[sgdevil]

I am completely new to any sort of hi fi audio. All I really know is that I enjoy music, and I suspect that it may be worthwhile for me to invest in some better headphones. My headphones are some cheapo pair AKG HP40 (I think they were about $30 or less). Anyways, I'm looking to upgrade. Newbie questions first of course:

1) Besides the 10x price thing, how do stereo systems compare with headphones? As in, how does the top stereo match the top headphones. I've heard that headphones can match anything a stereo can produce except for the bass. Is there any truth in that statement?

2) Browsing the forum, I've heard amps mentioned when talking about headphones. Does this mean that plugging my headphones into my computer/stereo isn't a good idea? Sound quality would improve considerably if I ran it through a receiver?

3) I currently connect my headphones to the front of a Dell computer. I don't know if this connects to my sound card. Should I change that set up?

4) So I'll be using my headphones through my computer almost exclusively (does this affect the impedence/driving thing?). I listen to rock music. I mainly notice a lack in sound quality when listening to bands like Arcade Fire, Wilco, and The Dandy Warhols. If I were to describe what I dislike about what I hear... I want a bigger sound out of it. I like a full bass sound. My cymbols are too bright sounding. I feel like there isn't enough distinction between instruments (is this normal or am i going crazy?). I don't really need portability, and I'm willing to spend around $80-$130. Suggestions?

5) Since I'm gonna be trying out headphones with nothing other than your advice and my untrained ears, are there any tips yall have for comparing sound quality in headphones when I'm trying them out? I heard closing your eyes and pointing at instruments when listening to classical music is a good test?

6) I've heard that earbuds are worse for your ears than headphones. Any truth in that? cuz that never made sense to me. I ask because I use earbuds when I go out, just for the portability.

7) If any of yall wanna explain the Bose hatred, feel free to explain it to me. Though feel free to edit out this last qusetion if it's offensive to you

.

PS: if you any of you have a lot of free time, I'm sure a fair amount of people would appreciate newbie guides as I find them sorely lacking in all aspects of the hifi audio world. Sort of an exclusive club eh?

thanks in advance

 

[drarthurwells]

To answer all your questions: It all depends on your individual tastes in sound attributes.

There is much good material to explore here - go back in time on all the forums.

Most posts are worthless, so weed through to find the good stuff.

Read the long equipment reviews - most are very good.

Save your money - the more you read the more you will want to buy - but the better will be your purchases from having read.

 

[kramer5150]

1) Ive never heard the "top" stereo or a "top" headphone before so I cant really comment. IMHO a mid-level headphone (MS2 + Cmoy) or a mid-grade 2 chanel stereo sound better than mid-grade 5.1. for music listening. I have a Denon 5.1 receiver $900 boston surrounds/center and a $1100 triad Bronze sub and I often prefer my MS2 cans, especially for music listening. Thats just my preference.

2) A receiver with a well designed headphone circuit can sound just as good as a dedicated headphone amp. My uncle has a vintage Marantz and it sounds very good with his HD600. I like all my budget amps. my low impedence cans really need ample current to perform their best.

3) If it sounds good to you... just leave it alone. Of course I couldnt leave it at that. I run My T40 USB out into a Philips Aurilium amp the line out with either a govibe or G-moy (depends on my mood). Its a very good sounding budget rig ~$80.

4) For that range you can get a K240s-55, amp it with a used govibe or PA2 and be in serious business. IMHO you can go far with a KSC75 + govibe too for a stellar budget rig. Surf the FS forum here. There are some GREAT amp/can deals on the board right now. I just saw an A500 for $70

5) get out and listen as much as possible. take your time demo-ing, enjoy youre search thats half the fun IMHO. Bring a note pad and jot down notes as you listen. Listen to the SAME music on each headphone. Dont alter program material from headphone to headphone. I usually demo with some Tuck & Patti, ella Fitzgerald, Sinatra and Eric Johnson. Toss in some Dreamtheater and Iron Maiden for fun. Ignore spec sheets there mostly useless in the headphone realm. Everything on this forum is OPPINION... THERE are NO FACTS here. So take everything with a grain of salt, we all hear things differently.. IMHO.

6) I dont like earbuds. Havent heard one I liked yet. For me its canal phones when I need portable isolation and KSC75 / SR40 when I dont.

7) Huh.. Who here hates bose?

Use the search tool.. theres TONS of info on this forum.

Good Luck!!

 

[hekoman]

Welcome to Head-Fi, and sorry about you wallet.

1) I have honestly never heard any real high end stereo systems, but the speakers that I have aren't horrible by any means. I find it much easier and relaxing to listen to a decent set of speakers. The soundstaging usaully to me seems more real and open.

2)Amp can help almost any higher end headphone, but in your price range you really shouln't have to worry since most sub-$100 headphones don't need to be amped, but you might want to pick up a cheap portable amp such as a Cmoy (can be found from 30-50).

3)Well integrated sound on most computers usaully leaves a lot to be desired. You probably should invest in a better sound card for you computer. I would suggest the M-Audio Revolution 5.1 since they have a dedicated headphone amp and can drive headphones better than some cheaper sound card. And the Revo 5.1 sounds a heck of a lot better than any integrated sound can.

4)I would recommend the Alessandro MS-1 ($99). This is an awesome set of cans for rock and has nice bass impact but still has very clear highs. Also they are very easy to drive and sound very good out of almost any headphone out. The only problem with the MS-1's is that they have a very compressed soundstage and they have a very forward sound.

If you want something more portable, you should pick up a pair of Koss KSC-75's. And since they are only around $20 you should pick one a pair since they are so cheap. These are clip-on headphones, so some find these to be uncomfortable since it can put to much pressure on some parts fo your ears. But these headphones sound awesome for their price, they sound very similair to the Grado/Alessandro sound (very forward sound) but they are not as detailed.

5)Just listen and pick out what you enjoy, really that is what this is all about right, bring more enjoyment to your music listening

6)I have not heard or seen anything about earbuds being any worse for your ears, but I am sure that any headphones you try will be more comfortable than earbuds.

7)Most people feel that bose products are extremly overpriced. They use marketing to sell their headphones rather than how good they sound.

But then I have only been here for a few months, so what do I know.

 

[Cerebral_Mamba]

Quote:

1) Besides the 10x price thing, how do stereo systems compare with headphones? As in, how does the top stereo match the top headphones. I've heard that headphones can match anything a stereo can produce except for the bass. Is there any truth in that statement?

I don't see what is so hard to understand in this

Quote:

2) Browsing the forum, I've heard amps mentioned when talking about headphones. Does this mean that plugging my headphones into my computer/stereo isn't a good idea? Sound quality would improve considerably if I ran it through a receiver?

Some cans (headphones) like the higher end Senns have 300ohms while Grados have 32ohm. Generally all the cheapos available off the shelf are all 32ohm ones. The higher the impedance, the more difficult it gets to drive it, hence the need of an headphone amp.

Inaddition, even the low impedance cans like grados will benefit from an Amp. I can't say if the improvement will be drastic, but if you ever start using an Amp, it will be difficult to go back someday and listen to music without it.

Headroom Bithead/Total bithead is a good amp with built in DAC (Digital to Analog Converter) for the computer. Also, if you use a laptop, i would highly recommend Echo Indigo IO/DJ.

Quote:

3) I currently connect my headphones to the front of a Dell computer. I don't know if this connects to my sound card. Should I change that set up?

All audio (except system beeps) that come out of your comp is from the Sound Card. The only thing you can do is to change the Sound Card or get a DAC and AMP like the Bithead I mentioned above.

Quote:

4) So I'll be using my headphones through my computer almost exclusively (does this affect the impedence/driving thing?).

If you buy cans that have more than 32ohm impedance, you may have issues with loudness and sound quality.

Quote:

I don't really need portability, and I'm willing to spend around $80-$130. Suggestions?

For you budget and since you listen to Rock, i would HIGHLY recommend Alessandro MS-1 or Grado SR125. If you can increase your budget to $200 or if you are willing to buy a used can, then the Grado SR225 will surely leave you

for a long time.

Quote:

5) Since I'm gonna be trying out headphones with nothing other than your advice and my untrained ears, are there any tips yall have for comparing sound quality in headphones when I'm trying them out? I heard closing your eyes and pointing at instruments when listening to classical music is a good test?

This test works well for me:
1. Firstly, Close your eyes while listening to music.

2. Put a song that has many instruments playing simultaneously and try to figure out-
-- diffrentiate exactly what instruments are playing
-- in which ear and at what pitch level they are playing?
-- how audible the soft ones like bells and chimes in the background are?
-- How defined, spacial and NATURAL sounding the Bass is?
-- How the overall experience is?

Different cans may need different setups (source + amp) to perform well.

Quote:

7) If any of yall wanna explain the Bose hatred, feel free to explain it to me. Though feel free to edit out this last qusetion if it's offensive to you .

Just to quote some one else in this forum "No Highs, No Lows, Must be Bose"
http://www6.head-fi.org/forums/showthread.php?t=127609

 

[hugz]

Quote:

Originally Posted by sgdevil 1) Besides the 10x price thing, how do stereo systems compare with headphones? As in, how does the top stereo match the top headphones. I've heard that headphones can match anything a stereo can produce except for the bass. Is there any truth in that statement?

I prefer my relatively cheap headphones to my somewhat expensive speaker setup. headphones are fine at producing bass, except for the kind of bass that only a subwoofer can handle. of course, a good subwoofer will add a few grand to the cost of your speaker setup, so it's barely a fair comparison in my mind. Headphones aren't as good at soundstage (kinda like, making it feel as though the instruments exist in a 3d area around you) as speakers (from what i've heard- taking into account i only own grados), but headphones do okay at this still.

Quote:

Originally Posted by sgdevil 2) Browsing the forum, I've heard amps mentioned when talking about headphones. Does this mean that plugging my headphones into my computer/stereo isn't a good idea? Sound quality would improve considerably if I ran it through a receiver?

Your computer/stereo is what we call a "source", although it also has a small inbuilt amp. In simple terms, a source is what turns the recorded data into actual sound (cd player, record player, sound card, walkman, etc), and the amp is the device that makes this sound loud enough to be listened to. This isn't strictly correct but hopefully you get the idea. many sources have little built in amps that are okay for producing loud enough sound, but non good for producing good quality sound.

The need for a dedicated amp depends largely on the type of headphones you use. for example, easy to drive phones like mine will be okay playing right out of my mp3 player, but i assume that hard to drive phones like sennheisers would certainly need a dedicated amp to sound worth listening to.

That said, plugging into your computer/stereo may not be the best idea, because of the following question...

Quote:

Originally Posted by sgdevil 3) I currently connect my headphones to the front of a Dell computer. I don't know if this connects to my sound card. Should I change that set up?

Your soundcard (your source) is probably crap, and large sound quality gains will be acheived by upgrading this. I have found that, with my headphones, i acheived much larger sound quality gains by upgrading from my soundblaster to a AU$30 DIY dac, then i have had using various amps.

Quote:

Originally Posted by sgdevil 4) So I'll be using my headphones through my computer almost exclusively (does this affect the impedence/driving thing?). I listen to rock music. I mainly notice a lack in sound quality when listening to bands like Arcade Fire, Wilco, and The Dandy Warhols. If I were to describe what I dislike about what I hear... I want a bigger sound out of it. I like a full bass sound. My cymbols are too bright sounding. I feel like there isn't enough distinction between instruments (is this normal or am i going crazy?). I don't really need portability, and I'm willing to spend around $80-$130. Suggestions?

Take the following with a grain of salt, but um.. alesandro ms1? I've never heard them but grados/alessandros tend to be clear sounding with full bass (although not boomy bass if this is what you want). They may be too bright for you though if the symbols are already too bright for you. They should help improve the instrument seperation too, but i'd think you'd need a better source to get that sounding good

Quote:

Originally Posted by sgdevil 5) Since I'm gonna be trying out headphones with nothing other than your advice and my untrained ears, are there any tips yall have for comparing sound quality in headphones when I'm trying them out? I heard closing your eyes and pointing at instruments when listening to classical music is a good test?

If it sounds good, it sounds good.

Quote:

Originally Posted by sgdevil 6) I've heard that earbuds are worse for your ears than headphones. Any truth in that? cuz that never made sense to me. I ask because I use earbuds when I go out, just for the portability.

not to my knowledge

Quote:

Originally Posted by sgdevil 7) If any of yall wanna explain the Bose hatred, feel free to explain it to me. Though feel free to edit out this last qusetion if it's offensive to you .

Far overpriced for the sound quality. They sell due to nothing except hype from inexperienced people. Imagine if honda sold their civic for $100,000 and you had to put up with rice boys saying "hOnDa CiViC Iz TeH bEsT cAr EvArZZZ yO!!1 VTEC POWAR!!" all day, even when you know damn well that for 100 grand you could buy MUCH better cars, simply because the rice boys have never driven anything else

 

[Andrea]

Quote:

Originally Posted by sgdevil I'm new

So, hail to you!

"welcome to head-fi etc. etc. etc."

 

[akwok]

Quote:

Originally Posted by hugz Far overpriced for the sound quality. They sell due to nothing except hype from inexperienced people. Imagine if honda sold their civic for $100,000 and you had to put up with rice boys saying "hOnDa CiViC Iz TeH bEsT cAr EvArZZZ yO!!1 VTEC POWAR!!" all day, even when you know damn well that for 100 grand you could buy MUCH better cars, simply because the rice boys have never driven anything else

Best. Analogy. Ever.

 

[grawk]

Since no one else has said it:

Sorry about your wallet. Figure out what you like and can afford, then run away screaming.

But before you go, check out the for sale forums...

 

[japa]

Quote:

Originally Posted by sgdevil 1)I've heard that headphones can match anything a stereo can produce except for the bass. Is there any truth in that statement?

I'd say anything except the feeling of bass pounding your body. Certainly headphones can produce the bass-sound, but not the feeling on your body when played with high enough volume. Other thing missing is the wider sound stage. But I'm happy having headphones that sounds as good, if not better than my friend's loudspeakers. Oh, and I don't have to worry about room acustics or neighbours.

Quote:

Originally Posted by sgdevil 2) Browsing the forum, I've heard amps mentioned when talking about headphones. Does this mean that plugging my headphones into my computer/stereo isn't a good idea?

Don't let this amp speak scare you. You buy a good headphone, it sounds good even without an amp. Just that with amp, it sounds even better. For example, there was a thread about beyerdynamic 880 and it needing an amp. I have played those without amp with my portable and been perfectly satisfied with the sound. Best that I've heard till that point. Now I have Senn HD-650, playing from my portable. Best that I've heard from headphones and comparable to Gradient Revolutions in terms of sound. I do have ordered an amp, just to find out myself if it really helps, if it's really worth the money. But again, don't decide not to buy good set of headphones just because you don't have an amp.

Quote:

Originally Posted by sgdevil 4) So I'll be using my headphones through my computer almost exclusively

Check out the computers as source forum. I would also suggest getting a decend sound card to your computer. I doubt the integrated sound circuit is that good. COmputers don't sell to masses with their sound quality.


Welcome to head-fi and sorry for your wallet.

 

[ken36]

Enjoy.