iPhone 5 (and new Touch) has totally new dock connector - 'Lightning' - adapters available but no line-out

[bmichels]

May be the ultimate "ONE BOX ONLY" solution... for Android phone/tablet (or... iPhone 5 IF it's digital signal is not encripted ! Am I dreaming ?!) : 
 
Brand new product from Ray Samuel :  " The Intruder ":  sort of SR71B (fully ballanced" Amp)  WITH a DAC.

 
http://raysamuelsaudio.com/products/intruder
 
 

 
 

 
 
 
 
 
 

 
 

 
PS : .I start to consider using android rather than iPad/iPhone. I am being feed-up with the constraints of Apple like the encripted digital signal, syncro through iTune, no memory expansion...  With a 128 Go Card in an android phone or tablet, I can carry EVERYWHERE all my loseless files....   Has someone done this ?     
 
Imagine : a Galaxy3 + 128 Go card + The above Intruder....  

 

[Vibemerchant]

PS : .I start to consider using android rather than iPad/iPhone. I am being feed-up with the constraints of Apple like the encripted digital signal, syncro through iTune, no memory expansion...  With a 128 Go Card in an android phone or tablet, I can carry EVERYWHERE all my loseless files....   Has someone done this ?     

Imagine : a Galaxy3 + 128 Go card + The above Intruder....  

I ordered an iPhone 5, but I totally understand your feelings about Apple encrypting it's digital signal. What harm would it do to Apple if it made this signal abailable to everybody? For me at least, it would highten the phone's appeal.

 

[Vibemerchant]

All that is needed to be known is available to any MFi licensee but the problem is that a licensee is not at liberty to reveal any confidential information which is protected by the license.  

Nice to hear from someone with industry knowledge. Have these licenses been released yet for the iPhone 5? And do you expect it to become easier (or harder) for third party companies like yours to develop dac's and amps for iPhone 5?

 

[estreeter]

Quote:

It is somewhat sad to read all the speculation here about the Lightning connector and the capabilities of the adapter as so much of what has been written is simply wrong.  
 
All that is needed to be known is available to any MFi licensee but the problem is that a licensee is not at liberty to reveal any confidential information which is protected by the license.  I have wanted to 'jump in' at so many instances to correct what I am reading (both here and at many other sites), but I am not allowed to do so at this time.  So, my recommendation is to wait just a bit and all will be revealed.  This would eliminate much of the 'chatter' and would allow everyone to base their decisions upon fact, not 'wild' speculation.
 
Patience is a virtue,
 
Kevin Halverson
CTO
High Resolution Technologies, LLC

 
Thanks Kevin. I'm sure you can appreciate that chaos thrives in a vacuum - fine for Apple to lock you into non-disclosure, but it was inevitable that some speculation would follow. Its interesting that you seem to have a clear understanding of the changes yet Cypher Labs don't give the same impression - at least that is my interpretation of David's blog entry. All of this could have been minimized with a press release detailing the technical changes, but Apple is as marketing-driven as any corporation in 2012. I look forward to Engadget's teardown for a dissection of the silicon, and impressions from those who eventually get their hands on the phone and the much maligned adapter.  
 
Roll on October.  

 

[BattleBrat]

I just sold me refurbished iPod Touch 64gb 4th gen (I bought a new one, but the bluetooth developed an issue and the apple store gave me a refurbished one, left a bad taste in my mouth) I bought a Cowon Z2 32gb with the proceeds, Now I'm willing to tolerate the Z2 not having a LOD because I plan on using it with Ety ER4pt's and no amp (they work well together) but I'm not willing to tolerate TWO of my daps not having LODS that I can use. My Walkman Z (and soon F806) have wm port connectors, which have a true R-R+L-L+ line out. I CAN afford any external DAC offering I want (CLAS, Algo Solo, ETC) but I DONT want to carry a brick, especially considering the fact that my amp of choice is an L3, I am open to using a DAC offering with my Leckerton UHA-4, but it will have to be something slim. (I've had the arrow, NOT impressed SQ wise, the leckerton buries it, especially when I upgrade the OPAMP) SIGH
I am trying to build a small, pants pocketable rig, although when I will be doing a lot of traveling I won't be using a rig at all, just a dap and IEM's (ER4pt's w/ custom tips)  the Ipod touch 4g and the L3 were nicely sized and sounded great. Should I buy ANOTHER 4th gen iPod touch? The place that I bought my first one from has them for $30 off, and I have the money to buy it, or should I buy the 5th and pick up a used iphone 4s for maximum future proofness? (The 4s will live longer than the ipod touch 4g, you know I'm right) That and I know someone that will sell me their 4s...
PLEASE HELP! Otherwise I'm going all android (walkman, though I'm probably better off with the walkman SQwise...)

 

[audionewbi]

Quote:

I just sold me refurbished iPod Touch 64gb 4th gen (I bought a new one, but the bluetooth developed an issue and the apple store gave me a refurbished one, left a bad taste in my mouth) I bought a Cowon Z2 32gb with the proceeds, Now I'm willing to tolerate the Z2 not having a LOD because I plan on using it with Ety ER4pt's and no amp (they work well together) but I'm not willing to tolerate TWO of my daps not having LODS that I can use. My Walkman Z (and soon F806) have wm port connectors, which have a true R-R+L-L+ line out. I CAN afford any external DAC offering I want (CLAS, Algo Solo, ETC) but I DONT want to carry a brick, especially considering the fact that my amp of choice is an L3, I am open to using a DAC offering with my Leckerton UHA-4, but it will have to be something slim. (I've had the arrow, NOT impressed SQ wise, the leckerton buries it, especially when I upgrade the OPAMP) SIGH
I am trying to build a small, pants pocketable rig, although when I will be doing a lot of traveling I won't be using a rig at all, just a dap and IEM's (ER4pt's w/ custom tips)  the Ipod touch 4g and the L3 were nicely sized and sounded great. Should I buy ANOTHER 4th gen iPod touch? The place that I bought my first one from has them for $30 off, and I have the money to buy it, or should I buy the 5th and pick up a used iphone 4s for maximum future proofness? (The 4s will live longer than the ipod touch 4g, you know I'm right) That and I know someone that will sell me their 4s...
PLEASE HELP! Otherwise I'm going all android (walkman, though I'm probably better off with the walkman SQwise...)

Your only option is the new F series walkman. (I am assuming that colorfly and hm-901 are out of the question considering their size factor). There are other units like the Rocoo BA or rocoo V or even the C4 from colorfly which are slim but they have firmware issues (not really user friendly).
Install poweramp on the sony Z series or wait for the new firmware update and you can have flac support (poweramp gives you 24/96 flac support on sony). As I said the F series support flac natively however I am not sure about the resolution support. I also cannot comment on whether poweramp down samples the 24/96 flac to 16/44.1. It shouldnt as it has the required brain power to be able to handle such flac.
 
Walkman till now is still the best sounding non-exotic true portable DAP on the market. In my opinion it event competes with most of the exotic unit I have owned (like the hm-601 and hm-602, falls a little behind on the rocoo BA on upper region detail but  makes up for it on the bass and midrange detail over Rocoo BA). Having said that I havent owned a walkman in well over 5 years!
You may ask why than I dont own a walkman anymore, will if I could get my hands on a 32 GB (or even better 64 GB) walkman in Australia I would, the issue is I have to import it in and in doing so it will cost me more than what I want to pay for them. 

 

[BattleBrat]

hmmm thanks for the input, I have a friend who works for sony get em for a discount, lemmie know if you want one...

 

[customNuts]

Quote:

May be the ultimate "ONE BOX ONLY" solution... for Android phone/tablet (or... iPhone 5 IF it's digital signal is not encripted ! Am I dreaming ?!) : 
 
Brand new product from Ray Samuel :  " The Intruder ":  sort of SR71B (fully ballanced" Amp)  WITH a DAC.

 
http://raysamuelsaudio.com/products/intruder
 
 

 
 

 
 
 
 
 
 

 
 

 
PS : .I start to consider using android rather than iPad/iPhone. I am being feed-up with the constraints of Apple like the encripted digital signal, syncro through iTune, no memory expansion...  With a 128 Go Card in an android phone or tablet, I can carry EVERYWHERE all my loseless files....   Has someone done this ?     
 
Imagine : a Galaxy3 + 128 Go card + The above Intruder....  

Bingo! That's what I've been waiting for.
If the phone 5 does not have unlocked digital out, I will be changing phones as this is of far more use to me (with better sound quality options) than the line out.

 

[CoryGillmore]

I've been wondering answers to all these questions since the new iPhone was announced. I don't know why it took me so long to come here to head-fi and find out some real answers. Reading the comments on any other site makes me very angry as all it ever turns into is "iSheep" vs "Fandroids". I'd forgotten how informative and mature the head-fi community truly is. Thankful to be a part of it .

I put in my preorder for a 64GB iP5 through AT&T as soon as I could without going much thought to how it would act with all my accessories. For serious listening at home I still use my iPod classic with an SR-71a and MD Tributes. But in the car I use my iPhone and Spotify subscription. So I'm very happy to hear that I'll still be able to do that with the iPhone 5 long as I cough up 30 more bucks. Kinda lame but hey, what are you gonna do lol. I've been using my iPhone 4 with my MD Tributes and Spotify streaming at 320kbs for a while at work and it's awesome. I absolutely adore Spotify BTW. Eager to hear how the headphone out will sound on the iP5.

 

[estreeter]

Quote:

I've been wondering answers to all these questions since the new iPhone was announced. I don't know why it took me so long to come here to head-fi and find out some real answers. Reading the comments on any other site makes me very angry as all it ever turns into is "iSheep" vs "Fandroids". I'd forgotten how informative and mature the head-fi community truly is. Thankful to be a part of it

.
 

 
I think you will find that didn't happen overnight, and I admit some surprise that this thread didn't degenerate into the usual Apple bashing. Full marks to the moderators for steadily 'educating' the wayward. 

 

[antberg]

Quote:

 
I think you will find that didn't happen overnight, and I admit some surprise that this thread didn't degenerate into the usual Apple bashing. Full marks to the moderators for steadily 'educating' the wayward. 

Agree,surprised too.
Now let's start to bash Apple...

 

[eron]

Yes, I'm affected by the dock connector change. I've numerous Apple accessories which will have to be relegated, replaced, or be 'adaptorised' eventually. However, I'm excited by the new development because truthfully, a decent LOD + a decent portable amp still sucks compared to a good USB dac + the same amp. Digitising the output of the iPhone means we can finally 'easily' use it with a DAC/AMP setup. The CLAS etc seems more complicated and expensive in my inexperienced capacity. 
 
I'm patiently awaiting the official release of the CEntrance HIFI-M8. http://centrance.com/products/new/blog/
Yes, it will most likely work with iOS devices. I'm guessing only the Lightning ones.
As to why it doesn't work on Androids, see the reply below:
 
 

> It would be great if you can ensure that the device will be compatible with android devices like the Galaxy S3

This is a work in progress. What needs to happen, as you correctly point out, is Google needs to build digital audio functionality into Android and also ensure that device makers follow a particular standard in hardware. We are talking about bundling Android OS drivers for USB devices working in “device mode” (all standard USB DACs will be compatible) and/or supporting special hardware on the phone’s circuit board to allow for “host operation” (only some DACs will be compatible). The latter is much more involved, so probably not as likely to happen in the near future. The former should be relatively easy, if Google gets their act together.

The difference between iPhones and Android phones is that every iPhone is built on the same hardware, which is, naturally, tightly controlled by Apple. With Android phones, every phone has different hardware, which is is why Android compatibility is such a moving target.

 
 
It won't be cheap, but it will definitely be of quality. It will then spur other makers to release simpler, cheaper setups to suit different segments of the market.
 
So yes, I think the new lightning connector will allow better SQ than the previous connector.

 

[cactus_farmer]

Quote:

Bingo! That's what I've been waiting for.
If the phone 5 does not have unlocked digital out, I will be changing phones as this is of far more use to me (with better sound quality options) than the line out.

What!?
 
Do Android phones (like Galaxy S3) have a digital out?

 

[audionewbi]

Quote:

What!?
 
Do Android phones (like Galaxy S3) have a digital out?

Not all. 

 

[figgie]

Quote:

Not all. 

Actually
 
some phone support it.
 
the S3 as of 4.0.4 is kind of up in the air. It really depends on the company if they implemented it or not and the USB descriptors are valid.