I think I want Ultrasones: But Which Model?
Jun 26, 2008 at 4:03 PM Thread Starter Post #1 of 28

cyanbomb

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When I first received my Ultrasone DJ1s 3 years ago, I fell in love with the detailed bass that plumbed the depths better than anything I had heard from my (somewhat limited) experience with headphones.

Since then, I've had the chance to listen to
DT990s (somehow didn't do it for me)
HD650 (I like!)
DT150 (Love them, and will get them for sure!)
Alessandro MS-1s (Bought them immediately)
Alessandro MS-2s (Not bad, but sibilance too much for me)
Grado 325i (Beautiful, but also too sibilant for me)
Many AKGs (Great, accurate sound in general)
... amongst several others.

The thing is, because I own so few headphones, and spend my money carefully, a headphone purchase is a big thing for me. I would like to buy a pair of really good Ultrasones, because I already know that the S-Logic doesn't put me off like it does some people.

I don't have the budget for Edition 9's, but am willing to try any other model.
I'm currently thinking of the Proline 750s, as I need a closed 'phone. But I'm wondering if I should be thinking about the HFI-780s or some other model instead? What are the differences?

Just to give you an idea of how I'd use it:
I listen to a very wide range of music; Jazz, Opera, Breakbeats, Bossa Nova, Rap-Core, Euro Dance, Flamenco Guitar.
Controlled bass, excellent timing, out-of-head soundstage, and not-too-piercing treble is important.

I'm also planning on buying a Graham Slee Solo amp, or a Rudistor.
I'm not afraid of recabling, and will most likely send whatever 'phone I choose for recabling. Any recommendations for cable mods?
smily_headphones1.gif


Thanks for any help you can provide!!
 
Jun 26, 2008 at 4:57 PM Post #2 of 28

Shahrose

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Quote:

Originally Posted by cyanbomb /img/forum/go_quote.gif
I don't have the budget for Edition 9's, but am willing to try any other model.
I'm currently thinking of the Proline 750s, as I need a closed 'phone. But I'm wondering if I should be thinking about the HFI-780s or some other model instead? What are the differences?



sensitivity to piercing treble? then go for the prolines, the hfi-780s have a sharper treble and more bass, as well as a smaller soundstage.
 
Jun 26, 2008 at 5:18 PM Post #3 of 28

CountChoculaBot

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When I had my ALO recable HFI-780 (vamp), I loved them. Visceral mids, plenty of deep bass. But they were very uncomfortable, clampy, and the treble hurt my ears like hell.

I got the D2000 since I really couldn't stand the bad attributes of the HFI-780. It was a hard decision, and ultimately I decided they were roughly equal in SQ, but the Denon's didn't have painful treble or discomfort.

Eventually, I got to longing for the Ultrasone sound again, and the Pro 750's were getting some praise. People were saying the treble was less harsh and it was more comfortable. So, I decided to give it a shot. When I got them, they felt cheap. That much plastic on a $400 MSRP phone? What? Then, I put them on. I decided they sounded like ****. They already had ~250 hours of burn in, and I gave them about 50 more. They still sounded bad. The highs were metallic, the mids were more recessed than I remember on the 780's, and I couldn't hear any of that visceralness in the vocals from the 780's. The bass was also less. Too analytical, made it hard to enjoy music.

Ultimately, I hated the 750's. Instead of being comparable to the D2000s as the HFI-780's were, I felt that the 750's were much worse compared to the D2000.

Please keep in mind not many people share my view that 780 > 750. It might've been just the recable on the 780 or something, but the 750's were just plainly on a lower tier compared to the 780 and D2000.
 
Jun 26, 2008 at 5:53 PM Post #4 of 28

ronnielee54

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I recently had a pair of HFI-780's. You will find after some research that they are a love/hate type of can. I myself kind of liked them and was even thinking about recabling them, which according to a lot of Headfiers, really improves them. But I decided to stick with my SR325i's, so I no longer needed the Ultrasones. Still find myself wondering how they would have sounded recabled.
 
Jun 26, 2008 at 6:12 PM Post #5 of 28

cyanbomb

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Thanks for the replies guys...
See, that's the thing that scares me about taking the plunge with the 750s/780s: They're so love/hate... to spend that much on something with so many mixed opinions... it's frankly a bit scary.

Sigh... what to do....
 
Jun 26, 2008 at 7:20 PM Post #6 of 28

Peter Pinna

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Quote:

Originally Posted by cyanbomb /img/forum/go_quote.gif
Thanks for the replies guys...
See, that's the thing that scares me about taking the plunge with the 750s/780s: They're so love/hate... to spend that much on something with so many mixed opinions... it's frankly a bit scary.

Sigh... what to do....



If you've ever read some of my posts, you probably already know that the Pro 750's are my favorite headphones of the ones I've heard. In this comment, I only wanted to tell you that in some situations when someone has stated that they didn't like the sound of the Pro 750's it was because they were not wearing them correctly. According to Ultrasone, there is a way to wear their headphones that is different from other headphones. This information (with which some disagree) is detailed in Dex Dexter's Manual about Ultrasone found in these forums. I have found this information to be correct.

There have been some negative comments about the Pro 750's in these forums and each and every time, after extended attempts to find whatever is the poster's mentioned problem in my own pair of 750's, I am left asking the question, "What in the heck are they talking about?" because the problem they site (whatever it was) absolutely does not exist in my Pro (Proline) 750's.

I'm not accusing anyone of anything but sometimes I have begun to wonder about the possibility of a hidden agenda on the part of certain posters when they write about certain specific faults in the Pro 750's that, from a great deal of personal experience with the Pro (Proline) 750's, I can attest, absolutely do not exist, IMO.
 
Jun 26, 2008 at 7:24 PM Post #7 of 28

FallenAngel

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The Proline 750 are not bad. Nice soundstage, nice detail, but they sound "weird". Not like most of my other headphones, especially in the bass. I recabled them in Kimber which softened them up a bit and added detail, but still they're definitely different. I would say go with these over the HFI-780 unless you really like overpowering amounts of uncontrolled bass. I'm sure they get better with a recable, but stock, 750 all the way.
 
Jun 26, 2008 at 8:35 PM Post #8 of 28

analogbox

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If you find MS-2i too sibilant then Ulrasone lines are not for you. Ultrasones are somewhat like Grados. They are aggressive and forward sounding mainly because of their extended highs. That's what makes guitar sound rawk. But if you mainly listen to Jazz and Vocal stuff, you're better off going for cans with sweet mids. Go for AKG or Sennheisers.
 
Jun 26, 2008 at 9:39 PM Post #9 of 28

Peter Pinna

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Quote:

Originally Posted by analogbox /img/forum/go_quote.gif
If you find MS-2i too sibilant then Ulrasone lines are not for you. Ultrasones are somewhat like Grados. They are aggressive and forward sounding mainly because of their extended highs. That's what makes guitar sound rawk. But if you mainly listen to Jazz and Vocal stuff, you're better off going for cans with sweet mids. Go for AKG or Sennheisers.


Analogbox,
In an attempt to give you the benefit of the doubt, I want to tell you that there must be something else wrong somewhere in your "audio chain" because consistently, I have never, I will repeat that, I have absolutely never found in my own pair of Proline 750's the faults that you write about that you find with your Proline (Pro) 750's. And, I have done some very extensive testing. One example is your complaint about sibilance. I tried every way I could think of to make the Proline 750's produce sibilance and they definitely did not ever produce sibilance.
In this post, you write "they are aggressive and forward sounding mainly because of their extended highs." Based on my extended experience with the Proline 750, I find this to be a completely inaccurate statement regarding the performance of the Pro 750's, IMO. IMO, there is absolutely no truth to it, whatsoever.
I'm not sure of your definition of the "word" "rawk" but if it means that any instrument (not just guitar) sounds bad playing via the Proline 750's, I also find this to be a highly untruthful statement.
The idea that the Proline 750's have "extended highs" is also completely inaccurate.
Really, Analogbox, have some tests run on your other components because, based on my experience with my Proline 750's, I find absolutely no validity in the faults you are finding with your Proline (Pro) 750's.
I suppose it is possible that you might have a pair of faulty Proline (Pro) 750's. But, to convey the negative opinions you have expressed about a pair of Proline (Pro) 750's which are in good repair has, with every single one of your negative comments, been the exact antithesis of accuracy, IMO.
 
Jun 26, 2008 at 9:59 PM Post #10 of 28

analogbox

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Peter Pinna /img/forum/go_quote.gif
Analogbox,
In an attempt to give you the benefit of the doubt, I want to tell you that there must be something else wrong somewhere in your "audio chain" because consistently, I have never, I will repeat that, I have absolutely never found in my own pair of Proline 750's the faults that you write about that you find with your Proline (Pro) 750's. And, I have done some very extensive testing. One example is your complaint about sibilance. I tried every way I could think of to make the Proline 750's produce sibilance and they definitely did not ever produce sibilance.
In this post, you write "they are aggressive and forward sounding mainly because of their extended highs." Based on my extended experience with the Proline 750, I find this to be a completely inaccurate statement regarding the performance of the Pro 750's, IMO. IMO, there is absolutely no truth to it, whatsoever.
I'm not sure of your definition of the "word" "rawk" but if it means that any instrument (not just guitar) sounds bad playing via the Proline 750's, I also find this to be a highly untruthful statement.
The idea that the Proline 750's have "extended highs" is also completely inaccurate.
Really, Analogbox, have some tests run on your other components because, based on my experience with my Proline 750's, I find absolutely no validity in the faults you are finding with your Proline (Pro) 750's.
I suppose it is possible that you might have a pair of faulty Proline (Pro) 750's. But, to convey the negative opinions you have expressed about a pair of Proline (Pro) 750's which are in good repair has, with every single one of your negative comments, been the exact antithesis of accuracy, IMO.



You completely misunderstood me. Nowhere in my sentence did I mention the treble extension is bad nor PL750 is bad nor any instruments on PL750 sounds bad. I don't know where you got that idea but I'm a fan of Ultrasones and extended high seems like a characteristic of ultrasone. I have two of them (well, I just sold one) and, by others impression on 780, majority mention harsh sibilant on their phones so I assumed it is common for ultrasone phones.

Everyone has different opinions about sonic differences. Just because you are a little more prone to harsh sibilant doesn't mean it will be the same for all other people so you shouldn't bash people for having different opinions. What I simply meant was that I did not find MS-2i being sibilant at all but since Ultrasones, at least my phones, have more extended treble than MS-2i, OP may not find Ultrasone phones enjoyable. I personally like brighter phones for rock music. (="rawk")

I'm sorry if I wasn't clear on my statements but maybe you can ask me to clarify first before assuming anything I said?
wink.gif


Edit:

Quote:

Originally Posted by Peter Pinna /img/forum/go_quote.gif
I suppose it is possible that you might have a pair of faulty Proline (Pro) 750's. But, to convey the negative opinions you have expressed about a pair of Proline (Pro) 750's which are in good repair has, with every single one of your negative comments, been the exact antithesis of accuracy, IMO.


Also, would you care to explain this part?
Because I've never bashed PL750 in any other posts other than posting about it's characteristic based on my opinion or compared to other phones. I personally really enjoyed my pair of PL750 and there is no reason why I'd do that. If I remember correctly, I think it wasn't long ago that you acquired your pair of PL750. Tell me, what makes your statement any more accurate than what you think I said?
 
Jun 26, 2008 at 10:29 PM Post #11 of 28

YtseJamer

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I have never heard the stock 780 but I can tell you that I have never heard any form of sibilance with my ALO-780, and it's coming from someone who is really sensible to this problem. (I had this problem in the past with the DT990 and the Grado 325i) Unfortunately, recabling these headphones seems to be a necessity but the end result is a fantastic pair of headphones. (Probably 90% of the Edition 9 !)
 
Jun 26, 2008 at 11:12 PM Post #12 of 28

analogbox

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Quote:

Originally Posted by pfillion /img/forum/go_quote.gif
I have never heard the stock 780 but I can tell that you that I have never heard any form of sibilance with my ALO-780, and it's coming from someone who is really sensible to this problem. (I had this problem in the past with the DT990 and the Grado 325i) Unfortunately, recabling these headphones seems to be a necessity but the end result is a fantastic pair of headphones. (Probably 90% of the Edition 9 !)


I had a choice between 780 and 580 and I eventually chose 580 because IMO it looks cooler.
biggrin.gif
But, I'm curious to try 780 too since I was pleasantly surprised by the performance 580 is putting out at such a low price range. I wonder how close 780 can get to sound like ED. 9 since many people are claiming that they can sound very close due to utilizing the same drivers.
 
Jun 26, 2008 at 11:26 PM Post #13 of 28

YtseJamer

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Quote:

Originally Posted by analogbox /img/forum/go_quote.gif
many people are claiming that they can sound very close due to utilizing the same drivers.


They don't have the same drivers but the position of the drivers is very similar on both phones.

For the price that I have paid for the ALO-780 Vampire ($475), it's a joke compared to what I paid for the Edition 9. Althought, I'm not sure that I would be able to live without the extra refinement and comfort that I have with the Edition 9.
rolleyes.gif
 
Jun 26, 2008 at 11:42 PM Post #14 of 28

analogbox

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Quote:

Originally Posted by pfillion /img/forum/go_quote.gif
They don't have the same drivers but the position of the drivers is very similar on both phones.

For the price that I have paid for the ALO-780 Vampire ($475), it's a joke compared to what I paid for the Edition 9. Althought, I'm not sure that I would be able to live without the extra refinement and comfort that I have with the Edition 9.
rolleyes.gif



My bad.
tongue.gif


Turns out it's the PL750 that share the same driver as ED. 9. I guess having different housing has a lot to do with sonic differences than the type of drivers. I do think ED. 9 is a little too much money for what it is.
 

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