro: Basslines were exceptionally well presented, textured and detailed.

Bass sounded the best I heard to date.


Contra: Lacked correct tonality and was very muffled.

Some peaks in the higher octaves were present which resulted in a strange shift in loudness depending on the played
note.


Note: In all fairness, some people seem indeed to have heard very good and neutral versions of the LCD X.

However, others seemed to report from quite a lot of driver variance.

Maybe this was a bad sample.

I am still a lit puzzled as I can barely imagine what other, darker versions must sound in the case this was a normal
version.




Hifiman Arya (“old” revision with the dustcover attached to the earpads)

Comfort: Very comfortable. Large earpads were a non- issue for seal.

Build: Good enough to consider it okay for me.

No creaks or strange build issues the auditioned sample.


Sound:


Signature: Perceived as V-Shaped.

However, the lack of linear extension of the existing headphone HD600 probably

skewed my judgement here. In general, this is probably more likely a neutral to

neutral bright headphone with a dip in the upper mids.

Pro:

Great extension to both ends of the frequency response.

Planar control of base.

Great sense of a black background

Soundstage showed impressive layering and was quite holographic and surprising in height. In terms of width, only
HD800 was wider.

Dynamics are good enough for me

Con:

Tonality was off (“plasticky, hollow”). Especially noticeable on wooden instruments like strings.

Highs were in some areas quite peaky. As a result, some tones and voices sounded

borderline to become harsh, however not on HD800 level.

Vocals sounded subjectively worse in tonality than HD600 and “s” “t” sounds were sometimes a little bit edgy.

However, tonality is an issue for almost all headphones here except maybe for the STAX SR L300.


Hifiman Ananda:

Comfort: Good weight, however worse than ARYA as the Cups do not swivel.

Sound:

Signature: Sounded more focused on the mids (than Arya). Sounded artificial and had less soundstage/closer sounding.
Was quickly disregarded. Just not our cup of tea.

Sennheiser HD800s:

Comfort: Very comfortable, clamp could have been a little bit higher.

Build: Very good for the headphones.

However, I would like to see another type of cable sleeve (no issue with quality itself)


Sound: Leaning towards analytical and bright.

Pro: Great sense of air and detail retrieval.

Not as ear piercing as expected.

Great soundstage (see con)

Wooden instruments and brass sounded tonally believable enough.


Con: Overall (still) too bass light.

Lacked extensions and quantity in the lower registers compared to the elevated highs and lacked control to planar
bass.

Showed (still) some glare/resonance to my ears which was especially noticeable during complex classic tracks.

mildly fatiguing

Soundstage sounded artificially boosted in some Pop tracks.


STAX SR L300

Comfort: Okay, but ears touched the inside of the dust cover.

Build: Cheap plastic. Must be handled with (extreme) care. Creaks.

However, I have not heard reports about longevity issues.


Sound: Neutral with a good amount of bass hump around 100 hz

(for the auditioned sample).

Tonally close to HD600 with more air to the highs and more body for wooden instruments.


Pro:

Tonally the most accurate representation of a live orchestra I have heard to date out of a headphone

Soundstage was good enough in size and with nice separation and enough depth. Certainly no HD800s or Arya.

Contra:

Lacks extension and control in base (compared to planar)

(Quite similar in extension to HD600)

Lower bass lines below 50hz (a guestimate) are barely/not represented due to sharp drop in loudness.

Less than neutral amount of bass below the 100hz hump.

Maybe a little bit too much body and warmth on this set but still very enjoyable.


STAX SR L500

Comfort: Good due to the thicker pads. Ears did not touch the dust cover anymore.

Build: Same as above L300

Sound: This exemplar was requested as a last hope by me as I hoped to find more bass extension with the same tonality
and more control.

Much brighter and thinner sounding than the SR L300

It did have more control, however not more extension. Maybe a tiny little bit.

Note: I am not sure the difference should be that large in tonality between the L300 and SR L500. However, the store owner confirmed the general lack of extension and heft.

 

[Khronos]

Unless you are willing to shoot for a ZMF Verite (which comes up at around €2000), it seems your cup of tea might be closer to a Verum One or a Focal Elex.

The Verums are a more balanced LCD-2, with excellent timbre. Furthermore, with an excellent amplifier they scale like mad (Schiit Aegir, etc).

The Elex are called a grown up HD-650.

 

[Tsukuyomi]

honestly i think you should split your budget for a better amp/source + new headphones. instead of investing the entire lot on a pair of headphones only.

That being said, it sounds like maybe a Focal Clear would be better suited for your taste.

 

[Mightygrey]

More budget-oriented suggestion: Focal Elex.

Ultimate suggestion: Audio-Technica ADX-5000

 

[FullBlownEargasam]

Ok lets give this guys some love. He did his homework he didn't just say "I want a good headphone what should I get".

First if you are really a new headfier then you got some good ears because from the headphones that I have heard that you described I agree with your assessments. You also have a def path to what you are looking for. I agree with someone above that you might need a better source to really evaluate the cans you described.

That being said from my experience and what you have said the Aryas are the way to go.... maybe HD800s with different pads. I have the HD800s with Dekoni pads and it made all the difference in those headphones. I loved them before but now I am listening to them more. I think someone mentioned ZMF and that is my new favorite. I am new to ZMF but I am def a fanboy right now. I am looking at my wall to see what I can sell because the ZMF Verite Closed is it for me but it does not at all describe what you are looking for.

I am just curious how you demoed this selection? Was this a friend's house or a store? If a store where is it.... I want to go!

Good luck and I hope this thread gets some traction because you really did some work.

 

[m-i-c-k-e-y]

I too came from HD600. I like a natural tone. Been hunting for a HP with flat freq. response with neutral sound/purity. End up the first, others came in later but are first rate also especially the next two.

Audio Zenith PMX2 Rev2
Focal Clear
ZMF Auteur
Verum Audio Verum 1

Good luck on your hunt.

 

[stpope]

Hello,

In case you haven't seen it, I posted an in-depth comparison of 10 (11 actually) sets of headphones called "A Tale of 10 Cans" in a parallel forum; see, https://www.head-fi.org/threads/a-tale-of-10-cans.928530

stp

 

[mendye770]

I would say that maybe they should try the HEDDphone.

 

[stpope]

Hi all,

I went through the same process a while back and wrote up my evaluations.
See https://www.head-fi.org/threads/a-tale-of-10-cans.928530/
The bottom line is that I now use Audio Technica ATH-R70X and Audioquest Nighthawk Carbon.

stp

 

[ScornDefeat]

Definitely take a look at the Focal Clear, which I think might be perfectly suited for you based on your summary.

From the Planar realms, I think the Audeze LCD-3 would suit you much better than the LCD-X.

On the upper end of the spectrum, ZMF Auteurs are worth a look for you, as well.

 

[Deolum]

I think after 6 month he decided for a headphone now.

However most natural headphones i heard so far are Akgs.

 

[mendye770]

The sennheiser hd 540 reference 1 is so natural sounding, it’ll Blow your mind!!!
Check out the thread on This website..

 

[543933]

In my opinion and long experience with these two I would say : "The HiFiMan Edition X V2 are called a grown up HD-650 and HD600."
I keep HEX v2 because that is my end game but I will also keep my old HD600 and HD650 because they are kings of bang for buck and anything more expensive are not worth that cash to try upgrade them. The second is I bought HEX v2 for ~ 550 USD so it was a steal.

 

[gimmeheadroom]

Definitely take a look at the Focal Clear, which I think might be perfectly suited for you based on your summary.

From the Planar realms, I think the Audeze LCD-3 would suit you much better than the LCD-X.

On the upper end of the spectrum, ZMF Auteurs are worth a look for you, as well.

I didn't hear most of the cans mentioned but I have the LCD-3. To me the LCD-3F can be kinda clinical. It is smoother, but for me it is more similar to the 800 than it is to the 600.

For a complementary pair to the HD 600s, I like the LCD-2C. It is smooth and dark and brings me back to the Sennheiser House Sound of the 1980s. But it slams and gets the tonality right in the mids similar to the HD 600s.

I think the OP outta try his HD 600s out of a really good amp. The one he has cannot be doing them justice. This is a pair of cans that is known to scale big time. The HD 600 is kinda hard to upgrade from.

 

[Deolum]

I didn't hear most of the cans mentioned but I have the LCD-3. To me the LCD-3F can be kinda clinical. It is smoother, but for me it is more similar to the 800 than it is to the 600.

For a complementary pair to the HD 600s, I like the LCD-2C. It is smooth and dark and brings me back to the Sennheiser House Sound of the 1980s. But it slams and gets the tonality right in the mids similar to the HD 600s.

I think the OP outta try his HD 600s out of a really good amp. The one he has cannot be doing them justice. This is a pair of cans that is known to scale big time. The HD 600 is kinda hard to upgrade from.

Good you brought up this thread. His descriptions are so on point. I even saw i already left a comment in this thread lol.

I'm looking for exactly the same "headphone which has a natural tonality of the Sennheiser HD600 or STAX SR L300 combined with planar like bass".

I really wonder which LCD-X he listened to though. I agree that it isn't a good headphone but very dark? I remember the LCD-X to be brighter than LCD 2 and LCD 3.

One headphone that maybe could fit the bill is the Grado PS1000e. Only listened to the PS2000e but it was a pretty solid allrounder with hefty bass while maintaining an overall neutral FR. Tonality was equally great. Female vocals were on par with HD600, male vocals and instruments, especially pianos, were superior. Soundstage was maybe the best i've heard together with the Utopia.

So PS1000e could be a good choice here.

(Didn't keep 2000e because comfort sucks so hard, Grado qc, very heavy and attached crap cable on a flagship headphone)

Currently having a HE1000 V2 on the way. Maybe that will be an improvement over the HD600.