LETSHUOER S12 - Next big planar? (Impressions & Discussion)
Mar 23, 2022 at 3:44 PM Post #616 of 1,922
it seems you enjoy both kato and s12, i guess some songs sounds best on s12 and some other on kato - is it 50/50 or more 80/20 ? if the last, is it in favor of s12 or kato ?

Thanks for your interest. I find both are tuned similarly, so both have been thus far judged equally respect to the genre being listened to. Sure, both monitors add some subjective differences, but until I can give both equal time, I’m personally not picking a “winner” here.
about the tips you may have considered the final e-tips because they come in 5 sizes which helps with a better fit (no idea why most tips come only in 3 sizes)

There are literally a hundred of tips I could be trying out. I chose Azla for their multiple sizes and reported neutrality and comfort. I chose Spinfit for their popularity regarding neutrality and unique design. For the Kato, the choice was easy… medium size, good fit, and moving it around in my ear produced very little variance in bass, leastwise compared to the S12 set. Granted, it could possibly be an intermediate size that will minimize discomfort and maximize SQ, but only the Spinfit design seems to have addressed the possibility being geometry.

I’ll let you know, but I’m in Newfoundland waiting for tips from China. It’ll be a while…
 
Mar 23, 2022 at 3:46 PM Post #617 of 1,922
Thanks for your interest. I find both are tuned similarly, so both have been thus far judged equally respect to the genre being listened to. Sure, both monitors add some subjective differences, but until I can give both equal time, I’m personally not picking a “winner” here.


There are literally a hundred of tips I could be trying out. I chose Azla for their multiple sizes and reported neutrality and comfort. I chose Spinfit for their popularity regarding neutrality and unique design. For the Kato, the choice was easy… medium size, good fit, and moving it around in my ear produced very little variance in bass, leastwise compared to the S12 set. Granted, it could possibly be an intermediate size that will minimize discomfort and maximize SQ, but only the Spinfit design seems to have addressed the possibility being geometry.

I’ll let you know, but I’m in Newfoundland waiting for tips from China. It’ll be a while…
i use SednaEarfitLight on my s12 and love it, amazon

 
Mar 23, 2022 at 3:48 PM Post #618 of 1,922
shuoer s12.jpg
I heard the Shuoer S12 recently. Honestly, this sounds soo good. Just loving it. Imaging and separation is top-notch for the price segment.
 
Mar 23, 2022 at 3:56 PM Post #619 of 1,922
i use SednaEarfitLight on my s12 and love it, amazon

Thanks for your response. Other than the Azla Xelastics, I did also order the Azla SednaEarFit Crystals. Only these Azlas are reported to be a bit “sticky”. I have the Xelastics on my Airpod Pros for keeping them in place because my ears are fuzzy, and they are comfortable. They get dirty after time, but their also very easy to clean. My problem could indeed be my unique ears, but it doesn’t explain why the S12s and not the Katos.

Do you believe there may be something different about the Lights that may address my problem better?
 
Mar 23, 2022 at 4:02 PM Post #620 of 1,922
Thanks for your response. Other than the Azla Xelastics, I did also order the Azla SednaEarFit Crystals. Only these Azlas are reported to be a bit “sticky”. I have the Xelastics on my Airpod Pros for keeping them in place because my ears are fuzzy, and they are comfortable. They get dirty after time, but their also very easy to clean. My problem could indeed be my unique ears, but it doesn’t explain why the S12s and not the Katos.

Do you believe there may be something different about the Lights that may address my problem better?
different material and wider bore, i also use spinfit CP100 plus xl
 
Mar 24, 2022 at 1:32 AM Post #622 of 1,922
I have Abigail and CX Pro . Is this enough for S12?

I read Andydongle website, he says Jcally Jm10 and Tempotec HD Pro (both vrm2) Is this gonna power it better? Should I aim for vrm4 like tempotec e35?

I dont know anything about audiophile system, I just need something to listen with S12. within 20-30$
 
Mar 24, 2022 at 3:15 AM Post #623 of 1,922
I have Abigail and CX Pro . Is this enough for S12?

I read Andydongle website, he says Jcally Jm10 and Tempotec HD Pro (both vrm2) Is this gonna power it better? Should I aim for vrm4 like tempotec e35?

I dont know anything about audiophile system, I just need something to listen with S12. within 20-30$
You can get 115db spl on the S12 with just 20mw. That's enough for very loud average 85db volume plus 30db headroom for peaks (happens mostly in high quality classical music recordings, jazz about 15db, pop just 10db). If you're going to EQ you need to add power for the negative gain, double the power for every 3db.
The Sonata HD Pro should be enough for over 120db (the threshold of pain and hearing damage).
Btw the only dongle dac I'm aware that can provide clean 2V at 16ohm load is the E1DA 9038 series, the Sonata E35 will push 1V @16ohm.
 
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Mar 24, 2022 at 4:24 AM Post #624 of 1,922
You can get 115db spl on the S12 with just 20mw. That's enough for very loud average 85db volume plus 30db headroom for peaks (happens mostly in high quality classical music recordings, jazz about 15db, pop just 10db). If you're going to EQ you need to add power for the negative gain, double the power for every 3db.
The Sonata HD Pro should be enough for over 120db (the threshold of pain and hearing damage).
Btw the only dongle dac I'm aware that can provide clean 2V at 16ohm load is the E1DA 9038 series, the Sonata E35 will push 1V @16ohm.
I don't get it. I don't know what 20mw is implying. Are you talking about Abigail?Everyone's suggest seems to be something around 100$ to drive s12

And , sonata hd pro will be v2 and sonata e35 v1. Even though it is more expensive?
And I should get the v2?

Thx
 
Mar 24, 2022 at 5:01 AM Post #626 of 1,922
I don't get it. I don't know what 20mw is implying. Are you talking about Abigail?Everyone's suggest seems to be something around 100$ to drive s12

And , sonata hd pro will be v2 and sonata e35 v1. Even though it is more expensive?
And I should get the v2?

Thx
20 milliwatts is the power you need for that use case without EQ, about 0,5V. You should look for specs or measurements of the dongles showing at least that power under 16ohm load (which is the S12 impedance). My understanding is that you can force the Sonata HD Pro to push 2V under any load, but it'll cause clipping (heavy distortion, not clean power). The S12 is easy to drive (102db/mw sensitivity with 16ohm impedance), I haven't seen any serious reviewer claiming otherwise, you should take random opinions here with a heavy grain of salt.
 
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Mar 24, 2022 at 6:44 AM Post #627 of 1,922
So, I've spent a few hours comparing the Olina and the S12 now and I don't think I've found a single instance in which I prefer the Olina.

As has been pointed out, most especially by dharmasteve, these things do drums so much justice it's hard to even explain. Every hit is distinct and the cymbals have a shine and crispness that I haven't experienced since my Audio Technica ATH-AD900s back when I had a vinyl collection and tube amps. But then, they do the low end as much if not more justice then my Sennheiser HD-25 1 Mk. IIs. Like, the kick drum really kicks and the bass evokes a resonance that I can feel in my body. It's glorious.

I was just doing a bunch of A to B comparisons, playing sections of a song over and over and then switching to the other IEM and comparing. I listened to Deftones, Porcupine Tree, Big Thief, **** Buttons, Nine Inch Nails, Bon Iver, Tool and a fair bit more and in every instance the S12 won out. The last two comparisons were where I finally decided to call it quits and accept the fact that I'm probably not going to find a song in which I prefer the Olina: the beginning of "UFOF" by Big Thief and the beginning of "Flume" by Bon Iver.I had heard the Olina were good with acoustic stuff so I figured I'd it was time to put them in their wheel house. In the first instance I paid particular attention to the drums as played in the first 15 seconds. On the Olina they kind of melded together and were a little lost in the rest of the song. On the S12 they were distinct and clear, but in no way overpowering anything around them. For "Flume" the acoustic guitar was just so much more clear and resonant on the S12 it really wasn't even fair to continue. To me it felt like a knock out blow so that's where I stopped the comparison.

There was one song, "Piggy" by Nine Inch Nails, where I felt the snare hits had more oomph on the Olina but then the S12 revealed so much depth to each hit -- you could hear the damn chains rattle like your head was next to the drummer! -- that I instantly forgot that it didn't have quite as much punch. This was one of the only instances in which I felt I could give a slight edge to the Olina. There were moments during comparisons where I thought I heard a detail I hadn't noticed on the S12 while listening to the Olina, but switching back over instantly proved that I was wrong: I just hadn't been paying attention to that particular sound because the S12 was blowing my mind with other things. That's kind of the story over all though: the S12 is just fun as hell to listen. There were moments where I caught myself continuing to listen to a song because I was just so into it, something I realized wasn't happening with the Olina.

To get less technical, what I noticed every time upon the immediate switch was that the Olina felt darker and colder to me while the S12 was brighter and warmer. I don't know if I'm using those terms correctly, but those were the sensations that came to mind. The S12 had an appreciably bigger sound stage and gave the impression of being in a room with analog instruments, something I just didn't feel with the Olina.

I feel really weird bad mouthing the Olina because they are a really nice set of IEMs. I love their case and their look and for $100 they sound really, really good. I had a week with the Olinas before the S12s arrived and I was digging them so much I considered not opening the S12s. I thought I was totally satisfied. I'm glad my curiosity won out, though. I got the S12 for one $130, and to be honest for only $30 more it's not really a fair comparison. Now, it looks like Letshuoer is upping the MSRP on the S12 to $170 and that's where you might be able to start to make a value judgment concerning price to performance but honestly, even then, if you can afford the extra $70 it's not really a contest.

Let me say this to finish off: I am just a laymen and I would hardly call myself an audiophile. I'm at best audiophile adjacent, lol. I'm listening to FLAC files and 320 kbps mp3s through a lower end DAP, the FiiO X1 (to be replaced by the Sony NW-A55 tomorrow). Take my opinion with a grain of salt, and of course everyone's ears are different. But I just spent a few hours of my life shoving foam ear tips (the same Comply tips were used on both the Olina and the S12) into my ears over and over again like I was trying to achieve some kind of audio climax through half inch penetration, and I figured I might as well share my viewpoint if it helps someone out. I'm a guy who can't afford the latest and greatest and I had to choose between the S12 and the Olina for the IEM that will be with me for at least the next few years. The S12 won out handily, and I'm even more excited than I thought I would be because it's exactly the type of audio device that makes you want to re-listen to your entire collection, I don't think there is any higher praise than that.
 
Mar 24, 2022 at 6:44 AM Post #628 of 1,922
S12 arrived. Obvious driver flex in the right monitor. Slight distortion as well. So these will be going back. Sucks because they do sound pretty great for $150.

Maybe the best timbre in a planar iem I’ve heard. Scales with power like all planars do - ignore anyone who tells you otherwise. However, they don’t require loads of power like other planar iems.

Speaking of that: s12 shows it’s limits when compared to the grossly underrated tin p2. Cymbals are more smeared and less crisp as just one quick example.

S12 bass is very nice, and I think what you should expect from a large planar driver. I’m not surprised some in here can push it to extreme basshead levels for themselves. I’m still not reaching for planars when I want pure bass - yes they have great texture and can dig deep, but lack the visceral experience I’m looking for. XBA-Z5’s coated 16mm driver still the champ for me.

I probably won’t be ordering another s12 even though it’s really good. Not a perfect iem, and priced appropriately, but obviously there’s a pretty big QC issue with these drivers and I’m not sure it’s something I think customers should accept from an established brand like shouer - glad I went with Amazon.
I hope you don't mind me asking. How's the s12 sounds compared to tin p1?
Cheers
 
Mar 24, 2022 at 7:04 AM Post #629 of 1,922
From all the reviews i've seen S12 is better
 
Mar 24, 2022 at 8:48 AM Post #630 of 1,922
20 milliwatts is the power you need for that use case without EQ, about 0,5V. You should look for specs or measurements of the dongles showing at least that power under 16ohm load (which is the S12 impedance). My understanding is that you can force the Sonata HD Pro to push 2V under any load, but it'll cause clipping (heavy distortion, not clean power). The S12 is easy to drive (102db/mw sensitivity with 16ohm impedance), I haven't seen any serious reviewer claiming otherwise, you should take random opinions here with a heavy grain of salt.

JCally JM10​

DAC Chip: Cirrus Logic CS43131
PCM 32bit – 384kHz, SNR: -120db, Power: 1-2 Vrms Adaptive, USB Type-C Female, 3.5mm SE (Microphone: YES), 10g

Abigail​

Abigail Prototype 00
DAC Chip: Synaptics (Conexant) CX31993 Single
PCM 32bit–384khz, SNR: -128dB, Power: 1 Vrms 65mW x2, USB Type-C Male, 3.5mm SE (Microphone: YES), 12mm, 5g,

TempoTec Sonata HD Pro​

DAC Chip: Cirrus Logic CS43131 (Single)
PCM 32bit–384khz, DSD256, SNR: -128db, Power: 2 Vrms Adaptive, USB Type-C Female, 3.5mm SE (Microphone: NO), 10g

Hey thanks for a through answer.

How can I know which Vrm they will run at S12 16ohm?
And should I always seek more than 2 Vrms? As many people suggest to feed it more power?
 

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