[ZeeMox]

When I got my LCD-XC's, the richness of the sound blew me away, but the amplification limitations of my hardware were immediately obvious. I was planning to wait, but I ordered a Mojo right off.

Richness, gone. The sound is bright, bland, clinical. Gets loud, but that's about it. Sounded better through my computer's onboard sound, albeit far too quiet. I have a feeling I would have felt better about the end result if I'd simply amplified that through a warm tube instead of a solid state.

What's up with that? Judging by all reports, the Mojo should have outclassed the onboard sound to an outstanding degree. I'm definitely thinking tube amp now, and I'm debating the necessity of a DAC. Or is it possible that the Mojo's amp section paired poorly with my cans and trampled the benefits of the DAC?

 

[ProtegeManiac]

When I got my LCD-XC's, the richness of the sound blew me away, but the amplification limitations of my hardware were immediately obvious. I was planning to wait, but I ordered a Mojo right off.

Richness, gone. The sound is bright, bland, clinical. Gets loud, but that's about it. Sounded better through my computer's onboard sound, albeit far too quiet. I have a feeling I would have felt better about the end result if I'd simply amplified that through a warm tube instead of a solid state.

What's up with that? Judging by all reports, the Mojo should have outclassed the onboard sound to an outstanding degree. I'm definitely thinking tube amp now, and I'm debating the necessity of a DAC. Or is it possible that the Mojo's amp section paired poorly with my cans and trampled the benefits of the DAC?

The LCD-XC isn't exactly known to be comparable to the original LCD-2 in warmth so chances are what you're hearing is the motherboard audio circuit's distortion pattern. You're near the limit of the output. On top of that the LCD-XC has ery low impedance, so it's less that the Mojo is "clinical," but the motherboard now has a low damping factor that boosts the low end, making it sound "richer."

Switching to a cheap tube amp isn't exactly the best course of action either. Your LCD-XC and actually all Audezees have fairly low impedance. Pure tube amps at the low end of the price bracket are all OTL - output transformerless - design, which means they deliver more power at 300ohms than at 32ohms. LCD-XC is even closer to 32ohms than the rest of the LCD line. Chances are you won't get more power, at best maybe higher gain.

Your alternative would be a hybrid amp with a tube preamp stage with a warm tube in it, or get a transformer coupled tube amp. The latter is considerably more expensive than OTL amps though - cheapest I know apart from some possibly dubious amps on eBay would be the WooAudio WA6 at $700. I'd suggest just getting an LCD-2C than EQ-ing the XC using equipment that shouldn't be used for drastic EQ changes, but I'm guessing you need the closed cups.

 

[ZeeMox]

The LCD-XC isn't exactly known to be comparable to the original LCD-2 in warmth so chances are what you're hearing is the motherboard audio circuit's distortion pattern. You're near the limit of the output. On top of that the LCD-XC has ery low impedance, so it's less that the Mojo is "clinical," but the motherboard now has a low damping factor that boosts the low end, making it sound "richer."

Switching to a cheap tube amp isn't exactly the best course of action either. Your LCD-XC and actually all Audezees have fairly low impedance. Pure tube amps at the low end of the price bracket are all OTL - output transformerless - design, which means they deliver more power at 300ohms than at 32ohms. LCD-XC is even closer to 32ohms than the rest of the LCD line. Chances are you won't get more power, at best maybe higher gain.

Your alternative would be a hybrid amp with a tube preamp stage with a warm tube in it, or get a transformer coupled tube amp. The latter is considerably more expensive than OTL amps though - cheapest I know apart from some possibly dubious amps on eBay would be the WooAudio WA6 at $700. I'd suggest just getting an LCD-2C than EQ-ing the XC using equipment that shouldn't be used for drastic EQ changes, but I'm guessing you need the closed cups.

Yeah, I do need the closed cups in my work environment. Plus I really love these headphones. It's hard to believe I wouldn't see big improvements with a warmer amp, admittedly partially because I read quite a few posts on here before making my purchase and saw some pretty mixed responses about the Mojo and LCD-XC's together. I just kinda figured since I'd never had a DAC/amp at all before that it would sound amazing to me. And it does, but there's something missing on the low end and it gets to me.

Thank you for the detailed response, definitely gives me something to think about.

 

[Oscar-HiFi]

If you are just looking for something to use whilst stationary at a desk (so no portable use required) then look into the Burson Audio Play, you can roll the op-amps to get a warmer or colder sound and it has tons of power to drive planar headphones.

As @ProtegeManiac said, most OTL tube amps are far from ideal with planars, planars like lots and current on tap, and are usually low impedance. OTL amps favour more voltage are higher impedances hence why they work well with 300-600 Ohm dynamic headphones best.

 

[ZeeMox]

If you are just looking for something to use whilst stationary at a desk (so no portable use required) then look into the Burson Audio Play, you can roll the op-amps to get a warmer or colder sound and it has tons of power to drive planar headphones.

As @ProtegeManiac said, most OTL tube amps are far from ideal with planars, planars like lots and current on tap, and are usually low impedance. OTL amps favour more voltage are higher impedances hence why they work well with 300-600 Ohm dynamic headphones best.

The Play looks interesting. I'm not really familiar with op-amps and would have to do some reading to understand what I'd be getting into there, but I after reading @ProtegeManiac's suggestions I started pondering the Project Ember as it is a solid-state output tube amp (no op-amp support there). Perhaps paired with an El-DAC or something. The idea of getting to roll tubes until I get a sound that works for me is pretty appealing.

How does rolling op-amps compare with rolling tubes as far as impact on final sound quality?

 

[Oscar-HiFi]

The Play looks interesting. I'm not really familiar with op-amps and would have to do some reading to understand what I'd be getting into there, but I after reading @ProtegeManiac's suggestions I started pondering the Project Ember as it is a solid-state output tube amp (no op-amp support there). Perhaps paired with an El-DAC or something. The idea of getting to roll tubes until I get a sound that works for me is pretty appealing.

How does rolling op-amps compare with rolling tubes as far as impact on final sound quality?

Rolling op-amps can have quite a subtle but noticeable difference, the difference between certain tubes can be bigger. The Play is just an excellent all in one unit.

 

[Me x3]

If you want a warm sounding DAC check Schiit Modi Multibit and Bifrost Multibit
When it comes to amplification, most OTL tube amps won't pair well with your Audezes.
Check Violectric's solistate offerings as they are known for their slightly warm character.

If you a warm sounding portable setup (that can also work as a desktop USB DAC/AMP) you can check the FiiO X7 Mark II with AM2A amplification module.
I'm using AM3A, but AM2A will give you the warmer and smoother sound you might prefer.

 

[ZeeMox]

If you want a warm sounding DAC check Schiit Modi Multibit and Bifrost Multibit
When it comes to amplification, most OTL tube amps won't pair well with your Audezes.
Check Violectric's solistate offerings as they are known for their slightly warm character.

If you a warm sounding portable setup (that can also work as a desktop USB DAC/AMP) you can check the FiiO X7 Mark II with AM2A amplification module.
I'm using AM3A, but AM2A will give you the warmer and smoother sound you might prefer.

The Violectrics are above my price range for an amp alone. I'm leaning toward Modi Multibit with an Ember 2, seems likely to provide pretty good bang for buck.

Edit: Actually, after some reading in the LCD-XC threads, seems like Ember isn't likely to be a good match. After reading that thread till my head was spinning I'm torn between the HiFi-M8, Micro iDSD Black Label, and Marantz HD-DAC1. The former two have features to boost the low and and the Marantz is just a generally warm amp that seems to pair favorably with LCD-X and XC.

Too many options, honestly. I'm legitimately stressed about this crap.

 

[ZeeMox]

Rolling op-amps can have quite a subtle but noticeable difference, the difference between certain tubes can be bigger. The Play is just an excellent all in one unit.

Looks like the Play comes with several different options for stock op-amps at significantly different prices. Any suggestions for something on the warmer side?

 

[easily_amused]

The Violectrics are above my price range for an amp alone. I'm leaning toward Modi Multibit with an Ember 2, seems likely to provide pretty good bang for buck.

Edit: Actually, after some reading in the LCD-XC threads, seems like Ember isn't likely to be a good match. After reading that thread till my head was spinning I'm torn between the HiFi-M8, Micro iDSD Black Label, and Marantz HD-DAC1. The former two have features to boost the low and and the Marantz is just a generally warm amp that seems to pair favorably with LCD-X and XC.

Too many options, honestly. I'm legitimately stressed about this ****.

The micro iDSD black label gets mentioned a lot. It’s a quality product that pairs with many sets of cans from all reports.

 

[Oscar-HiFi]

Looks like the Play comes with several different options for stock op-amps at significantly different prices. Any suggestions for something on the warmer side?

I would personally go for the V5i version, or the V6 Classic

 

[Redcarmoose]

These threads always have me remembering the good-old days, when I was just starting.

 

[BunnyNamedCraig]

Now mine is just filled with audio receipts and no greenbacks!!

 

[ZeeMox]

^lol.

Yes, I see things getting out of hand rather quickly. But, once you experience pure harmonic bliss, there's really no choice in the matter of pursuing its reproduction...

 

[BunnyNamedCraig]

I love that statement @ZeeMox!! I totally feel you on that. My gf asked me a couple of days ago,"I just don't understand how you can be so obsessed with a hobby, I never found any hobby that made me that happy..." So she said that because she was tired of hearing about an amp lol. I tried to describe it to her in regards to a painter. There are different quality of paints out there that can be more vibrant, better texture on the paper, ect. Using a really great brush can help you paint better and show more on the canvas. All these things can add up to a painting that when someone sees it, they feel something. Once I got into the hobby and experienced the feeling that music can bring, it hooked me. Amps/DACS/headphones ect all get me closer to that. To me they are a vehicle to appreciating the music.

Soooo obviously soon after that day I picked her up flowers lol. Flowers BEFORE Valentines Day is a pro move gentlemen! Even if they did come from ALDI ! (Cheap grocery store around my parts)