[MPSchenck]

Hello Everybody - I'm new to the forum and new to hi-fi anything. I've been lurking around for a few days doing some research and trying to learn myself a thing or two.

Let me explain my situation. My wife works days this quarter and she goes to bed [read: sleep] at about 8:30p-9 every night. I just picked up a new TV for the bedroom, a Samsung LN32B650, that I hooked my PS3 up to (via Monster Cable HDMI 1000hd cable) so I get DVD upconvert, blu-ray, video games, internet, and I set up as a media server to watch all my downloaded TV shows, which is all very sweet right from the comfort of my king-sized bed. I don't usually turn the TV off until about 2a, but since she started days I have to keep turning the sound down until I really can't hear it anymore and end up turning it off. Ruining my late-night entertainment extravaganza. So I thought I would get some comfy headphones so I can keep watching long after she has drifted off in silence. The search for some good headphones brought me (which really kind of upsets me because now I want all kinds of expensive things, but I digress).

Here is what I think I need so far: Victor-JVC SU-DH1 Surround Sound Portable Headphone Amplifier w/ Victor-JVC AA-D1 AC Adapter for SU-DH1 ($169.80 shipped from bluetin.com), Monster Cable 400DFO 20 ft. Optical Audio Cable ($74.95 shipped from onecall.com), Toslink to Optical Mini Adapter & Cardas 1/4 to 1/8 Adapter ($35 shipped from headphone.com) + HEADPHONES???

So I have a couple of questions.
1) What could be a better set-up for watching TV, movies, and a few video games? Very little actual music. I briefly considered something like a HK AVR-154 due to the Dolby Headphone support (this is what I want?), but that seemed like over kill, and I don't know about it's ability to drive a good set of headphones. If you can save me some money please do.

2) What headphones should I get for this or a comparable set-up?

Guidelines:
1) I will not say money is no object, but I like quality things and I'm mostly willing to pay for them. I don't want to drop a mint though. If you can save me some money please do.

2)I need something in a headphone that is night going to let so much sound leak out that it disturbs my wife. Why else would I be doing this.

3) Comfort is king. I'll be wearing these somewhere in the neighborhood of 4-5 hours most nights and sweaty ears suck.

4) I live in SE Tennessee, about 20 miles north of Chattanooga. High end here, for most people, is Best Buy, so I don't exactly have any were I can go to try before I buy. Therefore, I will be relying on your advise and reviews of your suggestions to make my purchase.

If I left out a key piece of information just let me know what it is.

Thanks in advance!

 

[KONAKONA]

Hey cool someone lives near me.

In any case, the first and foremost thing is don't spend 75$ on a monster cable anything. If you just plan on watching TV then you probably don't want to look into an amp just yet (although you probably wouldn't be looking at an amp like that anyway).

So with that in mind you might just want to look into getting some headphones that would be the price of the stuff you were planning on getting. If you haven't used any of the kind of headphones people mention around here then it will be hard to get much from comments on sound quality. You should probably just look into stuff about sound quality and comfort for now. (After you get a set you can use that to find out what you like/dislike about certain sound qualities)

That being said, you should probably look into some closed headphones. Off the top of my head the beyerdynamic DT770 80 ohm, audio technica A700 and A900 (not to be confused with the AD700 and AD900) and sennheiser HD 280 come to mind.

 

[driftingbunnies]

I would suggest looking at the Shure 840's. There isn't too many impressions about them but for me i've had that DT770's and while they're good at isolating and everything, i felt like it could be a little better all around. they're about the same price anyway and for the people who were lucky enough to get them have nothing but good words about them, i would give them a try.

 

[paaj]

The headphone out of the TV is probably just crap. but then again, so is the sound of the Samsung itself. If you want something better I'd look for a simple amp, or better yet, somthing like the 0404USB/Compass that acts as a DAC and amp. Then you can connect your TV digitally. Don't spend too much on cables if you want to watch your money, those offer the least performance bonuses and should be considered last.

You could add the Denon D2000 and AKG K271/272 to the list of closed headphones Konakona mentioned. Using the search function for those should give you a good idea of the positive/negative sides of each.

 

[haloxt]

More length is bad for sq for optical cables, I wouldn't use more than 6 ft. if I was getting an expensive one, you should really just get a cheap plastic one with a mini-toslink connector on ebay if you want 20 ft. But IMO you should probably get headphones first and see if it is good enough for you. Anyone have advice on full-sized closed headphones that sound tolerable unamped?

 

[AmanGeorge]

The Shure SRH840 is out tomorrow and may also be a good bet - it is supposed to isolate better than Denons (which probably also means it will leak less sound).

 

[Ishcabible]

I'm suggesting the A series Audio Technicas. They're great for gaming and very comfy ime. They do make your ears a bit sweaty, actually every closed headphone I've tried regardless of type of padding made my ears sweat a bit. AKG K271s are really comfy with velour pads and don't make my ears sweat as much as the ATs.

And I 2nd the suggestion to not get Monster Cables. You'll get pretty close to the same quality from a Monoprice cable, but if you really want a nice optical cable, look elsewhere.

I have an AVR210 and never use the sound enhancements.

Some vintage receivers have good headphone outs, but I'm not the one to ask suggestions for since I don't have that much experience with a variety of them.

 

[JJDyn0mite]

I'm in a somewhat similar situation. My solution at first was PS3 --> RCA output-->RCA/miniplug adapter-->Fiio E5-->Sennheiser RS130 Wireless headset.
I wasn't too happy with the sound quality, even for just TV/movies. Mostly an issue with interference on the Senn's since they are wireless, I think.

Currently, I'm at PS3--> Optical output--> iBasso D1 dac/amp --> wired headphones (Denon D1001 (closed), Philips hp890 (open)). This is a decent setup, with much improved sound quality, and since the dac/amp is portable, I can keep the volume controls nearby for quick adjustments. I've used the Monoprice 20ft optical cable which I got for like $6 or so, and it's worked fine, not sure I'd be able to tell a difference between it and $70 cable.

Anyway, that's my solution for now. I considered the JVC dac/amp thing, but reviews weren't too impressive, and the iBasso was cheaper (about $110 used from the forums here.)

 

[MPSchenck]

Quote:

Originally Posted by KONAKONA /img/forum/go_quote.gif Hey cool someone lives near me.

Really, where abouts? I’m actually in Cleveland.

Quote:

Originally Posted by KONAKONA /img/forum/go_quote.gif In any case, the first and foremost thing is don't spend 75$ on a monster cable anything.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ishcabible /img/forum/go_quote.gif And I 2nd the suggestion to not get Monster Cables. You'll get pretty close to the same quality from a Monoprice cable, but if you really want a nice optical cable, look elsewhere.

Quote:

Originally Posted by paaj /img/forum/go_quote.gif Don't spend too much on cables if you want to watch your money, those offer the least performance bonuses and should be considered last.

I’m not too concerned with the cables right now. I can buy cheap now and upgrade later.

Quote:

Originally Posted by haloxt /img/forum/go_quote.gif More length is bad for sq for optical cables, I wouldn't use more than 6 ft. if I was getting an expensive one, you should really just get a cheap plastic one with a mini-toslink connector on ebay if you want 20 ft.

I’m going have to have a long cable somewhere. If I use any type of amp either it’s going to be way across the room next to the TV with the knob on it or it’s going to be next to the bed. I did some reading on toslink, and it suggests that the 5 and 10 meter length problems have been overcome recently with better cable. I understand that doesn't mean I wouldn't lose sound quality with a 20 ft cable though.

Quote:

Originally Posted by KONAKONA /img/forum/go_quote.gif If you just plan on watching TV then you probably don't want to look into an amp just yet (although you probably wouldn't be looking at an amp like that anyway).

I’m going to probably end up using an amp one way or another. I want[ed] the Victor-JVC SU-DH1 for the Dolby Headphone surround sound. I just don’t know how well it will power a good pair of headphones. To say “…just…watching tv…”, well, that just hurts. I have the DishNetwork DuoDVR ViP 722 pumping 720p & 1080i video and Dolby Digital 5.1 surround sound out. Surely that is worth a little more than "just watching tv"?

Quote:

Originally Posted by KONAKONA /img/forum/go_quote.gif …it will be hard to get much from comments on sound quality…

Yeah, the best I got right now is a Vaio widescreen laptop with blu-ray and Dolby Headphone to a pair of Bose in-ear headphones, which sounds pretty good, but I don’t not feel like that is a true example of “sound quality”.

I suppose that I could live without the Dolby Headphone feature, I will say that is what is what really started this little adventure. Like I mentioned above, my laptop does that with software (I’m mostly guessing) and I like it. It obviously doesn’t sound like really having a 5.1 surround sound system, but it sounds better than stereo.

Also, like I mentioned, I don’t know much about how this stuff works, so…if I have my PS3 and satellite receiver plugged into my TV via HDMI cables, which carry surround sound audio in addition to the video signal, does the optical out on the TV carry the same surround sound signal? If it does then I don’t understand the need for HDMI switching on some home theater receivers. If that is not how it works how the heck do you switch during an evening watching from, let’s say, Bladerunner Special Edition on blu-ray (PS3) to True Blood (satellite receiver) to NCIS s03e01 (PS3 as media server) without have to switch the optical cable back and forth from the PS3 to the receiver back to the PS3?

Quote:

Originally Posted by paaj /img/forum/go_quote.gif …better yet, something like the 0404USB/Compass that acts as a DAC and amp. Then you can connect your TV digitally.

From what I can tell the E-MU 0404 USB is basically an external sound card? If it is an external sound card, does it require software to work or will it function as a standalone unit?

Quote:

Originally Posted by JJDyn0mite /img/forum/go_quote.gif I considered the JVC dac/amp thing, but reviews weren't too impressive, and the iBasso was cheaper (about $110 used from the forums here.)

The JVC unit got me on all of this, I’ve looked at the reviews and honestly found more good than bad. A Google search produced these review results from the first page alone.

Those For...
digitaltrends.com
tweak3d.net
soundandvisionmag.com
head-fi.org

The Against...
pcmag.com

I couldn’t find much out about the iBasso D1 since it is no longer produced. I did however read up on the iBasso D10 Cobra, and it looks sweet for $275. The only thing I think I can find wrong with it is that it looks like it only recharges via USB, but I think that little issue could be solved with a very inexpensive mini USB wall charger. Should that be possible?


I’m working on a reply with headphone questions, but I need to do more research and it’s late.

 

[MPSchenck]

Quote:

Originally Posted by KONAKONA /img/forum/go_quote.gif Hey cool someone lives near me.

Really, where abouts? I’m actually in Cleveland.

Quote:

Originally Posted by KONAKONA /img/forum/go_quote.gif In any case, the first and foremost thing is don't spend 75$ on a monster cable anything.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ishcabible /img/forum/go_quote.gif And I 2nd the suggestion to not get Monster Cables. You'll get pretty close to the same quality from a Monoprice cable, but if you really want a nice optical cable, look elsewhere.

Quote:

Originally Posted by paaj /img/forum/go_quote.gif Don't spend too much on cables if you want to watch your money, those offer the least performance bonuses and should be considered last.

I’m not too concerned with the cables right now. I can buy cheap now and upgrade later.

Quote:

Originally Posted by haloxt /img/forum/go_quote.gif More length is bad for sq for optical cables, I wouldn't use more than 6 ft. if I was getting an expensive one, you should really just get a cheap plastic one with a mini-toslink connector on ebay if you want 20 ft.

I’m going have to have a long cable somewhere. If I use any type of amp either it’s going to be way across the room next to the TV with the knob on it or it’s going to be next to the bed. I did some reading on toslink, and the article seems to indicate that the 5 and 10 meter max length issues have been corrected due to recent improvements in the cables. I do understand that does mean I wouldn’t lose some sound quality though, but it might suggest a case for buying the more expensive cable over the cheap stuff.
Quote:

Originally Posted by KONAKONA /img/forum/go_quote.gif If you just plan on watching TV then you probably don't want to look into an amp just yet (although you probably wouldn't be looking at an amp like that anyway).

I’m going to probably end up using an amp one way or another. I want[ed] the Victor-JVC SU-DH1 for the Dolby Headphone surround sound. I just don’t know how well it will power a good pair of headphones. To say “…just…watching tv…”, well, that just hurts. I have the DishNetwork DuoDVR ViP 722 pumping 720p & 1080i video and Dolby Digital 5.1 surround sound out. Surely that is worth a little more than "just watching tv"?

Quote:

Originally Posted by KONAKONA /img/forum/go_quote.gif …it will be hard to get much from comments on sound quality…

Yeah, the best I got right now is a Vaio widescreen laptop with blu-ray and Dolby Headphone to a pair of Bose in-ear headphones, which sounds pretty good, but I don’t not feel like that is a true example of “sound quality”.

I suppose that I could live without the Dolby Headphone feature, I will say that is what is what really started this little adventure. Like I mentioned above, my laptop does that with software (I’m mostly guessing) and I like it. It obviously doesn’t sound like really having a 5.1 surround sound system, but it sounds better than stereo.

Also, like I mentioned, I don’t know much about how this stuff works, so…if I have my PS3 and satellite receiver plugged into my TV via HDMI cables, which carry surround sound audio in addition to the video signal, does the optical out on the TV carry the same surround sound signal? If it does then I don’t understand the need for HDMI switching on some home theater receivers. If that is not how it works how the heck do you switch during an evening watching from, let’s say, Bladerunner Special Edition on blu-ray (PS3) to True Blood (satellite receiver) to NCIS s03e01 (PS3 as media server) without have to switch the optical cable back and forth from the PS3 to the receiver back to the PS3?

Quote:

Originally Posted by paaj /img/forum/go_quote.gif …better yet, something like the 0404USB/Compass that acts as a DAC and amp. Then you can connect your TV digitally.

From what I can tell the E-MU 0404 USB is basically an external sound card? If it is an external sound card, does it require software to work or will it function as a standalone unit?

Quote:

Originally Posted by JJDyn0mite /img/forum/go_quote.gif I considered the JVC dac/amp thing, but reviews weren't too impressive, and the iBasso was cheaper (about $110 used from the forums here.)

The JVC unit got me on all of this, I’ve looked at the reviews and honestly found more good than bad. A Google search produced these review results from the first page alone.

Those For...
digitaltrends.com
tweak3d.net
soundandvisionmag.com
head-fi.org

The Against...
pcmag.com

I couldn’t find much out about the iBasso D1 since it is no longer produced. I did however read up on the iBasso D10 Cobra, and it looks sweet for $275. The only thing I think I can find wrong with it is that it looks like it only recharges via USB, but I think that little issue could be solved with a very inexpensive mini USB wall charger. Should that be possible?


I’m working on a reply with headphone questions, but I need to do more research and it’s late.

 

[MPSchenck]

Could somebody explain to me exactly what Impedance means in terms of headphones, please?

I've done some reading, but most "explanations" usually assume that the persons knows a little about what is being explained OR it's so technical me brain stops paying attention.

 

[KONAKONA]

Quote:

Originally Posted by MPSchenck /img/forum/go_quote.gif Really, where abouts? I’m actually in Cleveland.

I'm just a few miles west of knoxville myself.

Quote:

Originally Posted by MPSchenck /img/forum/go_quote.gif I’m not too concerned with the cables right now. I can buy cheap now and upgrade later.

Even then, promise us you wont buy any monster cables.

Quote:

Originally Posted by MPSchenck /img/forum/go_quote.gif I’m going have to have a long cable somewhere. If I use any type of amp either it’s going to be way across the room next to the TV with the knob on it or it’s going to be next to the bed. I did some reading on toslink, and the article seems to indicate that the 5 and 10 meter max length issues have been corrected due to recent improvements in the cables. I do understand that does mean I wouldn’t lose some sound quality though, but it might suggest a case for buying the more expensive cable over the cheap stuff.

No advice here, I'm no optical expert. Wait for one of them to pop on in.

Quote:

Originally Posted by MPSchenck /img/forum/go_quote.gif I’m going to probably end up using an amp one way or another. I want[ed] the Victor-JVC SU-DH1 for the Dolby Headphone surround sound. I just don’t know how well it will power a good pair of headphones. To say “…just…watching tv…”, well, that just hurts. I have the DishNetwork DuoDVR ViP 722 pumping 720p & 1080i video and Dolby Digital 5.1 surround sound out. Surely that is worth a little more than "just watching tv"?

Well even with a nice HD receiver and all, the audio signal is still compressed. Once you get used to uncompressed audio you just don't really go back. If you compare the audio stream of that receiver to say a CD (Or something more serious business like SACD, or a analog rig such as vinyl or reel to reel) there is not much comparison. I gotta say I love listening to stuff on CD over lossless files on the computer myself, although that might be a difference between my DAC and DVD player..... Ahem I just got off topic.

TL;DR: We love uncompressed audio.

(Oh, and chances are your headphones are only going to be using two channels as well, which means the 5.1 bit is useless. 5.1 headphones are junk, btw)

Quote:

Originally Posted by MPSchenck /img/forum/go_quote.gif Yeah, the best I got right now is a Vaio widescreen laptop with blu-ray and Dolby Headphone to a pair of Bose in-ear headphones, which sounds pretty good, but I don’t not feel like that is a true example of “sound quality”.

Hmm, you might want to look into a pair of portapros to replace that.

Quote:

Originally Posted by MPSchenck /img/forum/go_quote.gif I suppose that I could live without the Dolby Headphone feature, I will say that is what is what really started this little adventure. Like I mentioned above, my laptop does that with software (I’m mostly guessing) and I like it. It obviously doesn’t sound like really having a 5.1 surround sound system, but it sounds better than stereo.

Hmmm, you might end up looking into something like that realizer wazitcald that people are talking about. Again I'm no expurt at that stuff, wait for one to come in. I like my 2 channel music quite well....

Quote:

Originally Posted by MPSchenck /img/forum/go_quote.gif Also, like I mentioned, I don’t know much about how this stuff works, so…if I have my PS3 and satellite receiver plugged into my TV via HDMI cables, which carry surround sound audio in addition to the video signal, does the optical out on the TV carry the same surround sound signal? If it does then I don’t understand the need for HDMI switching on some home theater receivers. If that is not how it works how the heck do you switch during an evening watching from, let’s say, Bladerunner Special Edition on blu-ray (PS3) to True Blood (satellite receiver) to NCIS s03e01 (PS3 as media server) without have to switch the optical cable back and forth from the PS3 to the receiver back to the PS3?

Hmmm, see the third comment in my post.

Quote:

Originally Posted by MPSchenck /img/forum/go_quote.gif From what I can tell the E-MU 0404 USB is basically an external sound card? If it is an external sound card, does it require software to work or will it function as a standalone unit?

DAC = External sound card. In most cases, windows has all the drivers you need built in to the system, so it's just plug and play (Although you might need to change a few settings, nothing big though).

Quote:

Originally Posted by MPSchenck /img/forum/go_quote.gif The JVC unit got me on all of this, I’ve looked at the reviews and honestly found more good than bad. A Google search produced these review results from the first page alone. Those For... digitaltrends.com tweak3d.net soundandvisionmag.com head-fi.org The Against... pcmag.com I couldn’t find much out about the iBasso D1 since it is no longer produced. I did however read up on the iBasso D10 Cobra, and it looks sweet for $275. The only thing I think I can find wrong with it is that it looks like it only recharges via USB, but I think that little issue could be solved with a very inexpensive mini USB wall charger. Should that be possible?

I -think- it is. That's a big maybe though. Also, just note that those reviews aren't going to have the same absolute nit pick qualities as far as sound quality goes compared to a review by a experienced person on head-fi.

Quote:

Originally Posted by MPSchenck /img/forum/go_quote.gif I’m working on a reply with headphone questions, but I need to do more research and it’s late.

Quote:

Originally Posted by MPSchenck /img/forum/go_quote.gif Could somebody explain to me exactly what Impedance means in terms of headphones, please? I've done some reading, but most "explanations" usually assume that the persons knows a little about what is being explained OR it's so technical me brain stops paying attention.

It is basically the resistance of the headphone. Think of the speaker like your thumb at the end of a garden hose and the water as the electricity going though, the more you press down, the higher the resistance.

What it means to you and me is, the higher impedance headphones (The ones with more ohms) are harder to drive, I.E. they sound bad/quiet without some sort of amp. Sensitivity also works like this as well. Of course there are plenty of easy to drive (less ohms and more(?) sensitivity) headphones that still sound better with a nice amp (All grados, and KSC 75s IIRC) but there are not many hard to drive (high resistance, low(?) sensitivity) headphones that don't sound good without a powerful source (actually I don't know of any).

As far as sources go, mp3 players (ipods, cowons, sanzas ans the such) are considered 'weak' sources, along with most PC sound cards. Then with amps you have really small portables like the fiio e3 and e5 and the cmoy, then the slightly beefier ones like the D10, those fancy RSA amps and the lisa III (which shouldn't be called portable IMO), and then a few hundred tiers above that you have your standard tube and solid state amps. Desktop amps are much better at driving headphones than portables but have their set of drawbacks (a few off the top of my head are tube amps needing to be warmed up and cooled down, and of course not being able to move them around).

Hope that helped.

 

[MPSchenck]

Ok, I think I've narrowed it down to these 3...

Headphones Best Price
DENON AH-D2000 $215.00
AKG K271 MK II $170.00
Audio Technica A900 $235.00

The hot race for me is between the Denon and AKG.
The D2000 seem like it gets better sound reviews, but I have seen some comments about build quality.
The AKG gets good comfort reviews and it has an easily replaceable cable and comes with both types of pads, but doesn't seem to get great sound reviews.
The AT gets great comfort reviews and is pretty sweet looking, but I've seen build quality comments and mixed sound reviews.


"Torn like an old sweater."

Any comments or suggestions would be appreciated.

Is there a company that will do the Merkl mod and upgrade the cable on the D2000s?

 

[AtomikPi]

Quote:

Originally Posted by MPSchenck /img/forum/go_quote.gif Ok, I think I've narrowed it down to these 3... Headphones Best Price DENON AH-D2000 $215.00 AKG K271 MK II $170.00 Audio Technica A900 $235.00 [snip] Is there a company that will do the Merkl mod and upgrade the cable on the D2000s?

Of those three, I would go for the D2000, I think they're some of the best closed hp's in that price range and are not far off from the higher end denons. I have not heard the AKG's. I think denon build quality is OK and you shouldn't worry about it.
Lawton audio=markl, they do the markl mods. I wouldn't worry about the cable upgrade, but if you really feel the need, save yourself some money and get the d7000 cable. I also think you shouldn't dive in blindly to the markl mod because some do not like the decreased bass response (though better controlled) and the perceived higher amount of treble (because less bass creates more perceived treble).

Also, the denons do not isolate very well so you may be limited in volume.

 

[aristos_achaion]

Quote:

Originally Posted by MPSchenck /img/forum/go_quote.gif Ok, I think I've narrowed it down to these 3... Headphones Best Price DENON AH-D2000 $215.00 AKG K271 MK II $170.00 Audio Technica A900 $235.00 The hot race for me is between the Denon and AKG. The D2000 seem like it gets better sound reviews, but I have seen some comments about build quality. The AKG gets good comfort reviews and it has an easily replaceable cable and comes with both types of pads, but doesn't seem to get great sound reviews. The AT gets great comfort reviews and is pretty sweet looking, but I've seen build quality comments and mixed sound reviews. "Torn like an old sweater." Any comments or suggestions would be appreciated. Is there a company that will do the Merkl mod and upgrade the cable on the D2000s?

I wouldn't worry too much about so-so SQ reviews, since it's hard to make a sealed phone at a reasonable price that sounds as good as an open one. Notice all three of your "can"didates get middling SQ reviews. Also, the AKG is a studio phone...those tend to be neutral, analytical, an acquired taste, which probably accounts for "meh" SQ impressions. But there's a lot to love in neutral (some would say natural) sound, even if it's boring at first blush...with that, plus comfort and build, I'd say the AKGs are the clear winners of the three.