williamgoody
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Not quite, no line out with the Zen.
iPod kicks butt
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MacDEF
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Quote:
I'd say it would be a nice experiment if I could get that line-out on the iPod
I've actually done a few comparisons, and the lack of a line-out is the biggest fault of the iPod. Trying to approximate a line-level output (and not being able to bypass the headphone circuitry) makes it not worthwhile for me to use an amp, so I rarely use one with it.
| Originally posted by kelly How about you: wanna take the pepsi challenge? Your home CDP vs the same track in wav format on your iPod? Both using the same headphone and amp of course. |
I'd say it would be a nice experiment if I could get that line-out on the iPod
I've actually done a few comparisons, and the lack of a line-out is the biggest fault of the iPod. Trying to approximate a line-level output (and not being able to bypass the headphone circuitry) makes it not worthwhile for me to use an amp, so I rarely use one with it.
kelly
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Macdef
I had always thought the iPod's output was controlled digitally and that setting the volume to max would *essentially* be the same as a line level output. I'm disappointed to hear that the headphone out is so flawed that you feel it a waste to use an amp with. I had already developed a fantasy in my head involving an iPod, that bag you posted about, the ER-4S and one of Kurt's META42s. Disappointing to know you're not using yours in this fashion.
I had always thought the iPod's output was controlled digitally and that setting the volume to max would *essentially* be the same as a line level output. I'm disappointed to hear that the headphone out is so flawed that you feel it a waste to use an amp with. I had already developed a fantasy in my head involving an iPod, that bag you posted about, the ER-4S and one of Kurt's META42s. Disappointing to know you're not using yours in this fashion.
MacDEF
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Kelly:
I'm not saying the headphone jack is that bad. I'm just saying that I'm too lazy to deal with an amp and volume control
Plus I like the size of the iPod by itself, so I don't want to spoil it by having to carry an amp. When I'm concerned about the best portable sound quality, I use my PCDP and META.
I'm not saying the headphone jack is that bad. I'm just saying that I'm too lazy to deal with an amp and volume control
kelly
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Macdef
So it's not possible that the iPod sounds better (even with mp3s perhaps) than the PCDP? I guess that's what I was driving at.
So it's not possible that the iPod sounds better (even with mp3s perhaps) than the PCDP? I guess that's what I was driving at.
williamgoody
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Kelly
Don't know if this helps you or not but I a/b'd My NJB3 with my D-EJ1001. Using the wave file "Mercy Street" by Peter Gabriel, using a cosmic.
With KSC 35's there was no difference. Both sounded wellbalanced. good low end, good midrange, etc. Again no difference.
With the HD 600/equinox setup, the sony was a bit more articulate and brighter, where the NJB3 sounded a touch like it was "underneath a slight layer". Still very good sounding, but IMO the sony sounded better.
Don't know if this helps you or not but I a/b'd My NJB3 with my D-EJ1001. Using the wave file "Mercy Street" by Peter Gabriel, using a cosmic.
With KSC 35's there was no difference. Both sounded wellbalanced. good low end, good midrange, etc. Again no difference.
With the HD 600/equinox setup, the sony was a bit more articulate and brighter, where the NJB3 sounded a touch like it was "underneath a slight layer". Still very good sounding, but IMO the sony sounded better.
kelly
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What is an NJB3?
Taphil
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Quote:
NJB3=Creative Nomad Jukebox 3, which has 2 dedicated line-outs.
Without the ability to bypass the iPod's headamp and have just a line-out, the iPod can't sound as good as a PCDP with line-out. But it's still very excellent. The NJB3+line-out does sound even better than the iPod, as expected from a line-out.
All my mp3's are encoded with LAME --alt-preset extreme setting (avg 256kbps). The --r3mix setting is outdated and was replaced by --alt-preset standard (128kbps low setting, 192kpbs high setting).
| Originally posted by kelly Macdef So it's not possible that the iPod sounds better (even with mp3s perhaps) than the PCDP? I guess that's what I was driving at. |
NJB3=Creative Nomad Jukebox 3, which has 2 dedicated line-outs.
Without the ability to bypass the iPod's headamp and have just a line-out, the iPod can't sound as good as a PCDP with line-out. But it's still very excellent. The NJB3+line-out does sound even better than the iPod, as expected from a line-out.
All my mp3's are encoded with LAME --alt-preset extreme setting (avg 256kbps). The --r3mix setting is outdated and was replaced by --alt-preset standard (128kbps low setting, 192kpbs high setting).
aos
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I think iPod sounds better than any PCDP that I've ever heard, line out or not, mp3 or not. Maybe I'm getting deaf, or maybe that Wolfson DAC/amp chip really hit the jackpot. In any case, I don't think sound quality would disqualify iPod from portable device contest. My Sony 725 did have worse sound from headphone out than from line out - it was clipping at higher volumes, at least - but iPod sounds very clean to me. I've listened on speakers and perhaps it's a bit thin compared to bigger devices. Maybe it's the time to whip out the 'ole oscilloscope and do some objective testing for a change...
maczrool
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What you could do to get digital out inside the iPod would be to buy a 20 GB model, remove one of the drives (there are two inside aren't there?) and install a small board based on a CS8405 or comparable TI model in place of the second drive. Use a low profile optical minijack and all should fit.
Stu
Stu
Skyline
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Quote:
No, it's a single drive, twin platters.
| Originally posted by maczrool What you could do to get digital out inside the iPod would be to buy a 20 GB model, remove one of the drives (there are two inside aren't there?) and install a small board based on a CS8405 or comparable TI model in place of the second drive. Use a low profile optical minijack and all should fit. Stu |
No, it's a single drive, twin platters.
jopi
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My two cents:
My iPod with Etys 4Ps sound significantly better on alt-preset-standard than my Panasonic 480 (both through headphone out).
My cmoy portable amp takes the iPod to the next level and I'm pretty sure that the little load of the cmoy makes a line-out for an iPod unneccesary since the volume control is digital. Still, I hardly carry the cmoy around like others pointed out before: I either go for convenience on the run or for best sound at home.
I was also very sceptical about mp3, but (and I may get stoned here) I prefer mp3s sound to the harsh sound of cheap CD players. It may not be Hi-Fi, but at least I don't get headaches with mp3s.
I also did some unscientific listening tests with wav, alt-preset-standard, alt-preset-extreme and alt-preset-insane. It was the 4th movement out of Mahler's 1st Symphonie and I couldn't here a damn difference among the formats so I decided to go with standard.
I've also owned a Rio 500 before and I could rank the Mahler tracks compressed at 128, 196 and 256, so I don't think I'm deaf yet.
At home I almost exclusively listen to the only uncompressed format out there (vinyl) and it doesn't really matter to me whether you compress audio and put it on CD or you go a little bit further for mp3s.
My iPod with Etys 4Ps sound significantly better on alt-preset-standard than my Panasonic 480 (both through headphone out).
My cmoy portable amp takes the iPod to the next level and I'm pretty sure that the little load of the cmoy makes a line-out for an iPod unneccesary since the volume control is digital. Still, I hardly carry the cmoy around like others pointed out before: I either go for convenience on the run or for best sound at home.
I was also very sceptical about mp3, but (and I may get stoned here) I prefer mp3s sound to the harsh sound of cheap CD players. It may not be Hi-Fi, but at least I don't get headaches with mp3s.
I also did some unscientific listening tests with wav, alt-preset-standard, alt-preset-extreme and alt-preset-insane. It was the 4th movement out of Mahler's 1st Symphonie and I couldn't here a damn difference among the formats so I decided to go with standard.
I've also owned a Rio 500 before and I could rank the Mahler tracks compressed at 128, 196 and 256, so I don't think I'm deaf yet.
At home I almost exclusively listen to the only uncompressed format out there (vinyl) and it doesn't really matter to me whether you compress audio and put it on CD or you go a little bit further for mp3s.
maczrool
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Quote:
So swap the 20 GB drive for a 10 GB.
Stu
| Originally posted by Skyline No, it's a single drive, twin platters. |
So swap the 20 GB drive for a 10 GB.
Stu
baker1369
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That's a really tricky process...they detail it over at ipoding.com in the forums.
austonia
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there is a competing product to the iPod - the Creative Nomad Zen that sounds excellent. about the same size but with a higher end output, claimed 96dB SNR. 20gb storage, upgradable to 60gb. runs 12 hours on 1 charge. plays MP3/WMA and WAV. however no line out, but the headphone jack has 100mW output capability. I rarely need my mini-amp except with BeyerDynamic brand headhpones. iPod looks nice, but limited in sound quality and upgrade options. People who have A/B them are most impressed with the Nomad's improved sound quality. I have been very happy with mine
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