[regal]

The squeezebox, the transporter, the new wadia ipod dock, I think really lose the main advantage of the computer as a transport. You see in my opinion the advantage of a computer is not the hyped (wrongly) low jitter pipe dream.

A computer can give you the tools of a mastering engineer. With VST and even high end plug-ins like OSSD/3D you can add compression in a select frequency range. You can taylor your own crossfeed. You can add reverb (ambience wet/dry.) You can reverse phase, L&R, adjust balance, equalize.
Almost all the tools that a studio has you can do now. And DSP's I know were shunned by audiophiles when they were hokey 8 bit algorithms. But now the VST's are top notch. You can literally turn a bad recording into a good one.

With the slim devices products you lose all these features. I know ethernet is superior with regards to jitter but my God you lose all functionality. Might as well use a cdp.

 

[brainsalad]

You may be right but you're preaching to the .0005% (if that many) of the population of computer users that understand what you are talking about. Being a father of 8 children, most of them married, and I have a plethora of nieces, nephews, cousins, and who knows what, and not one of them can rip a CD without ITunes doing it for them. Not one of them even know what the gain tag is on music files and can't tell you what 128kbps is compaired to 320kbps. My wife can't tell me where she saves her email to.

Remember, no one ever went bankrupt under estimating the intelligence and gullibility of people. How do you think Bose and Itunes got to be king of the hill?

 

[sejarzo]

A lot of us want to hear it as it was mastered in good to great recordings, and don't bother much with bad or marginal recordings.

I'd not say that typical processing can turn a bad recording into a good one, but rather that a judicious amount of processing can make an intolerable one listenable.

 

[sejarzo]

Quote:

Originally Posted by brainsalad /img/forum/go_quote.gif My wife can't tell me where she saves her email to.

You are so lucky.......I, or my daughter, must handle my wife's email for her.

No kidding.

 

[grawk]

I like audio engineering tools when it comes to mastering a recording, but certainly not every time I listen. If you want to tweak a recording for your preferences, do it once and save it.

The biggest advantage to computer as source is you don't have to get up every 20, 74, 80, or 400 minutes to change, and can access your library in a random or linear manner without having to touch your spinning discs.

 

[sejarzo]

Quote:

Originally Posted by grawk /img/forum/go_quote.gif The biggest advantage to computer as source is you don't have to get up every 20, 74, 80, or 400 minutes to change, and can access your library in a random or linear manner without having to touch your spinning discs.

x2.

OTOH, in my case it lends itself to that "audiophile nervosa" issue, where I think I hear something odd/new/different, so I play it back, then think of another cut that would also be like that one, so I listen to part of it, lather, rinse, repeat, etc. etc. and end up not enjoying it all as much as I should.

 

[brainsalad]

Quote:

Originally Posted by sejarzo /img/forum/go_quote.gif x2. OTOH, in my case it lends itself to that "audiophile nervosa" issue, where I think I hear something odd/new/different, so I play it back, then think of another cut that would also be like that one, so I listen to part of it, lather, rinse, repeat, etc. etc. and end up not enjoying it all as much as I should.

LOL. I'm with you brother.

 

[regal]

Quote:

Originally Posted by sejarzo /img/forum/go_quote.gif A lot of us want to hear it as it was mastered in good to great recordings, and don't bother much with bad or marginal recordings. I'd not say that typical processing can turn a bad recording into a good one, but rather that a judicious amount of processing can make an intolerable one listenable.

Not to single you out (I once thought the same way) but this is typical stone-age audiophile thought.
Its 2008.

I have a few terrabytes of 60's and 70's SBD's. Being soundboards some are excellent recordings but they are raw and never mastered. Some of the finest rock and jazz performances of all time are unreleased soundboards. The quality of some of these recordings are better than commercial multitracks (some a lot better.) They just need mastering.

I would master and save if I had the time but it is much more convenient to do it on the fly.

Also I find many commercial releases are mastered for speakers not headphones. A little crossfeed and reverb can do wonders. You really have no idea until you have heard how good these VST's are now days.

 

[Joeywhat]

The problem I see with this is that doing it on the fly means you have one set array of plugins and settings for all your music. So you might be listening to some older unmastered track, and the next track will be a full mastered, newer track that requires little to no processing. It's somewhat like using an EQ in your playback software. It may sound great with a certain genre you mostly listen to, but if something different comes up, that EQ no longer works and is detrimental to the sound. If I had the ambition to do it, I would certainly master songs one at a time using a good DAW program, then save the file.

I happen to like hearing the album as the engineer intended. I will rarely add EQ or any other effect myself. If I do, it's because I'm listening on a VERY inferior setup (like my car's stock speakers) and am adjusting for the horrendous frequency response.

 

[regal]

If you haven't tried a quality reverb VST with headphones you are in for a complete revelation. I truly believe that reverb DSP is the cure to 90% of headphone issues.

 

[sejarzo]

Quote:

Originally Posted by regal /img/forum/go_quote.gif You really have no idea until you have heard how good these VST's are now days.

Actually, I do......I have used a number of VST's via Foobar with the VST plug-in.

Sure, I listen to Beatles tunes with some crossfeed, but most of what I listen to is minimally miked, straight-up unprocessed classical/acoustical music. To me, it just doesn't need the embellishment--I've tried, and it cures some problems at the expense of creating others.

 

[trains are bad]

I'm OP on the headphone DSPs. I consider some form of crossfeed/headphone DSP nearly mandatory for headphone listening. It boggles me why cdp, dvdp, recievers etc. don't have headphone processing built-in. It should be considered a required part of providing a headphone jack, just as providing downmixing is a required part of providing stereo jacks on a surround reciever.

 

[b0dhi]

Quote:

Originally Posted by regal /img/forum/go_quote.gif If you haven't tried a quality reverb VST with headphones you are in for a complete revelation. I truly believe that reverb DSP is the cure to 90% of headphone issues.

I can't stand reverb. Even the reverb that comes from a headphone enclosure ruins the sound for me, which is why I prefer the soundstage of earbuds.

 

[dizzyorange]

Quote:

Originally Posted by regal /img/forum/go_quote.gif The squeezebox, the transporter, the new wadia ipod dock, I think really lose the main advantage of the computer as a transport. You see in my opinion the advantage of a computer is not the hyped (wrongly) low jitter pipe dream. A computer can give you the tools of a mastering engineer. With VST and even high end plug-ins like OSSD/3D you can add compression in a select frequency range. You can taylor your own crossfeed. You can add reverb (ambience wet/dry.) You can reverse phase, L&R, adjust balance, equalize. Almost all the tools that a studio has you can do now. And DSP's I know were shunned by audiophiles when they were hokey 8 bit algorithms. But now the VST's are top notch. You can literally turn a bad recording into a good one. With the slim devices products you lose all these features. I know ethernet is superior with regards to jitter but my God you lose all functionality. Might as well use a cdp.

If you release your "mastered" versions of those old soundboards you will be doing many a great favor. But personally I can't be bothered to master music at all. It's just one more thing to tweak that takes away from enjoying music.


And that comment on the earbuds is dead-on. There are times when I think nothing beats the amazing imaging ability of earbuds, not even full-size headphones or speakers.




B0dhi, is your name a Baldur's Gate reference?

 

[regal]

Quote:

Originally Posted by dizzyorange /img/forum/go_quote.gif If you release your "mastered" versions of those old soundboards you will be doing many a great favor. .

Its better to archive and share the raw boards because in 10 years the technology will be much better.