Hi
I joined head fi a couple weeks ago but have been collecting headphones for years. I know lots about them however, i keep coming to the conclusion that there is no such thing as a "color-free" or "flat sunding" headphone. If you think about it, only IEM's are truly capable of no coloration compared to headphones...So what are your thought's?
The Sennheiser HE90 seems to have the flat reputation here, though I have not heard it. Any warmth is most likely coming from it's amp?
Different Stax headphone/systems I heard sounded relatively flat, though they seemed slightly lacking bass and slam. Though I did not get a chance to hear the top Stax flagships?
They all sounded very flat as I remember, not sure how they graph out? I'm sure you will find other posts here with some suggestion of headphones.
Hi
I joined head fi a couple weeks ago but have been collecting headphones for years. I know lots about them however, i keep coming to the conclusion that there is no such thing as a "color-free" or "flat sunding" headphone. If you think about it, only IEM's are truly capable of no coloration compared to headphones...So what are your thought's?
The frequency response of both headphones and IEMs is profoundly affected by one or more of:
(1) the geometry of the individual listener's head,
(2) the geometry of the individual listener's outer ear,
(3) The geometry of the individual listener's inner ear.
Of course these vary strongly from person to person, so no two people hear the identical same thing when they listen to the identical same music on the identical same headphones or earphones.
The obvious solution is some system of individually tailored electrical equalization which could be implemented with DSP processors for example. They would be adjusted in the field either interactively or by automated means.
Unfortunately, many audiiophiles have been taught by self-serving commercial interests and prevailing audiophile myths to distrust this seemingly obvious effective solution.
Therefore, there are now literally different hundreds of different headphones and earphones with various frequency response characteristics that may or may not roughly approximate the desired individually tailored response. They all have at least a few advocates. The results are the confusion you see before you.
The obvious solution is some system of individually tailored electrical equalization which could be implemented with DSP processors for example. They would be adjusted in the field either interactively or by automated means.
So much so that the only interesting technical problems that I see are how to implement the DSP filters (choose among several well known options) and adjust the DSP in the field.
As you may well know, the use of DSPs to adjust system response is already widely used (but perhaps not generally accepted) for home theater systems. Much of the controversy there is over the specific implementation and adjustment technique which are chosen from a number of well known options.
It seems that equalizing headphones is actually the simpler task since many of the complexities of room acoustics are avoided.
I don't have a long term relationship with the AKG 702s but I believe the k701s have a midrange spike which gives them color? Their bass response seems to add a style of color too.
Looking at obtaining a flat headphone is also going to start off with all the upstream equipment. A commonly used technique in the audio world is equipment matching and synergy. It seems always arguably discussed on the SS forums, still I believe there is the potential for every single aspect of the audio chain to add color, or even remove color.
But still I wonder how many real world HI/FI listeners would like or even identify a flat response if they heard it. As long as your getting to a place you like and there is a sound where each instrument really sounds real, what does it even matter. Even hearing the very best in speaker rigs, in expensive acoustic treated rooms, not color, but each had it's own personality. Listening to rock on one of these mega-buck life long science projects made me long for that V-shape transgressen at times.
In my research getting the most balanced and flat response meant I could hear the recording and mastering issues in 90% of my music collection. Sometimes the world actually looks better looking through rose colored glasses.
In theory this quest for flat seems admirably a good thing. Also I believe getting closer to flat is going to give many members equipment longevity. So many have been wowed by some beautiful color and made a big purchase only to find out they tired (of the color) after a time.
This statement may seem all too simplistic, but hearing stuff as it was meant to sound greatly extends the enjoyment of the equipment in use. Again though I feel this perfect flat response is going to sound dry, clinical and uninspiring in the end. Some of my best musical live experiences resulted from crazy room colorations and reverb. I knew I was hearing the room and some colorations covered up some possible detail but it was fun in the end. Would I choose to go to that same club and listen to that same band every night? I think no, as the sonics and lack of detail get old after a while. Fun for a one night fling, so to speak.
Still not using graphs but using your ears, the flat system may sound a little underwhelming at first listen but become a long term lifelong friend due to fidelity and honesty.
I don't have a long term relationship with the AKG 702s but I believe the k701s have a midrange spike which gives them color? Their bass response seems to add a style of color too.
Yes i suppose...but i think the capacity for coloration on both headphones are minimalistic compared to most. If you compare them to the other headphones available on the graph... http://www.headphone.com/pages/build-a-graph
Still though, unfortunately the capacity for coloration exists...
So much so that the only interesting technical problems that I see are how to implement the DSP filters (choose among several well known options) and adjust the DSP in the field.
As you may well know, the use of DSPs to adjust system response is already widely used (but perhaps not generally accepted) for home theater systems. Much of the controversy there is over the specific implementation and adjustment technique which are chosen from a number of well known options.
It seems that equalizing headphones is actually the simpler task since many of the complexities of room acoustics are avoided.
The only potential problem i can think of with DSP usage is that it can be damaging for headphone drivers and speakers eg clipping/distortion etcetera. But still i think it is a better alternative to buying the wrong equipment for your headphones.
The only potential problem i can think of with DSP usage is that it can be damaging for headphone drivers and speakers eg clipping/distortion etcetera. But still i think it is a better alternative to buying the wrong equipment for your headphones.
A well-done personalized HRTF correction would make sure to have some kind of restriction on the max dB correction allowed, especially when looking outside the main audible range. The literature on the subject of personalization that I've seen is well on top of such issues. The main issue is getting people out of this mindset of searching umpteen headphones for the "perfect" fit before even considering something like EQ.
No transducer (be it headphones -- that includes IEMs -- or speakers) can ever be completely uncolored, but some are a lot less colored than others. There is debate over which compensation curve (such as the diffuse-field flat speaker curve, Harman curve, and so on) is truly neutral for headphones, but since they are fairly similar, if the measurements align well with the curves, you can count on the frequency response being close to neutral.
There are other measurements to consider besides frequency response. Here are some links, for further research:
Yes i suppose...but i think the capacity for coloration on both headphones are minimalistic compared to most. If you compare them to the other headphones available on the graph... http://www.headphone.com/pages/build-a-graph
Still though, unfortunately the capacity for coloration exists...
The only potential problem i can think of with DSP usage is that it can be damaging for headphone drivers and speakers eg clipping/distortion etcetera. But still i think it is a better alternative to buying the wrong equipment for your headphones.
No transducer (be it headphones -- that includes IEMs -- or speakers) can ever be completely uncolored, but some are a lot less colored than others. There is debate over which compensation curve (such as the diffuse-field flat speaker curve, Harman curve, and so on) is truly neutral for headphones, but since they are fairly similar, if the measurements align well with the curves, you can count on the frequency response being close to neutral.
There are other measurements to consider besides frequency response. Here are some links, for further research:
I just tried to do it again but keeps going to Denon ah-d7000...ah forget it lol. But ( as i agree) you are correct on the Akg's having some coloration...but not as much as most others.
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